Starting to distrust doctors and find most to be smug

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

This, and the reason they don’t “prioritize lifestyle changes” is that 99.99% of their patients WON’T DO IT, or will do it for a short time, then fall back into their old comfortable patterns of behavior and choices.

I love how blithely you think telling a patient to do what you say is actually helpful. With all the information we have about things like semaglutide and how it quiets ever-present hunger signals in the body for people who would otherwise feel hungry all the time, to just give one example, and yet you arrogantly cling to the idea that a doctor telling someone “eat less and exercise more” is reasonable and counts as actionable medical advice. Ridiculous.

Okay, argue with the laws of thermodynamics. I’m sure you’ll win.

NP here. No one is arguing that low calorie diets don't result in weight loss. They’re saying that a low calorie diet without appetite suppression (never feeling sated) is unsustainable in the long run.

Agreed. I am one of the PPs who argued that doctors should push dietary changes, not drugs.

I for one am not arguing that doctors should tell people to eat less. I am arguing that they should tell people to eat differently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

This, and the reason they don’t “prioritize lifestyle changes” is that 99.99% of their patients WON’T DO IT, or will do it for a short time, then fall back into their old comfortable patterns of behavior and choices.

I love how blithely you think telling a patient to do what you say is actually helpful. With all the information we have about things like semaglutide and how it quiets ever-present hunger signals in the body for people who would otherwise feel hungry all the time, to just give one example, and yet you arrogantly cling to the idea that a doctor telling someone “eat less and exercise more” is reasonable and counts as actionable medical advice. Ridiculous.

Okay, argue with the laws of thermodynamics. I’m sure you’ll win.

NP here. No one is arguing that low calorie diets don't result in weight loss. They’re saying that a low calorie diet without appetite suppression (never feeling sated) is unsustainable in the long run.

When you body is carrying less fat though it will be less hungry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like some run a mill. Come in, take test X, be sure to hydrate, rest, eat well, goodbye that's it. Others it's an ideological thing. No matter what you have, hydrate, rest, eat well see ya. Try a doctor trained overseas from a different culture. Experience might be different.

Exactly! take this medicine and come back in 3 months for a follow up you do and again come back in 3 months again it's a total farce, a racket to keep you coming back, if you feel well why do you have to come back so soon? $$$$? To keep the machine running?

Totally agree. Monitoring a potential problem for thousands and thousands of dollars. It's a common scam and the whole system is broken. I hate going to any doctor.

No one if forcing you to go. You sound like someone who is very committed to engaging in a hostile antagonistic way.

Not PP, but you can't really choose not to go to the doctor. My PCP practice drops you and returns you to new patient status if you aren't seen in 3 years. And since we don't have universal care here in the US, we don't have universal medical records, and at some point, older patient records are destroyed. And we will never have universal care in this country until the majority of voters AND DOCTORS get on board with it. I appreciate the position by an earlier poster that doctors don't make their money from pharma companies. But the medical LOBBY and the pharmaceutical LOBBY are one and the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

What do you love about it? That your ego gets to feel “better, bigger and smarter” for knowing things you sense others don’t? Why not just share your knowledge then?

I always presumed it was largely procedure based. For example I heard a doctor/hospital gets paid out from insurance about $9000 more for a c section than a vaginal delivery. I’m not assuming the worst of doctors. I do believe they strive to provide best care but I also think as a whole the direction of our health care system is also driven by profit.

There are multiple reasons for why the US’s c section rate at 32%+ is the highest for any developed first world country. This is despite the fact that the WHO acknowledges that c section rates above 10% do not reflect an increase in maternal or fetal health. Our health care system is very very pro surgery/pro procedures. It is not proactive health or wellness based, and as other posters have commented, this is not what is taught in medical school. What is taught is symptom management focused. At that point the patients problems are just that - problematic.

This conversation is broader than just about doctors. Doctors absolutely help and save lives with their care and procedures, and as a country we do not emphasize enough the value of proactive integrative care that is largely outside the realm of a conventional doctors practice. As patients we also need to stop relying on doctors to be these God-like healers. There is more responsibility to be had on all fronts for the demise of our nations health.

Yes that c-section rate reason isn’t doctors. It’s lawyers.

Sure. Doctors and hospitals aren’t at all interested in the extra profits of astronomical C-section rates. Lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

What do you love about it? That your ego gets to feel “better, bigger and smarter” for knowing things you sense others don’t? Why not just share your knowledge then?

I always presumed it was largely procedure based. For example I heard a doctor/hospital gets paid out from insurance about $9000 more for a c section than a vaginal delivery. I’m not assuming the worst of doctors. I do believe they strive to provide best care but I also think as a whole the direction of our health care system is also driven by profit.

There are multiple reasons for why the US’s c section rate at 32%+ is the highest for any developed first world country. This is despite the fact that the WHO acknowledges that c section rates above 10% do not reflect an increase in maternal or fetal health. Our health care system is very very pro surgery/pro procedures. It is not proactive health or wellness based, and as other posters have commented, this is not what is taught in medical school. What is taught is symptom management focused. At that point the patients problems are just that - problematic.

This conversation is broader than just about doctors. Doctors absolutely help and save lives with their care and procedures, and as a country we do not emphasize enough the value of proactive integrative care that is largely outside the realm of a conventional doctors practice. As patients we also need to stop relying on doctors to be these God-like healers. There is more responsibility to be had on all fronts for the demise of our nations health.

Yes that c-section rate reason isn’t doctors. It’s lawyers.

Sure. Doctors and hospitals aren’t at all interested in the extra profits of astronomical C-section rates. Lol.

Different poster. Obs get sued right and left. That truly is the number 1 issue driving C sections.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like some run a mill. Come in, take test X, be sure to hydrate, rest, eat well, goodbye that's it. Others it's an ideological thing. No matter what you have, hydrate, rest, eat well see ya. Try a doctor trained overseas from a different culture. Experience might be different.

Exactly! take this medicine and come back in 3 months for a follow up you do and again come back in 3 months again it's a total farce, a racket to keep you coming back, if you feel well why do you have to come back so soon? $$$$? To keep the machine running?

Totally agree. Monitoring a potential problem for thousands and thousands of dollars. It's a common scam and the whole system is broken. I hate going to any doctor.

No one if forcing you to go. You sound like someone who is very committed to engaging in a hostile antagonistic way.

Not PP, but you can't really choose not to go to the doctor. My PCP practice drops you and returns you to new patient status if you aren't seen in 3 years. And since we don't have universal care here in the US, we don't have universal medical records, and at some point, older patient records are destroyed. And we will never have universal care in this country until the majority of voters AND DOCTORS get on board with it. I appreciate the position by an earlier poster that doctors don't make their money from pharma companies. But the medical LOBBY and the pharmaceutical LOBBY are one and the same.

No, they are absolutely not one and the same. You are operating on faulty information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

What do you love about it? That your ego gets to feel “better, bigger and smarter” for knowing things you sense others don’t? Why not just share your knowledge then?

I always presumed it was largely procedure based. For example I heard a doctor/hospital gets paid out from insurance about $9000 more for a c section than a vaginal delivery. I’m not assuming the worst of doctors. I do believe they strive to provide best care but I also think as a whole the direction of our health care system is also driven by profit.

There are multiple reasons for why the US’s c section rate at 32%+ is the highest for any developed first world country. This is despite the fact that the WHO acknowledges that c section rates above 10% do not reflect an increase in maternal or fetal health. Our health care system is very very pro surgery/pro procedures. It is not proactive health or wellness based, and as other posters have commented, this is not what is taught in medical school. What is taught is symptom management focused. At that point the patients problems are just that - problematic.

This conversation is broader than just about doctors. Doctors absolutely help and save lives with their care and procedures, and as a country we do not emphasize enough the value of proactive integrative care that is largely outside the realm of a conventional doctors practice. As patients we also need to stop relying on doctors to be these God-like healers. There is more responsibility to be had on all fronts for the demise of our nations health.

Yes that c-section rate reason isn’t doctors. It’s lawyers.

Sure. Doctors and hospitals aren’t at all interested in the extra profits of astronomical C-section rates. Lol.

Actually they would make vastly more money by paying lower malpractice insurance and defending fewer cases. Those costs savings are far greater than whatever incremental increase they would get by billing an unnecessary c-section. It is really pathetic how deeply entrenched you are in your victim mentality and conspiracy thinking. You are wrong and can’t accept it.

[Anonymous]

The rise in Concierge models of practice has not helped patients' views of doctors in this area.

They literally want us to pay a retainer to be their patients. We have to start paying them extra fees to send our prescriptions into pharmacies for example, or to get a call returned.

These are all things that physicians thought was a cost of doing medicine up to now (not OUR cost). They are running a business, and are trying to pass the cost of running that business on to us.

And please don't tell me how much time is taken up by dealing with insurance companies. My provider will have nothing to do with them. That is all on me. Even though I now have to pay HER an administrative fee.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The rise in Concierge models of practice has not helped patients' views of doctors in this area.

They literally want us to pay a retainer to be their patients. We have to start paying them extra fees to send our prescriptions into pharmacies for example, or to get a call returned.

These are all things that physicians thought was a cost of doing medicine up to now (not OUR cost). They are running a business, and are trying to pass the cost of running that business on to us.

And please don't tell me how much time is taken up by dealing with insurance companies. My provider will have nothing to do with them. That is all on me. Even though I now have to pay HER an administrative fee.

This is wealthy area where people demand top quality service and a ton of hand holding even over extraneous things. Just look at this thread. Entitled people who treat doctors like a retail sales purchase. None of these people bat an eye at paying their lawyer by the hour for every phonecall, email and photocopy. You may not have any idea how much time doctors spend working on patient care outside of direct face to face appointments but it is A LOT, even before dealing with insurance companies for prior authorizations (which takes even more time). Folks here are probably willing to pay for first class airline tickets and airport lounges and baggage fees and buying snacks on planes and TSA pre check—things that previously were included in the airfare. They are just accustomed to treating doctors like their personal servants, or their nanny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

I mean I *wish* that people would adhere to the dietary advice they receive, so many problems could be solved, improved or prevented if they did. But unfortunately people are weak and indulgent and confused and forgetful and also often poor, and they don’t, can’t, or won’t follow much of the dietary advice they receive. Also sometimes (particularly for cholesterol) diet just isn’t enough.

Sorry that your patients are human and not robots.

It is hard to sincerely help people if you see them as "weak, indulgent and confused."

Good doctors find ways to help the people who walk into their offices. It does not take much skill to keep perfect patients healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

I mean I *wish* that people would adhere to the dietary advice they receive, so many problems could be solved, improved or prevented if they did. But unfortunately people are weak and indulgent and confused and forgetful and also often poor, and they don’t, can’t, or won’t follow much of the dietary advice they receive. Also sometimes (particularly for cholesterol) diet just isn’t enough.

Sorry that your patients are human and not robots.

It is hard to sincerely help people if you see them as "weak, indulgent and confused."

Have you never heard the expression “you can lead a horse to water…”? There are literally thousands and thousands of doctors at every level of medicine devoting their whole lives and careers to trying to get people to make lifestyle changes that will keep them healthier. You sound very clueless about how medicine and public health really work, and the work that so many are engaged in.

Good doctors find ways to help the people who walk into their offices. It does not take much skill to keep perfect patients healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never cease to be amazed by the doctor hatred on this board. You’d rather entrust your health to someone who never went to medical school or trained in a residency. Just astonishing.

Interesting that this was your takeaway. You don't seem very bright (or empathetic).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rise in Concierge models of practice has not helped patients' views of doctors in this area.

They literally want us to pay a retainer to be their patients. We have to start paying them extra fees to send our prescriptions into pharmacies for example, or to get a call returned.

These are all things that physicians thought was a cost of doing medicine up to now (not OUR cost). They are running a business, and are trying to pass the cost of running that business on to us.

And please don't tell me how much time is taken up by dealing with insurance companies. My provider will have nothing to do with them. That is all on me. Even though I now have to pay HER an administrative fee.

This is wealthy area where people demand top quality service and a ton of hand holding even over extraneous things. Just look at this thread. Entitled people who treat doctors like a retail sales purchase. None of these people bat an eye at paying their lawyer by the hour for every phonecall, email and photocopy. You may not have any idea how much time doctors spend working on patient care outside of direct face to face appointments but it is A LOT, even before dealing with insurance companies for prior authorizations (which takes even more time). Folks here are probably willing to pay for first class airline tickets and airport lounges and baggage fees and buying snacks on planes and TSA pre check—things that previously were included in the airfare. They are just accustomed to treating doctors like their personal servants, or their nanny.

Stop blaming people who probably pay $1500 a month on healthcare premiums only to shell out hundreds more out of pocket. The insurance companies are the problem - not the patients. Good grief you are not understanding the point at all. Doctors dismissing patients because they are in a rush is wrong. Stop trying to justify it.

[Anonymous]

You seem to be the one blaming doctors and not insurance companies. It is the insurers driving all of this, and the management of health care companies and private equity buying private practices. It’s not doctors driving it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My main issue with doctors is not the arrogance, though that does exist. My issue is that many of them are quick to prescribe drugs, despite that many health issues could be combated with dietary changes. I would like for doctors to focus more on diet and less on drugs.

A question for the medical types on this board - I have heard that medical school includes a laughably small amount of instruction on diet. Is this true?

Yes, it’s true. American medicine is big business, and just like any other business the #1 priority has to be profits. No one here can dispute that. So why would they prioritize healthy lifestyle changes?

I love how you guys who have no idea how medicine works or how doctors actually make a living (spoiler: it’s not from prescriptions) are so confident in your wrong ideas.

This, and the reason they don’t “prioritize lifestyle changes” is that 99.99% of their patients WON’T DO IT, or will do it for a short time, then fall back into their old comfortable patterns of behavior and choices.

I love how blithely you think telling a patient to do what you say is actually helpful. With all the information we have about things like semaglutide and how it quiets ever-present hunger signals in the body for people who would otherwise feel hungry all the time, to just give one example, and yet you arrogantly cling to the idea that a doctor telling someone “eat less and exercise more” is reasonable and counts as actionable medical advice. Ridiculous.

Okay, argue with the laws of thermodynamics. I’m sure you’ll win.

NP here. No one is arguing that low calorie diets don't result in weight loss. They’re saying that a low calorie diet without appetite suppression (never feeling sated) is unsustainable in the long run.

When you body is carrying less fat though it will be less hungry.

Wow. Delusional.