Teen Driver Intentionally Hits Officer on 270 - October 18

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Good point. Except it is not a good point.
https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2010/criminal-law/title-2/subtitle-2/2-209

That law is almost never applied to drivers who kill pedestrians, at least not in Montgomery County. In the last five years, as far as I know, only one driver who killed a pedestrian has been charged under this law, and he was drunk.

Citation needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Purposefully or not, driving at excessive speeds and causing someone's loss of life, or in this case two legs, should absolutely result in incarceration for a very long time.

Negligently turning right across a bike lane and causing someone's loss of life resulted in a $2000 fine, 150 hours of community services, and a suspended driver's license for no more than 6 months.

“Our deepest condolences to the family of Sarah Langenkamp for their immeasurable loss. Current laws in many ways do not give substantial protections to victims struck by vehicles. As legislative liaison for the Maryland State’s Attorneys’ Association, I would welcome any discussion and examine any changes proposed to the legislature. We share concerns about keeping our community members safe on the roads,” said State’s Attorney John McCarthy.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/maryland/driver-hit-killed-us-diplomat-riding-bike-sentenced-150-hours-community-service-fined-2000/65-a7188ab1-f8f1-4b47-9f55-0fc2f5ba1b57

The fact pattern here is totally different than the fact pattern for the 270 crash. Facts are kind of important for the law.

Who has said otherwise? It's rare for drivers who drive dangerously and injure or kill people to be charged with felonies or receive jail time, but that doesn't mean it never happens.

[Anonymous]

If you are disgusted by the ambiguity of the law, please write to your Maryland State Senator and State Delegates.

You can email them or send a written letter.

https://mgaleg.maryland.gov/mgawebsite/Members/District

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Good point. Except it is not a good point.
https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2010/criminal-law/title-2/subtitle-2/2-209

That law is almost never applied to drivers who kill pedestrians, at least not in Montgomery County. In the last five years, as far as I know, only one driver who killed a pedestrian has been charged under this law, and he was drunk.

Citation needed.

What kind of citation would satisfy you? The county state's attorney's office does not put out press releases when they decide not to charge a driver. Look up the dead pedestrians, see if you can find the drivers' names, then look in Maryland Case Search to see if they were charged, and if so, what with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

The speed doesn't matter??

I suppose it matters, in the sense that the faster the driver is driving, the more confident a prosecutor feels that they'll be able to prove recklessness and/or negligence. But there aren't any speed thresholds in Maryland statute like in Virginia statute.

Truly unbelievably lax laws in MD.

Just wait until you meet the judges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Good point. Except it is not a good point.
https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2010/criminal-law/title-2/subtitle-2/2-209

That law is almost never applied to drivers who kill pedestrians, at least not in Montgomery County. In the last five years, as far as I know, only one driver who killed a pedestrian has been charged under this law, and he was drunk.

Citation needed.

What kind of citation would satisfy you? The county state's attorney's office does not put out press releases when they decide not to charge a driver. Look up the dead pedestrians, see if you can find the drivers' names, then look in Maryland Case Search to see if they were charged, and if so, what with.

Thanks for confirming that you are just engaged in speculation and that you have no idea about any of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Purposefully or not, driving at excessive speeds and causing someone's loss of life, or in this case two legs, should absolutely result in incarceration for a very long time.

Negligently turning right across a bike lane and causing someone's loss of life resulted in a $2000 fine, 150 hours of community services, and a suspended driver's license for no more than 6 months.

“Our deepest condolences to the family of Sarah Langenkamp for their immeasurable loss. Current laws in many ways do not give substantial protections to victims struck by vehicles. As legislative liaison for the Maryland State’s Attorneys’ Association, I would welcome any discussion and examine any changes proposed to the legislature. We share concerns about keeping our community members safe on the roads,” said State’s Attorney John McCarthy.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/maryland/driver-hit-killed-us-diplomat-riding-bike-sentenced-150-hours-community-service-fined-2000/65-a7188ab1-f8f1-4b47-9f55-0fc2f5ba1b57

The fact pattern here is totally different than the fact pattern for the 270 crash. Facts are kind of important for the law.

Who has said otherwise? It's rare for drivers who drive dangerously and injure or kill people to be charged with felonies or receive jail time, but that doesn't mean it never happens.

There is a rule of law for a reason and thankfully we don’t allow cyclists emotions to dictate the administration of justice for traffic accidents.

The legal standard for vehicular manslaughter in Maryland is gross negligence. There were no elements of gross negligence evident in the facts about that accident.

It’s not that complicated.

[Anonymous]

Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Purposefully or not, driving at excessive speeds and causing someone's loss of life, or in this case two legs, should absolutely result in incarceration for a very long time.

Negligently turning right across a bike lane and causing someone's loss of life resulted in a $2000 fine, 150 hours of community services, and a suspended driver's license for no more than 6 months.

“Our deepest condolences to the family of Sarah Langenkamp for their immeasurable loss. Current laws in many ways do not give substantial protections to victims struck by vehicles. As legislative liaison for the Maryland State’s Attorneys’ Association, I would welcome any discussion and examine any changes proposed to the legislature. We share concerns about keeping our community members safe on the roads,” said State’s Attorney John McCarthy.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/maryland/driver-hit-killed-us-diplomat-riding-bike-sentenced-150-hours-community-service-fined-2000/65-a7188ab1-f8f1-4b47-9f55-0fc2f5ba1b57

The fact pattern here is totally different than the fact pattern for the 270 crash. Facts are kind of important for the law.

Who has said otherwise? It's rare for drivers who drive dangerously and injure or kill people to be charged with felonies or receive jail time, but that doesn't mean it never happens.

There is a rule of law for a reason and thankfully we don’t allow cyclists emotions to dictate the administration of justice for traffic accidents.

The legal standard for vehicular manslaughter in Maryland is gross negligence. There were no elements of gross negligence evident in the facts about that accident.

It’s not that complicated.

What an awful thing to say.

Even the county state's attorney says the laws need to be changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area deserves everything it gets based on the elected officials who are soft on crime and want to reduce any police involvement further. This criminal should have already been in jail based on the number of citations alone.

Since when have people been jailed for traffic citations? They're not jailable offenses.

DP. He's got a couple citations that are. Knowingly driving without insurance and fleeing and eluding can both carry jail time. Why he wasn't arrested on those is a question for the police who issued the citations, though.

I don't know the law in MD, but in Virginia reckless driving is a class 1 misdemeanor and can carry up to 12 months in jail. So at least the criminal code has the option. In Fairfax you used to get a day in jail for every mile over 90 but I don't know if that's still the case. The looks on people's faces when the judge told them that was priceless.

Not the case in Maryland. Reckless driving is not an incarcerable offense.

In Maryland, would excessive speed resulting in the amputation of this officer's legs likely result in incarceration?

If the driver hit the officer on purpose, or the driver was drunk, then yes. Otherwise, no.

I thought it was already established that he hit the officer on purpose.

No, it hasn't been established. The police have said it, and he's been charged with it, but those are not the same thing.

But the point is, if you're driving at an excessive speed, and you're not drunk, and you hit and kill someone not on purpose, then it's unlikely that you will wind up in jail.

Purposefully or not, driving at excessive speeds and causing someone's loss of life, or in this case two legs, should absolutely result in incarceration for a very long time.

Negligently turning right across a bike lane and causing someone's loss of life resulted in a $2000 fine, 150 hours of community services, and a suspended driver's license for no more than 6 months.

“Our deepest condolences to the family of Sarah Langenkamp for their immeasurable loss. Current laws in many ways do not give substantial protections to victims struck by vehicles. As legislative liaison for the Maryland State’s Attorneys’ Association, I would welcome any discussion and examine any changes proposed to the legislature. We share concerns about keeping our community members safe on the roads,” said State’s Attorney John McCarthy.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/maryland/driver-hit-killed-us-diplomat-riding-bike-sentenced-150-hours-community-service-fined-2000/65-a7188ab1-f8f1-4b47-9f55-0fc2f5ba1b57

The fact pattern here is totally different than the fact pattern for the 270 crash. Facts are kind of important for the law.

Who has said otherwise? It's rare for drivers who drive dangerously and injure or kill people to be charged with felonies or receive jail time, but that doesn't mean it never happens.

There is a rule of law for a reason and thankfully we don’t allow cyclists emotions to dictate the administration of justice for traffic accidents.

The legal standard for vehicular manslaughter in Maryland is gross negligence. There were no elements of gross negligence evident in the facts about that accident.

It’s not that complicated.

What an awful thing to say.

Even the county state's attorney says the laws need to be changed.

No he didn’t. He said he would “welcome discussion” to “examine changes”. He did not actually say that he thinks the law should be changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

Yes. This is how the law works. He was convicted of felony vehicular manslaughter due to his gross negligence and was given the maximum penalty, 10 years in prison. Most people serve only half of their prison terms, that’s common. However, he was not exactly just released and let go. He was released with supervision and if he violated the terms of that supervision, which can be quite onerous, he would be sent back to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. This is how our justice system works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

Yes. This is how the law works. He was convicted of felony vehicular manslaughter due to his gross negligence and was given the maximum penalty, 10 years in prison. Most people serve only half of their prison terms, that’s common. However, he was not exactly just released and let go. He was released with supervision and if he violated the terms of that supervision, which can be quite onerous, he would be sent back to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. This is how our justice system works.

With so many repeat offenders, our justice system is not working well for victims. Supervision is too lax.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

Yes. This is how the law works. He was convicted of felony vehicular manslaughter due to his gross negligence and was given the maximum penalty, 10 years in prison. Most people serve only half of their prison terms, that’s common. However, he was not exactly just released and let go. He was released with supervision and if he violated the terms of that supervision, which can be quite onerous, he would be sent back to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. This is how our justice system works.

With so many repeat offenders, our justice system is not working well for victims. Supervision is too lax.

There is no information that person who killed the cop was a repeat offender. So I’m not sure what you’re referring to. But a maximum sentence is a maximum sentence. The maximum criminal penalty for manslaughter in MD, whether with a gun or car, is 10 years. Not sure what else you want.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

Yes. This is how the law works. He was convicted of felony vehicular manslaughter due to his gross negligence and was given the maximum penalty, 10 years in prison. Most people serve only half of their prison terms, that’s common. However, he was not exactly just released and let go. He was released with supervision and if he violated the terms of that supervision, which can be quite onerous, he would be sent back to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. This is how our justice system works.

With so many repeat offenders, our justice system is not working well for victims. Supervision is too lax.

There is no information that person who killed the cop was a repeat offender. So I’m not sure what you’re referring to. But a maximum sentence is a maximum sentence. The maximum criminal penalty for manslaughter in MD, whether with a gun or car, is 10 years. Not sure what else you want.

What would you want if your spouse or child lost both legs due to someone speeding excessively? His victim would still have two legs if this guy had been given appropriate consequences earlier this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another point of reference - the drunk driver who hit and killed Officer Noah Leotta in 2015 was sentenced to 10 years in prison, but released after serving 4.5 years (plus credit for time served immediate after the accident = 5 years total).

https://wjla.com/news/local/drunk-driver-who-killed-officer-noah-leotta-set-to-be-freed-from-prison-five-years-early

Yes. This is how the law works. He was convicted of felony vehicular manslaughter due to his gross negligence and was given the maximum penalty, 10 years in prison. Most people serve only half of their prison terms, that’s common. However, he was not exactly just released and let go. He was released with supervision and if he violated the terms of that supervision, which can be quite onerous, he would be sent back to prison to serve the remainder of his sentence. This is how our justice system works.

He should have served his entire sentence. 5 years in prison for killing someone?!