Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
How do you know these women were all "as Muslim as can be" as opposed to, say, atheist communists? Maybe they never wanted to cover, and they had a brief period under the Russian proxies when they didn't have to cover. The Taliban came in and the burkas returned for everybody, religious or not.

The Taliban have nothing to do with Islam.

If full covering was about Islam, women would have remained fully covered in Afganistan from the day the country went Muslim.

How do YOU know they were atheist communists?

(besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
How do you know these women were all "as Muslim as can be" as opposed to, say, atheist communists? Maybe they never wanted to cover, and they had a brief period under the Russian proxies when they didn't have to cover. The Taliban came in and the burkas returned for everybody, religious or not.

The Taliban have nothing to do with Islam.

If full covering was about Islam, women would have remained fully covered in Afganistan from the day the country went Muslim.

How do YOU know they were atheist communists?

How many Christian niqabis are there? Or Hindu? Some Christian women dress "more" modestly than others, some religious women wear headscarvew, etc. How many non-Muslim women wear a burka or niqab (besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

It is sometimes alleged that the face-veil was originally part of women's dress among certain classes in the Byzantine Empire and was adopted into Muslim culture during the Arab conquest of the Middle East. However, although Byzantine art before Islam commonly depicts women with veiled heads or covered hair, it does not depict women with veiled faces. In addition, the Greek geographer Strabo, writing in the first century AD, refers to some Persian women veiling their faces[not in citation given] and the early third-century Christian writer Tertullian clearly refers in his treatise The Veiling of Virgins to some pagan women of "Arabia" wearing a veil that covers not only their head but also the entire face. Clement of Alexandria commends the contemporary use of face coverings. There are also two Biblical references to the employment of covering face veils in Genesis 38.14 and Genesis 24.65, by Tamar and by Rebekah, Jacob and Abraham's daughters-in-law respectively. These primary sources show that some women in Egypt, Arabia, Canaan and Persia veiled their faces long before Islam. In the case of Tamar, the Biblical text,'When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face' indicates customary, if not sacral, use of the face veil to accentuate rather than disguise her sexuality.

Anonymous wrote:

(besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Pretty sure Muslima is not a woman. Either that, or it is multiple posters.

Anonymous wrote:Islam = culture, to a greater extent than other mainstream religions. Fundamentalist Christians, ultra-orthodox Jews, etc., also have much stronger cultural requirements, but they're not mainstream.

So saying that niqab is cultural rather than religious is inaccurate.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
How do you know these women were all "as Muslim as can be" as opposed to, say, atheist communists? Maybe they never wanted to cover, and they had a brief period under the Russian proxies when they didn't have to cover. The Taliban came in and the burkas returned for everybody, religious or not.

The Taliban have nothing to do with Islam.

If full covering was about Islam, women would have remained fully covered in Afganistan from the day the country went Muslim.

How do YOU know they were atheist communists?

How many Christian niqabis are there? Or Hindu? Some Christian women dress "more" modestly than others, some religious women wear headscarvew, etc. How many non-Muslim women wear a burka or niqab (besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Oh boy- You know, the burqa and niqab are pre-Islamic right? Please tell me that you know that!

It is sometimes alleged that the face-veil was originally part of women's dress among certain classes in the Byzantine Empire and was adopted into Muslim culture during the Arab conquest of the Middle East. However, although Byzantine art before Islam commonly depicts women with veiled heads or covered hair, it does not depict women with veiled faces. In addition, the Greek geographer Strabo, writing in the first century AD, refers to some Persian women veiling their faces[not in citation given] and the early third-century Christian writer Tertullian clearly refers in his treatise The Veiling of Virgins to some pagan women of "Arabia" wearing a veil that covers not only their head but also the entire face. Clement of Alexandria commends the contemporary use of face coverings. There are also two Biblical references to the employment of covering face veils in Genesis 38.14 and Genesis 24.65, by Tamar and by Rebekah, Jacob and Abraham's daughters-in-law respectively. These primary sources show that some women in Egypt, Arabia, Canaan and Persia veiled their faces long before Islam. In the case of Tamar, the Biblical text,'When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face' indicates customary, if not sacral, use of the face veil to accentuate rather than disguise her sexuality.

Anonymous wrote:Islam = culture, to a greater extent than other mainstream religions. Fundamentalist Christians, ultra-orthodox Jews, etc., also have much stronger cultural requirements, but they're not mainstream.

So saying that niqab is cultural rather than religious is inaccurate.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
How do you know these women were all "as Muslim as can be" as opposed to, say, atheist communists? Maybe they never wanted to cover, and they had a brief period under the Russian proxies when they didn't have to cover. The Taliban came in and the burkas returned for everybody, religious or not.

The Taliban have nothing to do with Islam.

If full covering was about Islam, women would have remained fully covered in Afganistan from the day the country went Muslim.

How do YOU know they were atheist communists?

How many Christian niqabis are there? Or Hindu? Some Christian women dress "more" modestly than others, some religious women wear headscarvew, etc. How many non-Muslim women wear a burka or niqab (besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Anonymous wrote:
I know that of the three main world religions, all of which originated in the desert, two of them have, to a greater or lesser extent, left the desert. One of them hasn't, or is returning.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:So, after Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan, women were forced to dress a certain way but Islam is to blame? Good thought process, good throughout process!! People got it wrong for over 1000 years....

Could you explain a little more? This makes no sense, from any point of view. Sounds like you're trying to be sarcastic about Islam requiring women to veil for 1000 years in Afghanistan. But you can't mean that, can you?

The opposite. Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan when that picture posted by the PP was taken therefore you can not blame Islam for forcing women to veil as they would have been wearing their niqabs and hijabs from day 1. Same thing in Saudi Arabia where women before the 70s dressed differently.

Huh? I'm not the poster who put up that picture, but surely her point was the opposite. Whatever you think of the Shah (and like others here, I don't think much of him), one of his defining things was taking control away from the turbans so that women could dress as they wanted. Without a religious police to tell them to throw a chador over that miniskirt. Why do you think the mullahs hated the shah so much?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

I am interested in knowing where, in this world, women are FORCED to wear a miniskirt or a bikini?????

They're not.

In fact, I wore shorter skirts (not minis) through my early 30s- pre-kids. I CHOSE to wear them and then I CHOSE to stop wearing them.

Muslima - What's your comeback for this?

Not Muslima, but I'm guessing what "forced" you stop wearing them is that you no longer looked good in them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

These aren't lies.

We are a product of our environment. And you're a perfect example of that.

My children are being raised in an atheist household. However, I will indeed encourage them to take a comparative religions class in HS (if offered) and college. I was raised Catholic. So I know the bible. We talk about religion.

And b/c we TALK, my daughter is not being brainwashed into believing that she must walk around covering - and that goes for Amish and sects of Judaism and Islam. can't excite a man! God forbid I should have hormones and a vagina!

You're in such denial that it's simply pathetic.

It's so easy to turn to the quran to find an answer - much easier than finding it in yourself, eh?

You are a perfect mother. You are raising perfect children. Anyone who isn't raising children exactly like you must be brainwashed, and has to be taken away to the re-education camps. They must prove they have freedom of choice by choosing what you approve. If they happen to choose something different, they must be re-educated until they learn to choose the right thing.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

I am interested in knowing where, in this world, women are FORCED to wear a miniskirt or a bikini?????

They're not.

In fact, I wore shorter skirts (not minis) through my early 30s- pre-kids. I CHOSE to wear them and then I CHOSE to stop wearing them.

Muslima - What's your comeback for this?

Keep telling that to yourself

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

I am interested in knowing where, in this world, women are FORCED to wear a miniskirt or a bikini?????

They're not.

In fact, I wore shorter skirts (not minis) through my early 30s- pre-kids. I CHOSE to wear them and then I CHOSE to stop wearing them.

Muslima - What's your comeback for this?

Not Muslima, but I'm guessing what "forced" you stop wearing them is that you no longer looked good in them.

I can still pull it off now, as my body is in good shape -better than it was pre-babies. However, as a working mother of two, I'm not out socializing much. And minis - while cute - are not the typical office "uniform," which is where I spend many, many hours.

So yes, I CHOOSE not to wear them - but for different reasons.