The deflated grading is just exhausting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

Who cares…what about the 70% of Trinity kids (and countless other NYC and LA privates) graduating with an A- or higher GPA? Are you lumping all of those into the same group?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

There is another thread posting grade distributions of the top LA and NYC private schools showing that 70% of those classes are scoring A- or higher.

Nearly all the top 10 colleges award As to ~50% of the class.

At some point clinging to some rigid grading system appears a bit pointless.

Yes, the schools that follow strict grading (or deflated grading or whatever you want to call it) are getter fewer and fewer.

And as college application numbers continue to rise, it seems like they have less interest (and time) to understand that B's at NCS are the norm for excellent students, that a 3.5 GPA is quite strong, etc.

I would imagine it is probably the leading cause of student/family stress at these schools and can be fixed in 2 minutes. I honestly doubt any teachers would really care that much if told that you will curve every class and X% get an A, X% A-, X% B+, etc. Teacher does not have to change how they teach or how they score...just implement the curve and done.

Unfortunately I think this is happening because of egotistical teachers who think they are the cat’s meow.

Hypocrisy runs deep in these private schools. The very liberal families who will go to a march and protest about everything under the sun never put their $$ where their mouth is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

PP: You are describing my kid. How long ago was this? And what kind of college did they end up at?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We sent our last kid to an “easier” high school after our experiences with the grading and pressure at Sidwell/Cathedral schools. It has been so eye opening. Happier kid, learning tons, more free time, more sleep and vastly higher grades!

Yes, we are pulling our second kid for high school.
We have one at a Big3 who will end up top 20% in the class but stress level is off the charts, kid has been pretty darn miserable since junior year (despite having many friends, etc---the academic stress overrides everything for these kids). We are applying the next kid out (or hope to, pending acceptances in March) for 9th grade.

We've learned our lesson. We knew that these schools were rigorous but not this miserable (and we hadn't been through college counseling prior to now). We didn't choose this school for college results (our kid herself sought this out in 6th grade) but it's pretty depressing to have a kid who worked this hard, sacrificed having an actual high school experience and now may end up at a school she could have semi-easily achieved with high grades from public (think Wisconsin, etc----a fantastic school but I think most of us would agree is not sacrificing 4 years for.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We sent our last kid to an “easier” high school after our experiences with the grading and pressure at Sidwell/Cathedral schools. It has been so eye opening. Happier kid, learning tons, more free time, more sleep and vastly higher grades!

Yes, we are pulling our second kid for high school.
We have one at a Big3 who will end up top 20% in the class but stress level is off the charts, kid has been pretty darn miserable since junior year (despite having many friends, etc---the academic stress overrides everything for these kids). We are applying the next kid out (or hope to, pending acceptances in March) for 9th grade.

We've learned our lesson. We knew that these schools were rigorous but not this miserable (and we hadn't been through college counseling prior to now). We didn't choose this school for college results (our kid herself sought this out in 6th grade) but it's pretty depressing to have a kid who worked this hard, sacrificed having an actual high school experience and now may end up at a school she could have semi-easily achieved with high grades from public (think Wisconsin, etc----a fantastic school but I think most of us would agree is not sacrificing 4 years for.)

You won’t regret it. Curriculum and content is similar. They read almost the exact same books in English class as well. Surprised we have been able to reuse 75% of the books from English. I will admit the writing instruction is not at the same level as at the Big3, but is still quite good and writing lots of analytical essays and having regular essay tests in social science classes. Otherwise, classes are just as hard and teaching the same content. But this kid gets lots of As and an occasional Bs, rather than the other way around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

There is another thread posting grade distributions of the top LA and NYC private schools showing that 70% of those classes are scoring A- or higher.

Nearly all the top 10 colleges award As to ~50% of the class.

At some point clinging to some rigid grading system appears a bit pointless.

Yes, the schools that follow strict grading (or deflated grading or whatever you want to call it) are getter fewer and fewer.

And as college application numbers continue to rise, it seems like they have less interest (and time) to understand that B's at NCS are the norm for excellent students, that a 3.5 GPA is quite strong, etc.

I would imagine it is probably the leading cause of student/family stress at these schools and can be fixed in 2 minutes. I honestly doubt any teachers would really care that much if told that you will curve every class and X% get an A, X% A-, X% B+, etc. Teacher does not have to change how they teach or how they score...just implement the curve and done.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

There is another thread posting grade distributions of the top LA and NYC private schools showing that 70% of those classes are scoring A- or higher.

Nearly all the top 10 colleges award As to ~50% of the class.

At some point clinging to some rigid grading system appears a bit pointless.

Yes, the schools that follow strict grading (or deflated grading or whatever you want to call it) are getter fewer and fewer.

And as college application numbers continue to rise, it seems like they have less interest (and time) to understand that B's at NCS are the norm for excellent students, that a 3.5 GPA is quite strong, etc.

I would imagine it is probably the leading cause of student/family stress at these schools and can be fixed in 2 minutes. I honestly doubt any teachers would really care that much if told that you will curve every class and X% get an A, X% A-, X% B+, etc. Teacher does not have to change how they teach or how they score...just implement the curve and done.

And college admissions would sky rocket. At this point in time admissions are dipping further each year. NCS (for example) has rested on the laurels of it's crew team for way too long to garner Ivy admits. Well this year there aren't any (or maybe 1?) kids that will row in college at all. So expect a significant overall Ivy drop..probably to a tiny handful. Meanwhile Holton (which is just as rigorous but with far more reasonable grading) had arguably the best college results in the DMV last year. They basically got the entire grade into top 50 schools. NCS had far more mixed results and almost no one to top schools outside of the crew kids and those in the top 10% of the class (i.e. those with GPAs above 3.8ish). Lots of girls were shut out from second tier public universities (let alone the top tier). No-one at these large universities has the time to deliberate how much really goes into an NCS 3.3. They just click "no pile" and move on.

I’ve read many times on this forum that families do not choose private schools for college outcomes. Am I right?

DP: You are right, it isn't why they choose the school. But then, after years of seeing how hard they work, and how incredibly talented and bright they are, it can come as a shock in 11th grade that no one knows, no one cares, and all "they" see at the end of the day is 3.0 student. And worse, some kids then see themselves as well below average students, when they are anything but.

Grades exit in the context of a group of students in a given grade at a given school. GPAs are not standardized anywhere; not even within a school. SATs and APs used to be tools that put this in some context among groups of schools. If you are dropping those standardizations, you really need to drop GPAs too because, suddenly, the context is lost. Other countries use standard subject matter exams across all schools. I don't think that should be the sole criteria of admission, but when you want to compare the academic ability of a group of applicants, GPA is useless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

PP: You are describing my kid. How long ago was this? And what kind of college did they end up at?

Yuo mine as well plus add kids in top privates who take all honors and find out they are considered a worse college candidate than cohort who never took a honors class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

PP: You are describing my kid. How long ago was this? And what kind of college did they end up at?

Yuo mine as well plus add kids in top privates who take all honors and find out they are considered a worse college candidate than cohort who never took a honors class.

So who’s the smart one?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

PP: You are describing my kid. How long ago was this? And what kind of college did they end up at?

Yuo mine as well plus add kids in top privates who take all honors and find out they are considered a worse college candidate than cohort who never took a honors class.

So who’s the smart one?

Not me because we choose this school (kid was too young to decide schools). I am heartbroken for my child because they are so worried and they should be excited for senior year. I do think privates may finally hit the bubble of public schools have better college placement when you take into account the legacy stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is "why is grade inflation so rampant at most schools?"

My kid goes to a similar (boarding) school with no inflation and "real" grades. The grading here in the schools is a joke--just read all the parents posting about 10 APs and GPAs of 4.5 or whatever. Some schools have more than 50% of their kids with As. The bell curve is dead.

You read on the college forum here about public school kids with 10 APs and 4.5 GPAs but the kids have a low SAT or ACT. However, they insist there is no grade inflation at their public school, their kids are “bad test takers” and the SAT/ACT aren’t relevant, are racist, etc. How did they get a 4.5 if they are not good at tests? Retakes? In contrast, my Big3 kids had 3.2 and 3.4 GPAs and ACT of 33 and 34.

PP: You are describing my kid. How long ago was this? And what kind of college did they end up at?

Yuo mine as well plus add kids in top privates who take all honors and find out they are considered a worse college candidate than cohort who never took a honors class.

So who’s the smart one?

Not me because we choose this school (kid was too young to decide schools). I am heartbroken for my child because they are so worried and they should be excited for senior year. I do think privates may finally hit the bubble of public schools have better college placement when you take into account the legacy stuff.

Well, I think private schools have like. 20-25% acceptance rate, so I doubt they will ever hurt to fill their classes.

I don’t think there are any private schools that would not fill all their seats even if that resulted in 100% acceptance.

There are plenty of older families that sent their kids to Big3 schools back in the day and they describe it much more as just a neighborhood school where nearly everyone was accepted.

[Anonymous]

Parents of freshman need to talk to their schools on how this will be handled for college. You do not want to find this out junior or senior year. Consider dropping classes to make sure you have all As or college choices will not be what you thought you would have. You need to make sure you have close to straight As and this is very important if your school does not weight classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm convinced the point is: to learn to handle pressure. Intense pressure because this is how, this echelon of students, will advance in the adult world of work. Making hard choices, working at maximum efficiency, managing stress at the highest professional levels. I don't believe it's generally about the mastery of subject matter.

This. It's training for Wall Street, Medical Residency, the big Law firm, etc where the they basically work the crap out of you 24/7 when you are just out of school. Those that were trained to handle the crushing load and high stress in high school will have an advantage. Is it worth it in the end? That's a personal/family decision.

I am not sure you understand Wall Street training. The actual work as an IBanking analyst literally does not require more than an 8th grade education…but you need to know how to handle lots of verbal abuse, having your weekends canceled on Friday at 6pm, etc. In my experience, where you went to HS might be helpful in getting a job, but there is no correlation in terms of the kids that stick it out and the ones that quit after a year.

You missed the point (OP here but I wasn't the poster you're replying to). It's not the academics that the poster is saying prepares these kids for these careers. It's the grind. They know how to live with no time margin, little sleep, no mistakes, no retakes, no late work ever, etc.
It's the crappy part of these high schools that prepares them well for careers that also demand one's whole life.

Frankly I think these high school experiences suck and so do these jobs (having experience with one myself and not wishing it on my kids) but they are remarkably similar.

The HS experiences people are describing and jobs they could lead to sound terrible. We are all aware that you can make good money and be a smart person without tolerating stress and misery for years, right?

[Anonymous]

dripping to entry level classes. Take honors/AP only if your school weights class or you are sure your child will get an A.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, the good news, after 4 years, your kid will be incredibly well prepared for college and likely find college to be easy.

-parent of big3 kids who are in college

I am not sure how that is "good" news. Also, are you claiming Big3 kids are somehow able to just waltz through college senior-level STEM classes because of their Big3 training?

My class of '22 big 3 grad is killing it currently at their T15 school. They are not waltzing, no, but they work fairly hard and get results that are superior to most of their T15 peers, so far.

Their professors repeatedly tell them what an excellent writer and thinker they are, actually. One prof, who many DC parents would know, called my kid a 'standout.' I attribute a LOT of this to kid's HS experience, which was indeed rigorous. And excellent.

Are you now claiming your Big3 grad is superior to the boarding school and LA/NYC private school kids?

No idea. That wasn’t the prompt though. The above post responded to someone wondering if a deeply rigorous HS education at a (grade-deflating) big3 might make even a top college feel like a “waltz.” The answer for my kid is a qualified Yes. Perhaps their Andover alum college classmates feel exactly the same, who knows

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:dripping to entry level classes. Take honors/AP only if your school weights class or you are sure your child will get an A.

Then you won’t have rigor.