American Students Lagging in Math and Science

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[Post New]08/26/2009 15:49
Anonymous
I also disagree on the pay comment. This definitely has something to do with the fact that in other countries, education is valued a whole lot more than in this country. Where I come from, going to college was not even something to question. Parents work their asses off to send their kids to school so that their kids can have a better life than the previous generation. When my family first moved to this country, my parents were definitely struggling financially but even then found a way to pay for college for all 3 of their kids. Athletics and the social aspect of school, areas that are valued in the American culture were not viewed as important. It was all about how well we did in our classes and what grades we recieved.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:05
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:I also disagree on the pay comment. This definitely has something to do with the fact that in other countries, education is valued a whole lot more than in this country. Where I come from, going to college was not even something to question. Parents work their asses off to send their kids to school so that their kids can have a better life than the previous generation. When my family first moved to this country, my parents were definitely struggling financially but even then found a way to pay for college for all 3 of their kids. Athletics and the social aspect of school, areas that are valued in the American culture were not viewed as important. It was all about how well we did in our classes and what grades we recieved.


Are you Korean or Indian by chance?

I'm from India and college is NOT OPTIONAL in most families and doing well leading up to college is a clear expectation. Also you better not even consider getting what might be seen a silly degree such as communications or sociology. Being a doctor or engineer is pretty much a staple. In India, school is not free and one must work really hard to even get into a competitive middle or high school. Families from modest means will come together and do just about anything to get their children into the best school they can be accepted in, even if that means mom and dad working 2 jobs each. I hate to say it, but this is all very apparent in American culture, as most top engineering talent at many corporations is imported from India. Good thing America can buy talent from other countries, because we (speaking as an American myself) have quite a hard time growing it at home. Whenever I'm looking for a medical specialist, I'm amazed at how many familiar Indian names I see listed at options.

This is one thing, I will not lose from my culture, my kids are American in many ways, but my DH and I work hard to keep up the Indian expectation of achievement.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:07
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
I'm from India and college is NOT OPTIONAL in most families and doing well leading up to college is a clear expectation. Also you better not even consider getting what might be seen a silly degree such as communications or sociology.

Yes, a former student of mine was nearly disowned by her father when she decided to major in sociology!
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:12
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Also you better not even consider getting what might be seen a silly degree such as communications or sociology.


LOL.

I hate to say it, but this is all very apparent in American culture, as most top engineering talent at many corporations is imported from India.


And China. But I have heard that foreigners trained in American colleges are the top talent not foreigners trained in foreign engineering colleges.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:26
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:its also not pushed as much. i'm sure if you as parents make your child take all the right classes, your child will do well in math/science. make it a priority for their education. my parents did and i was a physics major in college (and a woman.


How did you feel at the time, with your parents' pressuring you to take certain classes?

I do want to encourage math and science for my kids, but don't want to be a dictator, either.


they weren't brutal on me. they just told me it was important to learn math and science and praised me when i did well. i got incentives to do well (a little bribing here or there), but never punished or ridiculed if for some reason i didn't. once i got grounded in 8th grade because the teacher called that i wasn't doing my homework (even though i had 100% average). that was the only time.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:28
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:its also not pushed as much. i'm sure if you as parents make your child take all the right classes, your child will do well in math/science. make it a priority for their education. my parents did and i was a physics major in college (and a woman.


How did you feel at the time, with your parents' pressuring you to take certain classes?

I do want to encourage math and science for my kids, but don't want to be a dictator, either.


they weren't brutal on me. they just told me it was important to learn math and science and praised me when i did well. i got incentives to do well (a little bribing here or there), but never punished or ridiculed if for some reason i didn't. once i got grounded in 8th grade because the teacher called that i wasn't doing my homework (even though i had 100% average). that was the only time.


What did you end up doing with your degree, if you don't mind sharing? Are you working in research now?
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:30
Anonymous
PP again...also on the dictator thing. if your conscious about that already you probably won't be. but when i hear about parents who don't believe in homework etc. i'm just shocked. your mind is like a sponge when you are younger and it should be challenged! nothing wrong with making education a priority in your child's life.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:32
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:its also not pushed as much. i'm sure if you as parents make your child take all the right classes, your child will do well in math/science. make it a priority for their education. my parents did and i was a physics major in college (and a woman.


How did you feel at the time, with your parents' pressuring you to take certain classes?

I do want to encourage math and science for my kids, but don't want to be a dictator, either.


they weren't brutal on me. they just told me it was important to learn math and science and praised me when i did well. i got incentives to do well (a little bribing here or there), but never punished or ridiculed if for some reason i didn't. once i got grounded in 8th grade because the teacher called that i wasn't doing my homework (even though i had 100% average). that was the only time.


What did you end up doing with your degree, if you don't mind sharing? Are you working in research now?


i did research for my first 6 years out of college for the government. now i work in program management in my field as a contractor (better maternity leave!!!).
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:40
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:PP again...also on the dictator thing. if your conscious about that already you probably won't be. but when i hear about parents who don't believe in homework etc. i'm just shocked. your mind is like a sponge when you are younger and it should be challenged! nothing wrong with making education a priority in your child's life.


I'm American-born, but my husband is Arab, and it's very common in Arab families (with money) to really pressure children to do extremely well in school. So my husband will be prone to putting serious pressure on the kids (to be doctors), while I am more laid back by nature and want them to find what suits them best. I'm happy to strike a balance here in the household that makes schooling a priority. I'm just not sure how to go about that yet.
[Post New]08/26/2009 16:53
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:PP again...also on the dictator thing. if your conscious about that already you probably won't be. but when i hear about parents who don't believe in homework etc. i'm just shocked. your mind is like a sponge when you are younger and it should be challenged! nothing wrong with making education a priority in your child's life.


I'm American-born, but my husband is Arab, and it's very common in Arab families (with money) to really pressure children to do extremely well in school. So my husband will be prone to putting serious pressure on the kids (to be doctors), while I am more laid back by nature and want them to find what suits them best. I'm happy to strike a balance here in the household that makes schooling a priority. I'm just not sure how to go about that yet.


My father really wanted me to be a vet, but I chose physics instead and he was fine with that. (i'm American btw). i would try to strike a balance on that one and first see what they're good at and what types of interests they have. but a little guidance isn't a bad thing either. let them pursue some other things in their extracuricular activities. i loved languages and philosophy more than physics but what would i have done with them? (plus i didn't like writing long papers). have your child (well...when they're older) try to map out a career plan along with a major.
[Post New]08/26/2009 17:07
zumbamama
Site Admin Offline
My mom used to threaten to take me back to the Philippines, land of nurses and accountants, if I didn't pull up my math and science grades. I definitely lagged behind in those two. Two of my cousins, who came here as straight-A high school freshmen, quickly went downhill after completely assimilating into American culture. My aunt actually stuck to her word and sent my cousin back to the Philippines to "un-Americanize her and bring her grades back up."

I probably would've done better in math/science if my mom did what my aunt did, but I would've been a miserable artist pursuing a left brain career. I'm no techie, and was always drawn to the "silly" subjects like art, history, communications, anthro and sociology. So I am glad my mom didn't push it to the extent of what my aunt did!

[Post New]08/26/2009 17:10
Anonymous
We suck at math and science because our society doesn't value those subjects anymore. Just look at all the debates surrounding vaccines, evolution, etc. - it's clear that a lot of folks don't really care or value the research, though I think it's because they simply don't understand it. I become enraged when people try to argue that scientists conducting research come to their conclusions because they either have ulterior motives or are influenced by the pharma industry - clearly these people do not know what it means to have intellectual curiosity, as I find it hard to believe that every single scientist who has studied a particular subject and comes to the same conclusion has the same ulterior motive.
[Post New]08/26/2009 17:14
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:We suck at math and science because our society doesn't value those subjects anymore. Just look at all the debates surrounding vaccines, evolution, etc. - it's clear that a lot of folks don't really care or value the research, though I think it's because they simply don't understand it. I become enraged when people try to argue that scientists conducting research come to their conclusions because they either have ulterior motives or are influenced by the pharma industry - clearly these people do not know what it means to have intellectual curiosity, as I find it hard to believe that every single scientist who has studied a particular subject and comes to the same conclusion has the same ulterior motive.


It didn't help matters much that for years scientists funded by industry polluters denied global warming.
[Post New]08/26/2009 18:34
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:We suck at math and science because our society doesn't value those subjects anymore. Just look at all the debates surrounding vaccines, evolution, etc. - it's clear that a lot of folks don't really care or value the research, though I think it's because they simply don't understand it. I become enraged when people try to argue that scientists conducting research come to their conclusions because they either have ulterior motives or are influenced by the pharma industry - clearly these people do not know what it means to have intellectual curiosity, as I find it hard to believe that every single scientist who has studied a particular subject and comes to the same conclusion has the same ulterior motive.


It didn't help matters much that for years scientists funded by industry polluters denied global warming.


This is precisely my point. Not ALL scientists were "funded by industry polluters," yet because of the few who were, people discredit science as a whole.
[Post New]08/26/2009 19:11
Anonymous
Considering that some of the most successful entrepreneurs were math and science types (Gates, Wozniak, Page, Brin, Grove) you would think more people would be interested in those subjects.
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