Delayed sleep phase disorder

[Anonymous]

Does anyone else have experience with this? I've been a night owl my whole life, but having 9-5 jobs and kids means I've basically been in permanent jet lag for 20+ years. I've been suffering from worsening depression, anxiety, and GI issues and I just read about delayed sleep-wake phase disorder for the first time this morning. I'm flabbergasted that this is a thing. It all makes sense now; my father was the same way but he was a freelance writer and slept most of the day; many of my relatives are the same way, and their lives have all been hampered by the sleep issue. Unfortunately my 15 year old daughter has fallen into the same trap in recent years (I pray for her that it's just puberty related) so while it's probably too late for me to fix things, I really want to help her. We already do things like trying to stick to a steady schedule, avoiding screens at night, getting exercise, using a full spectrum lamp in the morning. If you suffer from this too, can you please tell me your story and what helped or didn't help? Any recommendations for clinics in the DMV that specialize in this?

[Anonymous]

There is a line between being a night owl and having a sleep disorder. Have your primary doc order a sleep study. If you are found to have it, they may send you to a neurologist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a line between being a night owl and having a sleep disorder. Have your primary doc order a sleep study. If you are found to have it, they may send you to a neurologist.

Do you have a sleep disorder?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a line between being a night owl and having a sleep disorder. Have your primary doc order a sleep study. If you are found to have it, they may send you to a neurologist.

Do you have a sleep disorder?

My teen son does. He was diagnosed at age 10 and is working with a neurologist at Children’s hospital. It’s been a long road, with no real solution. He is currently on a modified high school schedule because waking him before 9am often results in hemiplegic migraine headaches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a line between being a night owl and having a sleep disorder. Have your primary doc order a sleep study. If you are found to have it, they may send you to a neurologist.

Do you have a sleep disorder?

My teen son does. He was diagnosed at age 10 and is working with a neurologist at Children’s hospital. It’s been a long road, with no real solution. He is currently on a modified high school schedule because waking him before 9am often results in hemiplegic migraine headaches.

I’m sorry to hear it, that sounds rough. What are his treatment options? Does it run in your family?

[Anonymous]

Our whole family is like this. DH has dealt with it by working for himself, so that he can wake up at 10 or 11 most days. DD mostly just suffers through, those sometimes she’ll take melatonin.

For me, I’ve found that keeping to a schedule helps a lot — I have a strict time when I need to be in bed, then a strict time about an hour later for lights out. In between I read, no screens. (Kindle Paperwhite doesn’t seem to affect me, and I’m not sure about phones or TVs, but laptop exposure past 11 is a nightmare for hoping to fall asleep later. And my bedtime is 12 or 1 — laptops affect me for HOURS!)

In terms of sleep meds, I’ve developed a mixture that works for me. Benadryl about an hour before bed (dye-free because turns ironically I am allergic to the red dye that they use in regular Benadryl), a very low dose of lorazepam (0.5 mg, shortly before bed) that fights adrenaline surges that used to wake me during the night, and roughly 1 mg of melatonin. The melatonin takes about 20-30 min but does quite well at getting me past the hump into actual sleep. Most doses at the store are much higher than that, but personally I’ve found that higher doses are actually counterproductive and make me wake up during the night. (They also make extended release melatonin for that reason, but I’ve had mixed success. Everyone’s body is different, so it’s worth experimenting!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our whole family is like this. DH has dealt with it by working for himself, so that he can wake up at 10 or 11 most days. DD mostly just suffers through, those sometimes she’ll take melatonin.

For me, I’ve found that keeping to a schedule helps a lot — I have a strict time when I need to be in bed, then a strict time about an hour later for lights out. In between I read, no screens. (Kindle Paperwhite doesn’t seem to affect me, and I’m not sure about phones or TVs, but laptop exposure past 11 is a nightmare for hoping to fall asleep later. And my bedtime is 12 or 1 — laptops affect me for HOURS!)

In terms of sleep meds, I’ve developed a mixture that works for me. Benadryl about an hour before bed (dye-free because turns ironically I am allergic to the red dye that they use in regular Benadryl), a very low dose of lorazepam (0.5 mg, shortly before bed) that fights adrenaline surges that used to wake me during the night, and roughly 1 mg of melatonin. The melatonin takes about 20-30 min but does quite well at getting me past the hump into actual sleep. Most doses at the store are much higher than that, but personally I’ve found that higher doses are actually counterproductive and make me wake up during the night. (They also make extended release melatonin for that reason, but I’ve had mixed success. Everyone’s body is different, so it’s worth experimenting!)

Oh wow. So what time do you get up in the morning? Do you have to start work at a certain time? Do any of you have depression or other health issues as a result?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our whole family is like this. DH has dealt with it by working for himself, so that he can wake up at 10 or 11 most days. DD mostly just suffers through, those sometimes she’ll take melatonin.

For me, I’ve found that keeping to a schedule helps a lot — I have a strict time when I need to be in bed, then a strict time about an hour later for lights out. In between I read, no screens. (Kindle Paperwhite doesn’t seem to affect me, and I’m not sure about phones or TVs, but laptop exposure past 11 is a nightmare for hoping to fall asleep later. And my bedtime is 12 or 1 — laptops affect me for HOURS!)

In terms of sleep meds, I’ve developed a mixture that works for me. Benadryl about an hour before bed (dye-free because turns ironically I am allergic to the red dye that they use in regular Benadryl), a very low dose of lorazepam (0.5 mg, shortly before bed) that fights adrenaline surges that used to wake me during the night, and roughly 1 mg of melatonin. The melatonin takes about 20-30 min but does quite well at getting me past the hump into actual sleep. Most doses at the store are much higher than that, but personally I’ve found that higher doses are actually counterproductive and make me wake up during the night. (They also make extended release melatonin for that reason, but I’ve had mixed success. Everyone’s body is different, so it’s worth experimenting!)

Oh wow. So what time do you get up in the morning? Do you have to start work at a certain time? Do any of you have depression or other health issues as a result?

PP again. I’m disabled now, for unrelated reasons. My last few years of jobs were somewhat flexible on start time, so I usually started around 10. I would eat a light breakfast at work, shower at night, have my clothes planned at night, etc, so I didn’t need to wake up too long before work. Nowadays I have to be up early to get DD up and to school, but I go back to bed after school dropoff. After years of this schedule, I’m so well trained to sleep in mid-morning that my body gets very confused at the (rare) times when I need to be up all day. Getting up for a while in the early morning isn’t awful if I need to do it. Staying up past 9 am is a muuuuch bigger problem.

[Anonymous]

You might have already considered this, but would changing what you do for work to have more flexible hours be an option?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You might have already considered this, but would changing what you do for work to have more flexible hours be an option?

I never did before, but I am now, seeing that DSPD is actually a thing and not just some lack of discipline on my part. I've been sleeping in a bit this week instead of trying to force myself to wake up early and sit at my desk unproductively, and it's actually helping my productivity a lot. My job is somewhat flexible, our core hours are 9-3, but I always tried to make myself wake up early to send the kids of to school or get a head start on my work day.

[Anonymous]

Anyone else suffer from delayed sleep wake phase disorder (DSWPD)?

[Anonymous]

I don’t know if that’s what I have, but I have always been late to go to bed and rise. I generally go to bed around 4am or so and sleep until 1 or 2 pm. Luckily my various employers have tolerated me over the years. I have always had 9-5 jobs but I rarely show up before 2pm, often 3 or 4.

In some ways I don’t mind it because I miss all the rushes. Rush at the coffee shop in the morning, rush to and from the office, lunch rush, rush to the office toilet after lunch, and all that. That’s all obsolete now with WFH though.

[Anonymous]

My DH has advanced sleep phase disorder (even more uncommon). His dad had it also (didn’t put a name to it back then) and so does his brother.

My DH tried some sort of light therapy but didn’t get any results. He sleeps 8pm-3/4am (despite not needing to be up at that time). It has been very problematic for family/marital life at times. Particularly now that we have teens (as opposed to little ones who go to bed at 7-8pm).

There is some research that links these disorders to ADD/ADHD. My DH has ADHD and one of our 3 kids has it also. So far, no sign of sleep issues for our kids but they are just teens. It didn’t show up for DH until adulthood.

My sympathies.

[Anonymous]

Yes, the Mayo Clinic Sleep Disorder Clinic diagnosed me with this years ago.

They told me that ideally, people can rotate their lives around their sleep schedule - take later classes, get jobs that start later, etc. But they recognize this isn't always possible.

But I found it interesting that they did NOT have some perspective that people NEED to be getting up early for their health. They were very clear that it's better for your health to go with your natural circadian rhythm and wake up later if your schedule allows. They said it's really hard to get your body to adjust do a different circadian rhythm than it naturally wants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DH has advanced sleep phase disorder (even more uncommon). His dad had it also (didn’t put a name to it back then) and so does his brother.

My DH tried some sort of light therapy but didn’t get any results. He sleeps 8pm-3/4am (despite not needing to be up at that time). It has been very problematic for family/marital life at times. Particularly now that we have teens (as opposed to little ones who go to bed at 7-8pm).

There is some research that links these disorders to ADD/ADHD. My DH has ADHD and one of our 3 kids has it also. So far, no sign of sleep issues for our kids but they are just teens. It didn’t show up for DH until adulthood.

My sympathies.

Interesting about the ADD, since I am that and totally off a normal rhythm. One of the biggest downsides I’ve noticed is not seeing that early morning shade of blue. I’ve noticed I’m in a better mood and generally feel better on the rare occasion I’m up early. I think there’s something activating about that color.