Reply to More than 1 million fewer students are in college.

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I think there is a significant segment of our society that was sold on the "value" of a college education over the past 20 years as enrollment rose by 30%. The shock of the past two years awoke a lot of young people to the costs and debt burden of college while revealing a working world that doesn't financially justify the expense.

None of that applies to the typical DCUM household but I see it in the families of my coworkers who are in the $30k-$70k income demographic.[/quote]

But that is the group that is most benefitted by college actually.  They get decent FA and the lifetime economic benefits of a college degree still vastly outweigh the costs.[/quote]

Ugh, [b]this is just not true.  [/b]They get decent FA if they happen to be studious/talented and know about schools that offer FA and are accepted at a school that provides such aid, but many will attend schools where they have to take out significant loans.

Also, there are numerous degrees that have negative ROIs on average.  Add to that, they know many people that take out loans and only make it 2 years, so now it is the worst of both worlds...no degree and student loans.

[/quote]

Well the data do suggest that the economic benefit is true--on average--and for kids from this family income group.  The best path for the less academically able is CC then transfer.  Just because some make bad decisions (e.g., attend a for profit college, take out excessive loans for a low-paying major) doesn't make the overall pattern less true.   I think we as a society have to provide better guidance on taking out loans and the ROI on different career paths, but college is still paying off---especially for those from middle class families. [/quote]

Great, so if we just fix overall society problems...then hey, no worries.  Here are the facts below.  Something for either side of the debate glob onto:

Key Findings (https://freopp.org/is-college-worth-it-a-comprehensive-return-on-investment-analysis-1b2ad17f84c8)
This report estimates return on investment (ROI) — the increase in lifetime earnings minus the costs of college — for nearly 30,000 bachelor’s degrees.
For students who graduate on time, the median bachelor’s degree has a net ROI of $306,000. But some degrees are worth millions of dollars, while others have no net financial value at all.
After accounting for the risk of dropping out, ROI for the median bachelor’s degree drops to $129,000. Over a quarter of programs have negative ROI.
Four in five engineering programs have ROI above $500,000, but the same is true for just 1% of psychology programs.
Elite schools such as Caltech and Penn dominate the list of highest ROI programs. But attending an elite school is not a golden ticket; some Ivy League degrees have negative ROI.[/quote]

They didn't measure lifetime earnings here--only to age 45.  That's where the difference between being educated and not make a big difference.  Many analysis do the full 40 year ROI.[/quote]

[b]Not sure why you think that[/b].  The calculation from the link:

ROI for 30,000 bachelor’s degrees
I define ROI as the present discounted value of lifetime earnings with a college degree, minus the present discounted value of counterfactual earnings (including earnings while enrolled in college), minus the cost of tuition, required fees, books, and equipment. For the initial ROI calculation, I assume the student spends exactly four years in college, graduates, starts working at age 23, and retires at age 65. (We’ll relax some of these assumptions in a bit.)[/quote]

The ROI salary data points are 25, 35 and 45 years old. The author just extrapolates from those.

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