Is Latin really all that and a bag of chips?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m from a feeder and went to the Latin main campus open house. FWIW, the question was asked if Latin has many families coming from immersion charters (DCI feeders) and admin says no they don’t.

Thanks for this. I trimmed just to reduce text.

We actually know a few different LAMB families at Latin and they highly recommended it to us and I don't know any other feeder families that got an offier so that part isn't super telling to me.

We watched presentations from both schools and didn't get the blown away reaction you had but will visit in person, I hope, and will see.

I'm assuming you didn't even enter the lottery based on what you saw?

PP here, correct.

As to your statement about not knowing any other feeder families that got offers, you need to realize there are many families like us who did not even play the lottery for Latin so getting an offer is a moot point. You can’t get an offer if you don’t list it.

Lastly your anecdotal about knowing a few feeder families there does not prove many families from feeders go there. I don’t know percentages but this question was asked directly to leadership at the open house by another family and their answer was no.

OK. To be clear, we are in a learning phase and not looking for arguments just thoughts! I appreciate yours. From what I can tell ... each school has real pros and some cons. I'm sure the cognitive dissonance will hit after we make a choice and need to feel ok about it!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The problem with the DC PARCC Dashboard is that you are comparing all MS and HS students in schools such as BASIS and DCI to all HS students including HS students in selective schools such as Walls and Banneker (this doesn’t affect Latin since for some reason they provide separate scores for MS and HS) The PARCC scores of a 5th grader at BASIS or Latin, which are both 100% lottery schools, are not going to tell you much about the education at those schools since those kids had just enrolled. Moreover, it is absurd to compare such a 5th grader to a high school student at Walls and Banneker, who may well have come from BASIS or Latin. And you are also including 9th grade kids at, say, Walls and Banneker that are being tested just after they entered those schools. Again, that is not going to tell you much about the education at Walls and Banneker.

A better comparison is to look how kids did on the PARCC in 10th grade. This is after they have been at BASIS, DCI, and Latin for a while and after they have been at Walls and Banneker for at least a couple of years.

Here are the 4+ 10th grade PARCC scores for the schools above:

BASIS

ELA 87.5
Math 90.0

Walls

ELA 93.5
Math 56.0

Banneker

ELA 84.09
Math 36.0

Latin

ELA 71.91
Math <=10.0

DCI

ELA 45.26
Math suppressed [27.48 in 9th grade]

In short, BASIS is way ahead of other schools in math and Walls, BASIS, and Banneker are about the same for ELA.

Accordingly, if you have an academically inclined kid, you would probably pick BASIS over Latin and DCI for MS and if your kid went to BASIS you would be unlikely to switch in 9th grade to Walls or Banneker for academic reasons, particularly if you were focused on STEM.

This number freaks me out every time I see it. What's going on with Math instruction at Latin? How are they not getting their majority UMC students at least 4s? Does sending your kid there mean sacrificing a future that includes Math?

[Anonymous]

Math is the main reason we didn’t attempt the Latin lottery. Some families are totally ok with oh my kids dont like math. But we’re not of that mentality and think math is the path to many science, business, tech and engineering fields. Also the humanities at other schools is not as poor as the math at Latin. So not a worthwhile compromise for us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Math is the main reason we didn’t attempt the Latin lottery. Some families are totally ok with oh my kids dont like math. But we’re not of that mentality and think math is the path to many science, business, tech and engineering fields. Also the humanities at other schools is not as poor as the math at Latin. So not a worthwhile compromise for us.

Yeah, I got that feeling during the open house, when the director of "Numeracy" said that her main job is making kids less scared Math. That is not a school that is going to challenge kids who have an aptitude for math, and I also agree that it's a foundational skill that is necessary for many career paths. I know those of us with terrible IB middle and high schools are desperate for a path, but something is missing there. We put Basis ahead and matched... I have all kinds of reservations about Basis, but it's clear the students are learning.

[Anonymous]

I also think that math is one reason those lucky enough to be in DCI feeder schools should stick with DCI over Latin. Everyone obv has their own priorities but such an uneven balance at such early grades doesn’t attractive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I also think that math is one reason those lucky enough to be in DCI feeder schools should stick with DCI over Latin. Everyone obv has their own priorities but such an uneven balance at such early grades doesn’t attractive.

NP, BTW DCI has a great robotics club and the robotics lab is amazing and huge. Kids make their own robots from scratch which uses a ton of math. They have all sorts of great equipment including laser cutters, few 3D printers, benches, etc..

Also we love having actual bio and Chen labs to do experiments.

[Anonymous]

Latins math numbers do look better in middle school (in the 40s). I guess something happens... Maybe the math/science kids go elsewhere for high school?

[Anonymous]

My kid is at Cooper. Overall, very happy with the school, but it's a good fit for my kid, specifically. Some downsides: temporary building is far from ideal (but my kid kind of takes pride in surviving it), no math differentiation until 7th grade and no support to improve chances of differentiating into the higher level math (so we're doing it on our own). Science education has been somewhat mediocre (but I'm not paying very close attention). Fifth grade geography and sixth grade civics have been AMAZING. Teachers have been mostly wonderful, kid is engaged, learning new things, good field trips even in this post-COVID era (some schools have not been able to do that).

Posters here are right, we're not Type A parents, and our kid isn't academically advanced.

Thoughts on the commute: Some kids are more energetic than others, a long commute can wear some down, others are full of energy. Think about how the school commute might fit into the after-school activities.

For those choosing between DCI and Latin, it's really about which school will fit your kid best. If your kid needs personal attention, see if you can get a spot at Latin. If your kid thrives at a larger school, which will have more people, more activities, etc., then it may work best for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Latins math numbers do look better in middle school (in the 40s). I guess something happens... Maybe the math/science kids go elsewhere for high school?

If you read all the threads about 4.0 kids being locked out of application high schools in this lottery cycle, you'll realize that fewer kids like this will be leaving Latin in the coming years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid is at Cooper. Overall, very happy with the school, but it's a good fit for my kid, specifically. Some downsides: temporary building is far from ideal (but my kid kind of takes pride in surviving it), no math differentiation until 7th grade and no support to improve chances of differentiating into the higher level math (so we're doing it on our own). Science education has been somewhat mediocre (but I'm not paying very close attention). Fifth grade geography and sixth grade civics have been AMAZING. Teachers have been mostly wonderful, kid is engaged, learning new things, good field trips even in this post-COVID era (some schools have not been able to do that).

Posters here are right, we're not Type A parents, and our kid isn't academically advanced.

Thoughts on the commute: Some kids are more energetic than others, a long commute can wear some down, others are full of energy. Think about how the school commute might fit into the after-school activities.

For those choosing between DCI and Latin, it's really about which school will fit your kid best. If your kid needs personal attention, see if you can get a spot at Latin. If your kid thrives at a larger school, which will have more people, more activities, etc., then it may work best for them.

We are tired of trekking our kid everywhere in elementary and the attractiveness of a comprehensive school like DCI which is similar to suburban schools is that kid can stay after school and do whatever spurt, club, extracurriculars he wants and with friends.

This in itself is a huge game changer for ours and our kids quality of life.

[Anonymous]

Latin 2nd St family here from a JKLM- agree from what the above posters said-

1. We LOVE Latin. Scores be damned, I KNOW that my child is receiving a better education than at their DCPS elementary. Its night and day. The teachers are phenomenal, the strudent culture is super tight knit. They are learning more and more deeply. I like that, for example, the English teacher casts their writing up on the screen and has the full class critique each student. That is terrifying, but important. I love that they take geography and theatre in 5th. The public speaking. The baseline facts and memorization of countries, oceans, states -- I appreciate. The Academic Skills class is so critical. They learn how to study, take notes, stay organized. I had conferences with every teacher, and every teacher had incredibly thoughtful, thought provoking commentary on my child, what type of person they are, how they can improve as a student and human being. They KNOW your kid.

2. The actual care and detail of how they track students makes you feel very involved. Their schoology is updated every day, you can see every single grade for every single assignment, participation and more. We get an email every week from the AS teacher with EVERY assignment, upcoming quiz test and links to all study materials. As a busy parent, its amazing. And it seriously makes me question why my high-performing DCPS wasn't capable of the same.

3. Classical education just makes sense to me, personally. I like they are reading the great authors. I appreciate the idea of sitting around in Socratic circles going deep on topics. I think its really important that kids are held accountable for their behavior, presentation, and general demeanor to be good, kind human beings. Our DCPS was just so over the top DEI-y to the detriment of actual education. Latin is diverse by design, they have high expectations for everyone and lend the personalized support to get you there.

Downsides--as a WOTP family, we feel pretty removed from friends. There aren't a lot of parent events which is fine, but we find it challenging to get involved. But on the flip side, simply being asked for money once a year is a relief compared to the crazy PTA song and dance at our former DCPS elementary. That is our only down side, we adore it so far.

[Anonymous]

Just not impressed that the Latins and BASIS don't give a hoot about 5th or 6th grade language learning - no language until 7th at the Latins and 8th at BASIS. The science says that kids learn languages best younger, once they've got a good grounding in their mother tongue by at 9 or 10, or are fully bilingual as pre-teens via immersion. Also not impressed that DCI essentially doesn't challenge advanced kids before high school, other than on the most advanced language tracks. DC public middle schools just aren't that great.

[Anonymous]

Parent of a middle schooler at Latin and yes, the test score numbers aren't fantastic. But you wouldn't be on the D.C. board if that's the only thing you care about, right?

Latin has been a wonderful fit for our kid. Material is interesting, teachers are engaged, classes are small, school is diverse (and celebrates it!), and she has become much more independent - both with her studies and in general. She is happy + challenged. Some might say she is thriving (not sure why some on here think that's a bad word).

To us, small classes, engaged teachers, and thought-provoking academics are more important than standardized testing.

Side note on math: I think the fact that there isn't differentiation until 7th isn't a negative. Maybe b/c our kid isn't a math savant, but the idea that she can use the next year to improve and still potentially qualify for an honors class is a nice option. I went to above average schools and there wasn't math differentiation in elementary school (which included 5th and 6th at the time). Kids turned out just fine!

[Anonymous]

YES to all of this!

Anonymous wrote:Latin 2nd St family here from a JKLM- agree from what the above posters said-

1. We LOVE Latin. Scores be damned, I KNOW that my child is receiving a better education than at their DCPS elementary. Its night and day. The teachers are phenomenal, the strudent culture is super tight knit. They are learning more and more deeply. I like that, for example, the English teacher casts their writing up on the screen and has the full class critique each student. That is terrifying, but important. I love that they take geography and theatre in 5th. The public speaking. The baseline facts and memorization of countries, oceans, states -- I appreciate. The Academic Skills class is so critical. They learn how to study, take notes, stay organized. I had conferences with every teacher, and every teacher had incredibly thoughtful, thought provoking commentary on my child, what type of person they are, how they can improve as a student and human being. They KNOW your kid.

2. The actual care and detail of how they track students makes you feel very involved. Their schoology is updated every day, you can see every single grade for every single assignment, participation and more. We get an email every week from the AS teacher with EVERY assignment, upcoming quiz test and links to all study materials. As a busy parent, its amazing. And it seriously makes me question why my high-performing DCPS wasn't capable of the same.

3. Classical education just makes sense to me, personally. I like they are reading the great authors. I appreciate the idea of sitting around in Socratic circles going deep on topics. I think its really important that kids are held accountable for their behavior, presentation, and general demeanor to be good, kind human beings. Our DCPS was just so over the top DEI-y to the detriment of actual education. Latin is diverse by design, they have high expectations for everyone and lend the personalized support to get you there.

Downsides--as a WOTP family, we feel pretty removed from friends. There aren't a lot of parent events which is fine, but we find it challenging to get involved. But on the flip side, simply being asked for money once a year is a relief compared to the crazy PTA song and dance at our former DCPS elementary. That is our only down side, we adore it so far.

[Anonymous]

I don't understand this post. 5th and 6th graders at Latin take.... Latin. They can then decide if they want to pursue another language or continue with Latin. If you don't want your kid to learn Latin, fine. But you can't say that Latin doesn't give a hoot about language learning when kids are required to take an actual language class.

Anonymous wrote:Just not impressed that the Latins and BASIS don't give a hoot about 5th or 6th grade language learning - no language until 7th at the Latins and 8th at BASIS. The science says that kids learn languages best younger, once they've got a good grounding in their mother tongue by at 9 or 10, or are fully bilingual as pre-teens via immersion. Also not impressed that DCI essentially doesn't challenge advanced kids before high school, other than on the most advanced language tracks. DC public middle schools just aren't that great.