Ok can we stop saying $300k is "rich" in DC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
300k a year IS rich.

Half that is middle class.

We earn 100K in HHI combined (family of 4) and while we are obliged to be careful, we cannot by any stretch of the imagination call ourselves poor. It's still middle class, and in some part of the country, that would make us rich!

Yes, you are lower middle class in DC. 300k looks rich to you because it's more than double your income, but it's not rich. Your perspective is skewed. People making 50k here are straight up poor. The posters harping that people making 50k are middle class are delusional. We have plenty of medical assistants in our clinic with hhi 50-60k. Their finances are miserable. Zero retirement, perpetual renters, and they work like dogs for their wages. They splurge now and then, probably so they don't go crazy. Does that sound middle class?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

You either have a warped world view or have a lot more debts than we do. We make $300K and have one nine year old. We went on several international vacations and are hosting a cookout for 15 of DD's friends this weekend at the pool that we belong to for no reason at all other than we feel like it. I think our life is quite different than someone making 50K. Now, granted, we only need to pay for college for one kid, but we've been funding her 529 since her birth.

1 kid? You just rebutted your own argument. That's $400k less you need to save for college. Enjoy the pool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

You either have a warped world view or have a lot more debts than we do. We make $300K and have one nine year old. We went on several international vacations and are hosting a cookout for 15 of DD's friends this weekend at the pool that we belong to for no reason at all other than we feel like it. I think our life is quite different than someone making 50K. Now, granted, we only need to pay for college for one kid, but we've been funding her 529 since her birth.

1 kid? You just rebutted your own argument. That's $400k less you need to save for college. Enjoy the pool.

+1. I wonder why PP only has 1 kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

You either have a warped world view or have a lot more debts than we do. We make $300K and have one nine year old. We went on several international vacations and are hosting a cookout for 15 of DD's friends this weekend at the pool that we belong to for no reason at all other than we feel like it. I think our life is quite different than someone making 50K. Now, granted, we only need to pay for college for one kid, but we've been funding her 529 since her birth.

1 kid? You just rebutted your own argument. That's $400k less you need to save for college. Enjoy the pool.

Paying for college is a choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

If you didn't SPEND all of your income for an expensive house in the most desirable parts of town, you would realize that you are, in fact, rich.

If you bought the same size house you have in PG County as you have in MoCo or NoVa, or if you bought the same size house in SE instead of NW, then you would probably have a lot more disposable income every month and would have the various perks that would make you feel rich. You would be able to fully fund your retirement, your college funds, get better cars and take more vacations and not feel the pinch.

You are rich. But you have chosen to SPEND your wealth on competing with others for the most desirable areas of town. You made your choice. If you were truly middle class, you wouldn't even be able to compete for houses in those areas. You'd be lucky to compete for condos in those same areas.

[Anonymous]

paying for kids' college is only something that the rich can afford

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
300k a year IS rich.

Half that is middle class.

We earn 100K in HHI combined (family of 4) and while we are obliged to be careful, we cannot by any stretch of the imagination call ourselves poor. It's still middle class, and in some part of the country, that would make us rich!

Yes, you are lower middle class in DC. 300k looks rich to you because it's more than double your income, but it's not rich. Your perspective is skewed. People making 50k here are straight up poor. The posters harping that people making 50k are middle class are delusional. We have plenty of medical assistants in our clinic with hhi 50-60k. Their finances are miserable. Zero retirement, perpetual renters, and they work like dogs for their wages. They splurge now and then, probably so they don't go crazy. Does that sound middle class?

Actually, yes. This is how the vast majority of people in the US live, and those at the middle of the income distribution. Even if the COL is low, you aren't maxing out your 401K at 50K/year. People who are middle class generally have a roof over their heads, clean water, clothes to wear, and enough to eat, but they rent (or own a house much less nice than is deemed appropriate on this site), have no retirement, and work like dogs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Yes, you are lower middle class in DC. 300k looks rich to you because it's more than double your income, but it's not rich. Your perspective is skewed. People making 50k here are straight up poor. The posters harping that people making 50k are middle class are delusional. We have plenty of medical assistants in our clinic with hhi 50-60k. Their finances are miserable. Zero retirement, perpetual renters, and they work like dogs for their wages. They splurge now and then, probably so they don't go crazy. Does that sound middle class?

Yes. That's what slashing the social safety net and basically having a dog-eat-dog society does to the middle class. But that doesn't mean that income level isn't middle class. If you think their situations are bad (and I agree they are), take a look at those of the truly destitute.

You are insisting that you aren't rich based on your perception of what rich should be. But statistics say otherwise. The problem is that a middle income can no longer support a decent lifestyle...not that people are arguing that 5-10%-ers are rich.

-- $600-700K HHI, so this isn't about me envying your lot

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

If you didn't SPEND all of your income for an expensive house in the most desirable parts of town, you would realize that you are, in fact, rich.

If you bought the same size house you have in PG County as you have in MoCo or NoVa, or if you bought the same size house in SE instead of NW, then you would probably have a lot more disposable income every month and would have the various perks that would make you feel rich. You would be able to fully fund your retirement, your college funds, get better cars and take more vacations and not feel the pinch.

You are rich. But you have chosen to SPEND your wealth on competing with others for the most desirable areas of town. You made your choice. If you were truly middle class, you wouldn't even be able to compete for houses in those areas. You'd be lucky to compete for condos in those same areas.

So you admit that the only way someone in DC making 300k can afford to fully fund retirement and college funds, get better cars and take more vacations is to live in violent areas with lousy schools, and you think this proves they are rich?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

This

For a two-income couple in DC making 300k, if one makes 200k and the other makes 100k, the entire second income is taxed at 51.6 percent (35 percent federal - AMT phaseout bracket, 8.95 percent DC, 7.65 percent SS/Medicare).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

If you didn't SPEND all of your income for an expensive house in the most desirable parts of town, you would realize that you are, in fact, rich.

If you bought the same size house you have in PG County as you have in MoCo or NoVa, or if you bought the same size house in SE instead of NW, then you would probably have a lot more disposable income every month and would have the various perks that would make you feel rich. You would be able to fully fund your retirement, your college funds, get better cars and take more vacations and not feel the pinch.

You are rich. But you have chosen to SPEND your wealth on competing with others for the most desirable areas of town. You made your choice. If you were truly middle class, you wouldn't even be able to compete for houses in those areas. You'd be lucky to compete for condos in those same areas.

So you admit that the only way someone in DC making 300k can afford to fully fund retirement and college funds, get better cars and take more vacations is to live in violent areas with lousy schools, and you think this proves they are rich?

Yes, it does. Not just billionaires are rich. You are lower rich class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

If you didn't SPEND all of your income for an expensive house in the most desirable parts of town, you would realize that you are, in fact, rich.

If you bought the same size house you have in PG County as you have in MoCo or NoVa, or if you bought the same size house in SE instead of NW, then you would probably have a lot more disposable income every month and would have the various perks that would make you feel rich. You would be able to fully fund your retirement, your college funds, get better cars and take more vacations and not feel the pinch.

You are rich. But you have chosen to SPEND your wealth on competing with others for the most desirable areas of town. You made your choice. If you were truly middle class, you wouldn't even be able to compete for houses in those areas. You'd be lucky to compete for condos in those same areas.

So you admit that the only way someone in DC making 300k can afford to fully fund retirement and college funds, get better cars and take more vacations is to live in violent areas with lousy schools, and you think this proves they are rich?

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

This

For a two-income couple in DC making 300k, if one makes 200k and the other makes 100k, the entire second income is taxed at 51.6 percent (35 percent federal - AMT phaseout bracket, 8.95 percent DC, 7.65 percent SS/Medicare).

What's your point? Progressive tax rate. Yours first 200k are not tax at that rate. Nice try. In the worst possible case (self employed, no deductions besides state tax, no kids) you get 44%, very easy to run the numbers. Doubt it's you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:$300k in high COL areas is far from rich. You get all the negatives of actually being rich like high taxes. But none of the support of being poor like college financial aid for children. $250-$500k is an economic death zone. Sure you may get a better annual vacation or nicer car than someone making $50k, but the day to day quality of life is not that much different.

This

For a two-income couple in DC making 300k, if one makes 200k and the other makes 100k, the entire second income is taxed at 51.6 percent (35 percent federal - AMT phaseout bracket, 8.95 percent DC, 7.65 percent SS/Medicare).

What's your point? Progressive tax rate. Yours first 200k are not tax at that rate. Nice try. In the worst possible case (self employed, no deductions besides state tax, no kids) you get 44%, very easy to run the numbers. Doubt it's you.

Point is that we are taxed like rich people, but can't afford a four bedroom house with a small yard, decent public schools, and less than 45 minute commute - which seems like something rich people should be able to afford. And is something that is easily affordable in most parts of the country on 200k which has a much lower tax burden.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
300k a year IS rich.

Half that is middle class.

We earn 100K in HHI combined (family of 4) and while we are obliged to be careful, we cannot by any stretch of the imagination call ourselves poor. It's still middle class, and in some part of the country, that would make us rich!

Yes, you are lower middle class in DC. 300k looks rich to you because it's more than double your income, but it's not rich. Your perspective is skewed. People making 50k here are straight up poor. The posters harping that people making 50k are middle class are delusional. We have plenty of medical assistants in our clinic with hhi 50-60k. Their finances are miserable. Zero retirement, perpetual renters, and they work like dogs for their wages. They splurge now and then, probably so they don't go crazy. Does that sound middle class?

+1

50k a year, post tax would be about 3k/mo, on top of that, minus health insurance, other benefits deducted. Rent around here is 2000/mo for *absolute crap* apts. So even if you shack up with roommates, you would have nothing. Left with nothing. This is poverty wages in DC, not middle class.

I suspect lots of people here don't live in DC, but chime in and swagger and talk like they know something.