What are the real facts about MCPS inequities?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This forum is obsessed with wealth. Kids at super wealthy schools - not in this DMV area - from my experience, often don't care about grades and are more concerned about partying and drugs.

It does not take money to study and get good grades. Have never understood this as an excuse for schools that perform poorly. Really it's the parents and the school environment and peers.

Every statistical study that looks at wealth and education disagrees with what you've written

and that is why americans are known around the world for their poor quality schools

America

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This forum is obsessed with wealth. Kids at super wealthy schools - not in this DMV area - from my experience, often don't care about grades and are more concerned about partying and drugs.

It does not take money to study and get good grades. Have never understood this as an excuse for schools that perform poorly. Really it's the parents and the school environment and peers.

Every statistical study that looks at wealth and education disagrees with what you've written

and that is why americans are known around the world for their poor quality schools

And at the same time have the best universities? It's as if there's something magical that happens once they graduate from HS! Hmmmm.....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anecdotally, some wealthier PTA’s give hundreds of dollars to teachers to purchase supplies, have grants for larger purchases, support teachers with food, messages, awards etc. The boosters make sure the sports teams and music programs have the best equipment and uniforms. I don’t think there is much difference in teaching overall, but anything outside of the classroom has a big difference between wealthy and poor schools. Over time staff end up gravitating to schools easier to commute to more than anything else. Poorer neighborhoods don’t have a lot of good overall housing/location for teachers. If a poor school is getting more money it is going to special programs and staffing that high most achieving students are not part of.

At our elementary the PTA built a planetarium and the parents run a space curriculum because the teachers by policy can't support it. It culminates at a space night where various physics and space clubs from the feeder middle and high schools come in set up while various space professionals come in and give presentations serviced by a line of food trucks. I was blown away by how cool it was for my kids and while definitely a perk that requires money many schools have unique charms like pools or theater programs.

What MCPS school has a pool?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anecdotally, some wealthier PTA’s give hundreds of dollars to teachers to purchase supplies, have grants for larger purchases, support teachers with food, messages, awards etc. The boosters make sure the sports teams and music programs have the best equipment and uniforms. I don’t think there is much difference in teaching overall, but anything outside of the classroom has a big difference between wealthy and poor schools. Over time staff end up gravitating to schools easier to commute to more than anything else. Poorer neighborhoods don’t have a lot of good overall housing/location for teachers. If a poor school is getting more money it is going to special programs and staffing that high most achieving students are not part of.

At our elementary the PTA built a planetarium and the parents run a space curriculum because the teachers by policy can't support it. It culminates at a space night where various physics and space clubs from the feeder middle and high schools come in set up while various space professionals come in and give presentations serviced by a line of food trucks. I was blown away by how cool it was for my kids and while definitely a perk that requires money many schools have unique charms like pools or theater programs.

What MCPS school has a pool?

Piney Branch Elementary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

It's too bad we can't deeper stats on this. I remember seeing the average SAT by cohort for these schools a while ago and saw that Blair was 60+ over any W for white students which only 25-30 were magnet students of 270 kids that took the SAT. One poster even crunched the numbers and found that even factoring for those students the average SAT was still 30 points above any W for the same cohort. Anyway, this makes me wonder how meaningful these conclusions really are because they're just looking at bulk averages without factoring for SES differences.

MoCo doesn't track cohort by race, it does so by income. Even then it didn't break out the magnet or Cap kids which are upper SES kids plucked from a larger area for being higher SES (for the most part) and good test takers. Then the op only compared the results to whole school rankings at the Ws.

Basically they took the small handful of good test takers shipped into Blair from other schools and compared them to entire schools which were still comparable. That cherry picking doesn't mean what you think it does. And where is your pride for Blair's low scores overall and middling graduations rates? Yes the test takers bussed in do well on tests end up doing well on tests, that is why they are bussed in there so they can raise Blair out of the cellar of the performance metrics, no one is disputing that. But using those few hundred kids out of over 3000 to compare to entire school populations is dumb. Whitman has the highest test scores in all of MoCo, most AP success and college reediness. Blair is towards the bottom of those lists for the county. I get it but you're rationalizing out of inadequacy and it makes Blair parents look desperate and silly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Staff salaries are the same from school to school. Facilities are obviously in a wide range of conditions across the county, and there are examples of run-down schools in wealthier areas and brand-new schools in less wealthy areas, and vice versa.

Sadly the academic programs in these schools widely differ as well which is what concerns to most parents.

One example of differing academics involves foreign language. My child at an ECC high school has a choice of taking Spanish and French, while some W schools offer half of dozen langauges, ranging from Spanish, French, Italian, Chinese, Latin, Farsi, Japanese, to American Sign Language.

I've seen comments on this forum saying there just isn't enough interest in the ECC and DCC to have a lot of languages, but I do wish that students at all schools had the opportunity to take any of the languages offered in MCPS, possibly through some sort of centralized program. This is true of some AP courses, as well.

What is ECC?

Likely a typo or auto-correct but guessing they meant DCC.

Nah, they said ECC and DCC. I'm guessing Northeast County Consortium. NCC.

There are two consortia: the DCC (Downcounty Consortium) and the NEC (Northeast Consortium).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

It's too bad we can't deeper stats on this. I remember seeing the average SAT by cohort for these schools a while ago and saw that Blair was 60+ over any W for white students which only 25-30 were magnet students of 270 kids that took the SAT. One poster even crunched the numbers and found that even factoring for those students the average SAT was still 30 points above any W for the same cohort. Anyway, this makes me wonder how meaningful these conclusions really are because they're just looking at bulk averages without factoring for SES differences.

MoCo doesn't track cohort by race, it does so by income. Even then it didn't break out the magnet or Cap kids which are upper SES kids plucked from a larger area for being higher SES (for the most part) and good test takers. Then the op only compared the results to whole school rankings at the Ws.

Basically they took the small handful of good test takers shipped into Blair from other schools and compared them to entire schools which were still comparable. That cherry picking doesn't mean what you think it does. And where is your pride for Blair's low scores overall and middling graduations rates? Yes the test takers bussed in do well on tests end up doing well on tests, that is why they are bussed in there so they can raise Blair out of the cellar of the performance metrics, no one is disputing that. But using those few hundred kids out of over 3000 to compare to entire school populations is dumb. Whitman has the highest test scores in all of MoCo, most AP success and college reediness. Blair is towards the bottom of those lists for the county. I get it but you're rationalizing out of inadequacy and it makes Blair parents look desperate and silly.

No one is "shipped" to Blair. No one put a gun in their heads and force them to go to Blair. Those kids are at Blair because their parents fought tooth and nails, prepped the life out of them to have the privilege and honor of attending Blair. Why? Because they would not get the kind of education they would get at Blair at their overrated W schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

But isn't that the whole point of school? To ensure a child has a successful life?

If a kid's parents can't afford college, and they know that, how about a Plan B? Why not Small Business School, business accounting, or a trade, or something that will either start a career or at least position them to earn tuition or land jobs in companies with tuition reimbursement programs? If they're hands-on types, why not teach them 3-D printing / manufacturing, or robot/drone repair, or something to position them for futuristic next-gen labor categories?

If the kids are dropping out of High School at 10% rates, that's a problem. It means that MCPS isn't meeting their needs and interests. If they don't have the money for college, at least give them a life-line. This is what pisses me off about MCPS. They think that redrawing a boundary or dumping them into a different school with rich kids will make a dropout successful. No, it won't. It will just make them check out of school faster.

No, it means MCPS is meeting the needs of 90% of its students. There is no way in hell for MCPS to meet the needs of 100% of its students if some don't want to, some cannot because of outside factors. This is public schools where they have to accept anybody and everybody.

Graduating does not mean a students needs were met.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anecdotally, some wealthier PTA’s give hundreds of dollars to teachers to purchase supplies, have grants for larger purchases, support teachers with food, messages, awards etc. The boosters make sure the sports teams and music programs have the best equipment and uniforms. I don’t think there is much difference in teaching overall, but anything outside of the classroom has a big difference between wealthy and poor schools. Over time staff end up gravitating to schools easier to commute to more than anything else. Poorer neighborhoods don’t have a lot of good overall housing/location for teachers. If a poor school is getting more money it is going to special programs and staffing that high most achieving students are not part of.

At our elementary the PTA built a planetarium and the parents run a space curriculum because the teachers by policy can't support it. It culminates at a space night where various physics and space clubs from the feeder middle and high schools come in set up while various space professionals come in and give presentations serviced by a line of food trucks. I was blown away by how cool it was for my kids and while definitely a perk that requires money many schools have unique charms like pools or theater programs.

What MCPS school has a pool?

Wheaton High School and Gaithersburg Middle School.

[Anonymous]

MCPS is extremely fair. I went to HS on Long Island and literally places like Garden City an award winning school similar to Winston Churchill was was next to Hempstead HS a very dangerous HS with a very very high drop out rate, drug use, shootings, stabbing etc.

Literally on boundary line one house goes Garden City HS and next door neighbor Hempstead. Being town based Long Island has some of the best High Schools in the country and some of the worst in the country.

MCPS all the schools are nice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:MCPS is extremely fair. I went to HS on Long Island and literally places like Garden City an award winning school similar to Winston Churchill was was next to Hempstead HS a very dangerous HS with a very very high drop out rate, drug use, shootings, stabbing etc.

Literally on boundary line one house goes Garden City HS and next door neighbor Hempstead. Being town based Long Island has some of the best High Schools in the country and some of the worst in the country.

MCPS all the schools are nice

Plenty of dcum posters want to switch to a system like this where property taxes go only to the school where the properties feed into instead of being pooled for a larger district like MoCo. Never going to happen but this is what these people want and it's disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

It's too bad we can't deeper stats on this. I remember seeing the average SAT by cohort for these schools a while ago and saw that Blair was 60+ over any W for white students which only 25-30 were magnet students of 270 kids that took the SAT. One poster even crunched the numbers and found that even factoring for those students the average SAT was still 30 points above any W for the same cohort. Anyway, this makes me wonder how meaningful these conclusions really are because they're just looking at bulk averages without factoring for SES differences.

MoCo doesn't track cohort by race, it does so by income. Even then it didn't break out the magnet or Cap kids which are upper SES kids plucked from a larger area for being higher SES (for the most part) and good test takers. Then the op only compared the results to whole school rankings at the Ws.

Basically they took the small handful of good test takers shipped into Blair from other schools and compared them to entire schools which were still comparable. That cherry picking doesn't mean what you think it does. And where is your pride for Blair's low scores overall and middling graduations rates? Yes the test takers bussed in do well on tests end up doing well on tests, that is why they are bussed in there so they can raise Blair out of the cellar of the performance metrics, no one is disputing that. But using those few hundred kids out of over 3000 to compare to entire school populations is dumb. Whitman has the highest test scores in all of MoCo, most AP success and college reediness. Blair is towards the bottom of those lists for the county. I get it but you're rationalizing out of inadequacy and it makes Blair parents look desperate and silly.

No one is "shipped" to Blair. No one put a gun in their heads and force them to go to Blair. Those kids are at Blair because their parents fought tooth and nails, prepped the life out of them to have the privilege and honor of attending Blair. Why? Because they would not get the kind of education they would get at Blair at their overrated W schools.

Yes, almost 40 years ago they created a magnet there back when Blair was a much smaller school located where SSIS in SS today. So much has changed here since that time. Today Blair is outside the beltway and the largest HS in the county with the some of the most rigorous courses offered anywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

It's too bad we can't deeper stats on this. I remember seeing the average SAT by cohort for these schools a while ago and saw that Blair was 60+ over any W for white students which only 25-30 were magnet students of 270 kids that took the SAT. One poster even crunched the numbers and found that even factoring for those students the average SAT was still 30 points above any W for the same cohort. Anyway, this makes me wonder how meaningful these conclusions really are because they're just looking at bulk averages without factoring for SES differences.

MoCo doesn't track cohort by race, it does so by income. Even then it didn't break out the magnet or Cap kids which are upper SES kids plucked from a larger area for being higher SES (for the most part) and good test takers. Then the op only compared the results to whole school rankings at the Ws.

Basically they took the small handful of good test takers shipped into Blair from other schools and compared them to entire schools which were still comparable. That cherry picking doesn't mean what you think it does. And where is your pride for Blair's low scores overall and middling graduations rates? Yes the test takers bussed in do well on tests end up doing well on tests, that is why they are bussed in there so they can raise Blair out of the cellar of the performance metrics, no one is disputing that. But using those few hundred kids out of over 3000 to compare to entire school populations is dumb. Whitman has the highest test scores in all of MoCo, most AP success and college reediness. Blair is towards the bottom of those lists for the county. I get it but you're rationalizing out of inadequacy and it makes Blair parents look desperate and silly.

No one is "shipped" to Blair. No one put a gun in their heads and force them to go to Blair. Those kids are at Blair because their parents fought tooth and nails, prepped the life out of them to have the privilege and honor of attending Blair. Why? Because they would not get the kind of education they would get at Blair at their overrated W schools.

Yes, almost 40 years ago they created a magnet there back when Blair was a much smaller school located where SSIS in SS today. So much has changed here since that time. Today Blair is outside the beltway and the largest HS in the county with the some of the most rigorous courses offered anywhere.

Many posters even suffer from a serious case of Blair envy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W schools may have more money from boosters and some nicer things for athletics (but it is becoming more even), but take a look at the Wheaton High School matriculation list this year and any jealousy might disappear (it’s pretty amazing — CalTech, a couple MITs, Harvard, Stanford, Harvey Mudd, Swathmore and many more. It is an impressive list).

Super Jealous of Wheaton by looking at the few kids who made it though one can totally overlook the 50% FARMS rate, poor test scores, almost unmeasurable AP participation rate (2%),high dropout and suspension rate. It's a Gem

The AP participation rate at Wheaton High School is 63%

Participation is not the same as passing. Of 425 graduates, 203 graduates (47.8%) achieved a passing score on AP (3+) or IB (4+). Only 71.8% took the SAT (which likely means that 28.2% of the students may not even be applying to colleges).

Even Blair is only at 52% passing (and the only reason it's that high is due to the magnet program there).

If you compare Wheaton and Blair with other High Schools, they achieve about the same AP/IB passing rates of graduating students as Quince Orchard HS.

Whitman 84.0
Wootton 78.4
Churchill 77.9
Poolesville 76.2
BCC 69.6
RM 67.0
QO 55.3
Magruder 46.7

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04757.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04602.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04234.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04201.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04406.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04125.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04152.pdf
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04510.pdf

DP In a perfect world family income would not determine whether a child goes to college, but it does. I'm not sure why you think it's so terrible to be around kids that aren't going to college. Yes, it's a sign the school might be able to serve those kids better, but the W schools are not doing anything different, they just serve a different population.

But isn't that the whole point of school? To ensure a child has a successful life?

If a kid's parents can't afford college, and they know that, how about a Plan B? Why not Small Business School, business accounting, or a trade, or something that will either start a career or at least position them to earn tuition or land jobs in companies with tuition reimbursement programs? If they're hands-on types, why not teach them 3-D printing / manufacturing, or robot/drone repair, or something to position them for futuristic next-gen labor categories?

If the kids are dropping out of High School at 10% rates, that's a problem. It means that MCPS isn't meeting their needs and interests. If they don't have the money for college, at least give them a life-line. This is what pisses me off about MCPS. They think that redrawing a boundary or dumping them into a different school with rich kids will make a dropout successful. No, it won't. It will just make them check out of school faster.

PP here - I don't disagree with you that MCPS could serve those students better. But I'm always perplexed by folks like you who on the one hand:

1. Insist that W schools are better for YOUR child
2. Reject the idea that poor kids could benefit from going to wealthier schools

It's really obvious you just hate poor kids and want them to fail, to punish their parents whom you see as neglectful (not that you've ever met any of these families).

In fact it's the rich kids that are going to be fine either way and the poor kids that have a lot to gain from balancing demographics a little more.

So true!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Staff salaries are the same from school to school. Facilities are obviously in a wide range of conditions across the county, and there are examples of run-down schools in wealthier areas and brand-new schools in less wealthy areas, and vice versa.

Sadly the academic programs in these schools widely differ as well which is what concerns to most parents.

THe main thing I've noticed so far is many of these kids get math acceleration at an early age. I remember reading rising 6th graders who had scored 250+ on their MAP-M are often placed in Algebra in 6th. I remember one of my kids managed to score higher in 3rd grade when they were 8 on the exact same test but since we were at a DCC school they were forced to sit through compacted math which was a snoozefest for them. I even discussed this with the principal of our school but they said there was nothing they could do about it. I guess it bothers me that kids born on the other side of the tracks are offered these opportunities while this is denied them.

Your resentment is misplaced. There are one or two schools in one W cluster that does this and one less wealthy cluster that does it. All the other schools which are wealthy or poor do not allow this ever. Our DC's school had several kids like this and all took the regular accelerated math track and when we went to MS it was the same. There was absolutely no one accelerated beyond the regular track. Give me a break. You don't know anything.