Accused of AI usage. Anyway to prove /disprove?

[Anonymous]

Why don’t kids need to hand in draft outlines anymore? We used to do that to prevent accusations of cheating.

[Anonymous]

My son's school requires students to hand in a bibliography/works cited along with an outline for students in 9th/10th grades which is then approved before they hand in the final paper. This way, they have done the research first. Lots of writing is done in class on the spot so teachers get to know students' writing ability and style without the use of outside sources.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, I'm more inclined to believe his teacher. AI usage is rampant, whether because kids are lazy and think they can get away with it or because otherwise motivated kids get behind the eight ball and panic. At this point AI is so formulaic, it's pretty easy to recognize.

High school kids' writing is pretty formulaic, too. Generative AI "detection" tools have notoriously high false positives, so I certainly wouldn't default to believing the teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t kids need to hand in draft outlines anymore? We used to do that to prevent accusations of cheating.

AI can make drafts, too

[Anonymous]

If a teacher makes an accusation, they need conclusive evidence.

And if it’s their policy to use checkers, they need to be up front and tell students about this policy and disclose which checkers they use. This way students can provide an explanation up front as to why the checker says AI is likely to have been used.

I agree with PP that preventative measures like submitting drafts should be part of the grading.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We should advocate for the integration of AI in educational settings, as there is no merit in persisting with the monotonous tasks of managing grammar, structuring paragraphs, and so on. The focus should instead be on the substance and thematic choices made by the student in composing the paper. Students ought to present and discuss their papers to demonstrate comprehension and effectively communicate the material. The antiquated stance of penalizing students for using AI must be abandoned. Rather, the use of AI should be encouraged. It is inevitable that, in the near future, proficiency in AI utilization will become a criterion for assessment, based on the quality of input provided to it.

You are 100% a troll.

Every time that we turn something over to technology, we lose something. Every. Time. That includes going from walking to biking or buggies to cars. It includes the way autopilot changed flying. It includes the invention of writing.

Maybe we don't mind if we lose it, based on what we gain, but I can't possibly see what we gain by turning writing over to AI.

LOL, I think the post you are responding to was AI-generated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son's school requires students to hand in a bibliography/works cited along with an outline for students in 9th/10th grades which is then approved before they hand in the final paper. This way, they have done the research first. Lots of writing is done in class on the spot so teachers get to know students' writing ability and style without the use of outside sources.

Even before AI, when I was teaching college writing, I always did a lot of the writing in class. It was the only way to make sure they were actually doing it themselves. Any teacher giving important assignments or assessments outside of class is not doing it right. It's just kind of lazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We should advocate for the integration of AI in educational settings, as there is no merit in persisting with the monotonous tasks of managing grammar, structuring paragraphs, and so on. The focus should instead be on the substance and thematic choices made by the student in composing the paper. Students ought to present and discuss their papers to demonstrate comprehension and effectively communicate the material. The antiquated stance of penalizing students for using AI must be abandoned. Rather, the use of AI should be encouraged. It is inevitable that, in the near future, proficiency in AI utilization will become a criterion for assessment, based on the quality of input provided to it.

You are 100% a troll.

Every time that we turn something over to technology, we lose something. Every. Time. That includes going from walking to biking or buggies to cars. It includes the way autopilot changed flying. It includes the invention of writing.

Maybe we don't mind if we lose it, based on what we gain, but I can't possibly see what we gain by turning writing over to AI.

LOL, I think the post you are responding to was AI-generated.

NP
It's also the type of thinking many CS majors roll out of school with. They are very dismissive of other subjects while being mentally limited and one dimensional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We should advocate for the integration of AI in educational settings, as there is no merit in persisting with the monotonous tasks of managing grammar, structuring paragraphs, and so on. The focus should instead be on the substance and thematic choices made by the student in composing the paper. Students ought to present and discuss their papers to demonstrate comprehension and effectively communicate the material. The antiquated stance of penalizing students for using AI must be abandoned. Rather, the use of AI should be encouraged. It is inevitable that, in the near future, proficiency in AI utilization will become a criterion for assessment, based on the quality of input provided to it.

You are 100% a troll.

Every time that we turn something over to technology, we lose something. Every. Time. That includes going from walking to biking or buggies to cars. It includes the way autopilot changed flying. It includes the invention of writing.

Maybe we don't mind if we lose it, based on what we gain, but I can't possibly see what we gain by turning writing over to AI.

LOL, I think the post you are responding to was AI-generated.

NP
It's also the type of thinking many CS majors roll out of school with. They are very dismissive of other subjects while being mentally limited and one dimensional.

Which is why CS majors should be required to also study the liberal arts. It also makes them better programmers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We should advocate for the integration of AI in educational settings, as there is no merit in persisting with the monotonous tasks of managing grammar, structuring paragraphs, and so on. The focus should instead be on the substance and thematic choices made by the student in composing the paper. Students ought to present and discuss their papers to demonstrate comprehension and effectively communicate the material. The antiquated stance of penalizing students for using AI must be abandoned. Rather, the use of AI should be encouraged. It is inevitable that, in the near future, proficiency in AI utilization will become a criterion for assessment, based on the quality of input provided to it.

You are 100% a troll.

Every time that we turn something over to technology, we lose something. Every. Time. That includes going from walking to biking or buggies to cars. It includes the way autopilot changed flying. It includes the invention of writing.

Maybe we don't mind if we lose it, based on what we gain, but I can't possibly see what we gain by turning writing over to AI.

LOL, I think the post you are responding to was AI-generated.

NP
It's also the type of thinking many CS majors roll out of school with. They are very dismissive of other subjects while being mentally limited and one dimensional.

Which is why CS majors should be required to also study the liberal arts. It also makes them better programmers.

They are in most CS programs.

[Anonymous]

AI detection software is horribly inaccurate. It thinks the US constitution and passages from the Bible are AI generated. It makes a guess that spits out a percentage and an unreliable one at that. And yet it's being used to accuse kids who did nothing wrong.

In contrast, plagiarism detection software shows an actual comparison between the writing being looked at and any other existing content that is similar. It allows for the teacher to make there own assessment.

AI detection software should be banned -- the risk of unfairly disqualifying an entire swatrh of applicants is not worth the odds of possibly catching someone who actually use AI to do all their work.

Sadly, teachers and institutions who use AI detection software are likely to be too complacent with being able to outsource their responsibility for evaluating students, and the companies who sell them the software have their business model at stake and will be very difficult to fight against. Turn-it-in has already had to put our revisions to its earlier claims of a 4 percent error rate which provide to be completely off. Chat-GPT actually terminated their detection software because of its unreliability.

And agree with others that the irony is that it will be the privileged families and their kids who can pre-scan their work through detection software algorithms and then revise it to avoid getting caught. It will be the disadvantaged families who will suffer.

[Anonymous]

https://www.pcmag.com/news/openai-quietly-shuts-down-ai-text-detection-tool-over-inaccuracies

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/quick-takes/2023/06/01/turnitins-ai-detector-higher-expected-false-positives

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^Long-winded pp here again. What DS has learned from this? He will always run his papers through a checker himself to make sure it doesn't appear to be AI generated.

The real takeaway is that AI is only banned in fields that AI has made obsolete.

If you think AI has made writing obsolete you don't read enough good literature.

the degrees that focus on literature don't prepare you for a barista so its useless, career options are a professor of literature or entry level food service field

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.pcmag.com/news/openai-quietly-shuts-down-ai-text-detection-tool-over-inaccuracies

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/quick-takes/2023/06/01/turnitins-ai-detector-higher-expected-false-positives

wow, I wonder how long until a student accused by turnitin sues

[Anonymous]

People are pretty bad at telling if AI wrote something. Remember the guy who said that if “delve” was used, it’s a sure sign that it was AI??

He also listed a few other words that I’ve definitely used. Maybe I’m a computer.