Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You're the boat wife? I still can't figure out why you like him.

But just find a couples counselor, go to them, share the boat story, and get their suggestions on how to broach the subject based on their experience dealing with people like your husband.

Boat wife here. I don’t really like him. I’m having trouble detaching. Having trouble telling him what I want. The boat + no sex + verbal abuse = me wanting out. I have no idea how to broach this topic with him so was thinking of bringing him to therapy, not to change him but so there’s someone else in the room who can make him give me the space to say what I need to say without talking over me. That I’m miserable and if things don’t change, I’m leaving. And I don’t want to spend years in therapy with him. I’m not 30 anymore. I don’t have that kind of time.

honey, you have your lawyer tell him. you don’t need to tell him.

I am in a 20 year marriage with someone like this, OP. I also told him that it was therapy or divorce. He loves therapy bc he loves to talk about himself. He can be unbelievably helpful and kind at times, and at times, defensive, verbally abusive, impossible. therapy is helping him remove himself from a situation where he holds me hostage talking at me for hours at a time. It is helpful.I don't know what I will do in the long term. I do not want to be divorced. But therapy is the only way for me. I don't do couple's therapy anymore, but I totally validate having a therapist in the same room so that you have someone to bear witness and allow you to speak.

Anonymous wrote:I was in this situation, and my own therapy led to a sexual relationship with my therapist and later divorce. YMMV.

Your therapist should lose his or her license to practice, permanently. Having a sexual relationship with a patient is absolutely against therapists' code of ethical practices. The therapist surely has done this with other patients before you and will do this with other patients after you. I'm so sorry.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As my therapist tells me often, I cannot change him and I cannot force him to be ready to go on his own change journey - all I can do is change my reaction to him.

In my situation, this (my own therapy and developing tools) has led to a MUCH better marriage, including better boundaries, communication, etc. But I am also very aware that for many people in this situation, their own therapy could lead to a decision to leave. And that is totally okay, OP.

Make sure you are taking care of yourself rather than wishing he will change, and then see where your "change journey" takes you.

I agree with this. You need to take care of yourself and your own boundaries. Leave the house if he raises his voice. Just drop everything and walk away.

I have given ultimatums in the past for anger management and DH has done a lot of work. But usually issues like that arise because your DH is in fight or flight triggered by unresolved issues from the past. It can take years to unpack and resolve that stuff. My DH is probably 75% through that process so there has been a LOT of progress, yelling episodes are much less frequent. However men generally have low self awareness and getting them to the point they can recognize what their real fears are is not easy at all.

This, plus untreated ADHD, is my DH.

We did see a therapist once but my DH just talked and ranted through all the sessions. Once the therapist started suggesting stuff he didn't agree with, he decided the therapist was bad and we should stop.

Anonymous wrote:OP I have the same issue. I thought things were getting better a month ago when DH said he felt like he wasted the last 10 years being angry and disagreeable and negative. Lasted 2 weeks. Today I hit a breaking point when he caused a huge fight right as I was trying to get to an important meeting- his MO is to sabotage everything happy. I told him therapy by Jan 1 or divorce. He “apologized” later and thinks that makes everything ok. I didn’t leave him when my kid was younger becuase I thought I could make it work- I come from a broken home and didn’t want that. Now I stay becuase I don’t want to break my kid’s heart so close to leaving for college, I’m still with him. I can’t stand to see my life slip away as I age- lonely, trying to walk on eggshells to prevent tension. I don’t have advice other than I offer you hugs and support and say that I see you and I feel for you.

OP here. Thank you. I hope you get the strength to leave.

OP I have the same issue. I thought things were getting better a month ago when DH said he felt like he wasted the last 10 years being angry and disagreeable and negative. Lasted 2 weeks. Today I hit a breaking point when he caused a huge fight right as I was trying to get to an important meeting- his MO is to sabotage everything happy. I told him therapy by Jan 1 or divorce. He “apologized” later and thinks that makes everything ok. I didn’t leave him when my kid was younger becuase I thought I could make it work- I come from a broken home and didn’t want that. Now I stay becuase I don’t want to break my kid’s heart so close to leaving for college, I’m still with him. I can’t stand to see my life slip away as I age- lonely, trying to walk on eggshells to prevent tension. I don’t have advice other than I offer you hugs and support and say that I see you and I feel for you.

Anonymous wrote:You're the boat wife? I still can't figure out why you like him.

But just find a couples counselor, go to them, share the boat story, and get their suggestions on how to broach the subject based on their experience dealing with people like your husband.

Boat wife here. I don’t really like him. I’m having trouble detaching. Having trouble telling him what I want. The boat + no sex + verbal abuse = me wanting out. I have no idea how to broach this topic with him so was thinking of bringing him to therapy, not to change him but so there’s someone else in the room who can make him give me the space to say what I need to say without talking over me. That I’m miserable and if things don’t change, I’m leaving. And I don’t want to spend years in therapy with him. I’m not 30 anymore. I don’t have that kind of time.

You're the boat wife? I still can't figure out why you like him.

But just find a couples counselor, go to them, share the boat story, and get their suggestions on how to broach the subject based on their experience dealing with people like your husband.

Your job is not to fix him. You're responsible for you and he's responsible for him. You can go to therapy yourself to work on setting boundaries and get support. The Melanie Beattie books on codependence will be helpful.

Anonymous wrote:As my therapist tells me often, I cannot change him and I cannot force him to be ready to go on his own change journey - all I can do is change my reaction to him.

In my situation, this (my own therapy and developing tools) has led to a MUCH better marriage, including better boundaries, communication, etc. But I am also very aware that for many people in this situation, their own therapy could lead to a decision to leave. And that is totally okay, OP.

Make sure you are taking care of yourself rather than wishing he will change, and then see where your "change journey" takes you.

I agree with this. You need to take care of yourself and your own boundaries. Leave the house if he raises his voice. Just drop everything and walk away.

I have given ultimatums in the past for anger management and DH has done a lot of work. But usually issues like that arise because your DH is in fight or flight triggered by unresolved issues from the past. It can take years to unpack and resolve that stuff. My DH is probably 75% through that process so there has been a LOT of progress, yelling episodes are much less frequent. However men generally have low self awareness and getting them to the point they can recognize what their real fears are is not easy at all.

Anonymous wrote:I was in this situation, and my own therapy led to a sexual relationship with my therapist and later divorce. YMMV.

I know this is not funny but it made me laugh out loud.

I was in this situation, and my own therapy led to a sexual relationship with my therapist and later divorce. YMMV.

As my therapist tells me often, I cannot change him and I cannot force him to be ready to go on his own change journey - all I can do is change my reaction to him.

In my situation, this (my own therapy and developing tools) has led to a MUCH better marriage, including better boundaries, communication, etc. But I am also very aware that for many people in this situation, their own therapy could lead to a decision to leave. And that is totally okay, OP.

Make sure you are taking care of yourself rather than wishing he will change, and then see where your "change journey" takes you.

I had to insist on it. “We either go to counseling or we get divorced. Your choice.” He threw a tantrum and did everything he could to stop from going. I just held firm the way you do with a toddler. “I made an appointment with a therapist and an appointment with an attorney. It’s your choice which route we go”.

We did therapy for years but unfortunately divorced anyway. From what I’ve learned, it’s almost impossible for men like that to change, unless they want to change for themselves and not just to keep their wives around.

My husband is what I would call a high conflict person. He goes from 0 to 60 very quickly when I raise anything with him that he might perceive as negative or critical. His usual mode is to talk over me and argue with me about whatever issue I’m raising. I’m walking on eggshells all the time.

I want to ask him to go to a couples therapist with me. I have no idea how to introduce the topic without setting him off into a defensive anger spiral. I’ve asked him to go in the past and he’s refused but I have reached the breaking point. (I’m the OP of the boat thread, if anyone read that. https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1015456.page) My objective is to get in a room with him and an objective therapist who can moderate so we can have an actual discussion about the issues and come to decision about our future.

Anyway— really appreciate tips from anyone who’s BTDT with a spouse who is tough to talk to. I’m planning to talk to him this weekend. Dread it.