Is there data that shows AAP vs non-AAP scores on the SOLs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of both AAP and non AAP kids, ky AAP kids is more at risk at school than the others. That is why we think the program is important.

"At risk"? Seriously?

Yes. I posted that and it is very true in our family's case.

I have several highly and profoundly gifted people in my extended family. My AAP child is highly gifted.

I know from first hand experience and also from research that the adult life of the highly and profoundly gifted is often a struggle.

The AAP teachers my kid had with rare exception got those types of kids and did a wonderful job teaching the extremes.

And what have they aacomplished in life that reflects their "PROFOUND/Highly" giftedness? Geniuses write symphonies at young ages or win Nobel prizes etc. They don't just score at the 99.9 percentile on some IQ test.

Are you thinking that only "geniuses" can be considered "gifted"?

+1

However, even gifted education experts have varying definitions of giftedness. Posters here on DCUM would certainly not achieve such a consensus, either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of both AAP and non AAP kids, ky AAP kids is more at risk at school than the others. That is why we think the program is important.

Amen! People need to stop assuming AAP parents are focused on how it helps them for high school and college. I'm glad my fifth grader is in AAP because she now likes school better and is having an easier time socially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would be interesting to see data for 3rd grade since that's the first year of the AAP/Gen Ed split.

Do all AAP kids in 3rd grade pass advanced on the SOLs?

Of course not.

Why not?

Because most do and not all do.

Wouldn't it be good to see actual stats than just saying "all" or "most"???

Where are these numbers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 3rd grade, all the students take the same SOLs, right?

Regarding the bolded, above: you do realize you're talking about 2nd graders? It's kind of pathetic that you think the "success" of a 2nd grader is in any way indicative of their success later in school and in life.

AAP is absolutely not worth the effort or segregation. It creates far more problems than it could ever mitigate.

You really don't think that school success in the early grades has any predictive power on "success"? Or that kids who are score well a test that is highly correlated with IQ might be more likely to have successful careers than a kid who bombs it, or scores in the average range? Note that we are talking about population averages, not individual students. These tests, while imperfect, are not meaningless.

I think that you place waaaay too much emphasis on tests that are taken by 7 and 8 year old children, many of whom have been prepped. I also think that you don't have any older children (high school and beyond) or you would have already seen how AAP/no AAP plays no role in who is successful and who isn't.

I'm not talking about the affect of AAP on a child, I am suggesting that there is an overall population difference between the group of kids who scored high enough on test, had good/excellent grades, and high enough teacher ratings to be accepted into an advanced program. Sure, there are kids who are missed, and kids who probably shouldn't be there, as well as abilities that are not measured by the application process. I think however that it is logical to assume that kids who were accepted into AAP are going to at least have greater school success than kids who were not accepted as a population wide average. I don't have to have older kids to recognize that much of a child's personality and abilities are obvious by age 7-8. I can see it in myself, and my siblings and friends growing up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a parent of both AAP and non AAP kids, ky AAP kids is more at risk at school than the others. That is why we think the program is important.

"At risk"? Seriously?

Yes. I posted that and it is very true in our family's case.

I have several highly and profoundly gifted people in my extended family. My AAP child is highly gifted.

I know from first hand experience and also from research that the adult life of the highly and profoundly gifted is often a struggle.

The AAP teachers my kid had with rare exception got those types of kids and did a wonderful job teaching the extremes.

And what have they aacomplished in life that reflects their "PROFOUND/Highly" giftedness? Geniuses write symphonies at young ages or win Nobel prizes etc. They don't just score at the 99.9 percentile on some IQ test.

+100
Not to mention, these aren't even IQ tests we're talking about. They're reasoning tests, though of course lots of parents like to refer to them as "IQ" tests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 3rd grade, all the students take the same SOLs, right?

Regarding the bolded, above: you do realize you're talking about 2nd graders? It's kind of pathetic that you think the "success" of a 2nd grader is in any way indicative of their success later in school and in life.

AAP is absolutely not worth the effort or segregation. It creates far more problems than it could ever mitigate.

You really don't think that school success in the early grades has any predictive power on "success"? Or that kids who are score well a test that is highly correlated with IQ might be more likely to have successful careers than a kid who bombs it, or scores in the average range? Note that we are talking about population averages, not individual students. These tests, while imperfect, are not meaningless.

I think that you place waaaay too much emphasis on tests that are taken by 7 and 8 year old children, many of whom have been prepped. I also think that you don't have any older children (high school and beyond) or you would have already seen how AAP/no AAP plays no role in who is successful and who isn't.

I'm not talking about the affect of AAP on a child, I am suggesting that there is an overall population difference between the group of kids who scored high enough on test, had good/excellent grades, and high enough teacher ratings to be accepted into an advanced program. Sure, there are kids who are missed, and kids who probably shouldn't be there, as well as abilities that are not measured by the application process. I think however that it is logical to assume that kids who were accepted into AAP are going to at least have greater school success than kids who were not accepted as a population wide average. I don't have to have older kids to recognize that much of a child's personality and abilities are obvious by age 7-8. I can see it in myself, and my siblings and friends growing up.

The kids at my DC's high school who are exhibiting the most success are largely those who were never in GT/AAP. Many of these kids "came into their own" later than the arbitrary 2nd grade cutoff. And many of them are leaps and bounds more intelligent and creative than their AAP counterparts were. It's simply naive and foolish to assume that because a child is in AAP during elementary and middle school, they will therefore be more successful in high school and beyond. So many of them are burned out by then, right at the point where others (non-AAP) are hitting their stride.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would be interesting to see data for 3rd grade since that's the first year of the AAP/Gen Ed split.

Do all AAP kids in 3rd grade pass advanced on the SOLs?

Of course not.

Why not?

Because most do and not all do.

Wouldn't it be good to see actual stats than just saying "all" or "most"???

Where are these numbers?

You can submit a FOIA:

http://www.fcps.edu/it/forms/dcco9.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's simply naive and foolish to assume that because a child is in AAP during elementary and middle school, they will therefore be more successful in high school and beyond.

+1000

Highly gifted students are often underachievers.

http://www.gifted.uconn.edu/general/faculty/reis/GiftedUnderachievers.html

http://www.sengifted.org/archives/articles/underachievement-in-exceptionally-gifted-adolescents-and-young-adults-a-psychiatrist%E2%80%99s-view

https://tip.duke.edu/node/817

http://www.centerforthegifted.org/cntpub_under.htm