I'm telling my kids to go to the UK for undergrad

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am English, and am telling my kids to go to University in the UK anyway, because the education is better. I just don't know if they will be able to get in anywhere good after going through the system here.

Only people from the UK think UK colleges and universities are better. Cambridgea and Oxford are world class schools, but they are still behind a number of US institutions.

http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2015.html

says some stupid ranking. i'd put Cambridge and Oxford against ANY U.S. University.

I have to agree. Oxbridge over any US university - except for the hard sciences, where i think MIT etc are a little ahead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

From the Law Society of the UK.

Here are some examples of friends who changed majors at US universities. If you assure me that each of these changes is possible at a UK university, I will stand down

Engineering to Math and Scandinavian Studies
Chemistry to English literature
Biochemistry to Biology
Biology to American History
Political Science to Economics
Physics to physics with an English literature minor

The fact that you can switch from engineering to scandinavian studies tells you how shallow the US undergrad courses are. This is for dilettantes, not a serious education.

I studied history for my undergraduate degree. I became an economist, my friends who studied the subject became lawyers, journalists, producers, script writers, academics. I know people who studied medicine that now work in the City or media. So your statement that you need to choose a career path at 17 is simply incorrect. The purpose of your undergraduate degree is to give you a solid foundation in an area of study, to teach you how to research, to think, and to express your ideas. The subject is irrelevant in the vast majority of cases.

I agree with you that for many professions, the undergraduate degree's subject is not particularly important. In subjects that require math and lab skills that build on each other, this would be less true. However, it is this flexibility that I think is lacking in the UK. My friend who majored in engineering had taken many of the early prerequisites for a math major, since there is some overlap. He was therefore easily able to switch. He did this at UC Berkeley, not a university known for its "shallow" education. He added Scandinavian studies as a minor. He went on to do a PhD in math at a top program.In the UK, he would only have been able to make that switch if the A levels required were the same and both fields issued offers of similar grades at A level.

I'm particularly interested in how you became an economist with a history degree. I too am an economist. To apply to a US PhD program in economics, you need math at least through mu!ltivariate calculus, preferably differential equations. You also need some statistics on your transcript. In the US, with 4 year degrees and much broader degree require!ents, it's relatively easy to fulfill these requirements while majoring in something other than economics. In the UK, with three year degrees and most of your coursework in your major field, how did you pull this off? Especially if you hadn't done Maths and Further Maths at A-level?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What about University of Edinburgh?

Great beer, and amazing history, nearby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

From the Law Society of the UK.

Here are some examples of friends who changed majors at US universities. If you assure me that each of these changes is possible at a UK university, I will stand down

Engineering to Math and Scandinavian Studies
Chemistry to English literature
Biochemistry to Biology
Biology to American History
Political Science to Economics
Physics to physics with an English literature minor

The fact that you can switch from engineering to scandinavian studies tells you how shallow the US undergrad courses are. This is for dilettantes, not a serious education.

I studied history for my undergraduate degree. I became an economist, my friends who studied the subject became lawyers, journalists, producers, script writers, academics. I know people who studied medicine that now work in the City or media. So your statement that you need to choose a career path at 17 is simply incorrect. The purpose of your undergraduate degree is to give you a solid foundation in an area of study, to teach you how to research, to think, and to express your ideas. The subject is irrelevant in the vast majority of cases.

I agree with you that for many professions, the undergraduate degree's subject is not particularly important. In subjects that require math and lab skills that build on each other, this would be less true. However, it is this flexibility that I think is lacking in the UK. My friend who majored in engineering had taken many of the early prerequisites for a math major, since there is some overlap. He was therefore easily able to switch. He did this at UC Berkeley, not a university known for its "shallow" education. He added Scandinavian studies as a minor. He went on to do a PhD in math at a top program.In the UK, he would only have been able to make that switch if the A levels required were the same and both fields issued offers of similar grades at A level.

I'm particularly interested in how you became an economist with a history degree. I too am an economist. To apply to a US PhD program in economics, you need math at least through mu!ltivariate calculus, preferably differential equations. You also need some statistics on your transcript. In the US, with 4 year degrees and much broader degree require!ents, it's relatively easy to fulfill these requirements while majoring in something other than economics. In the UK, with three year degrees and most of your coursework in your major field, how did you pull this off? Especially if you hadn't done Maths and Further Maths at A-level?

Not from the UK...but I learned differential equations in high school, so I had more flexibility in undergrad as I had already covered the basics in different domains.

Maybe US undergrad is catch-up time for what many didn't do in high school?

[Anonymous]

I have had occasion to work with Canadian and Oxbridge educated Brits. My Canadian and US colleagues often remark on how different the Brits are from us in the way they think.

They are very good in coming up with elegant concepts, but as soon as one scratches below the surface it becomes pretty obvious to the North Americans they are simply not operational. For us, having something that is operational is critical; not so much to the Brits.

Perhaps the way they are educated?

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure if I would trust a Chinese ranking of world universities.

I'm an Ivy alum, both undergrad and grad, and know there's more to a great college/university education than so called rankings. Most rankings are tied to the quality of research output and many of not most of the school's undergraduates have next to no relationship with that (graduate level is a different topic). I had world famous professors who were terrible teachers, and other professors who had no prestige but who were fabulous teachers and I learned much more from them.

When the time comes I'm strongly encouraging my kids to look at liberal arts colleges rather than brand name universities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am English, and am telling my kids to go to University in the UK anyway, because the education is better. I just don't know if they will be able to get in anywhere good after going through the system here.

Only people from the UK think UK colleges and universities are better. Cambridgea and Oxford are world class schools, but they are still behind a number of US institutions.

http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2015.html

The Oxbridge tutorial style of instruction is a wonderful approach to learning. I would be thrilled to send a child to Oxbridge just for that reason alone.

[Anonymous]

have you people been to scotland? it is fucking depressing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not sure if I would trust a Chinese ranking of world universities.

I'm an Ivy alum, both undergrad and grad, and know there's more to a great college/university education than so called rankings. Most rankings are tied to the quality of research output and many of not most of the school's undergraduates have next to no relationship with that (graduate level is a different topic). I had world famous professors who were terrible teachers, and other professors who had no prestige but who were fabulous teachers and I learned much more from them.

When the time comes I'm strongly encouraging my kids to look at liberal arts colleges rather than brand name universities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am English, and am telling my kids to go to University in the UK anyway, because the education is better. I just don't know if they will be able to get in anywhere good after going through the system here.

Only people from the UK think UK colleges and universities are better. Cambridgea and Oxford are world class schools, but they are still behind a number of US institutions.

http://www.shanghairanking.com/ARWU2015.html

The Oxbridge tutorial style of instruction is a wonderful approach to learning. I would be thrilled to send a child to Oxbridge just for that reason alone.

Williams and Swarthmore have similar styles, though not to the same extent.

[Anonymous]

University of Kentucky? Odd choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:University of Kentucky? Odd choice.

We were talking about Kembrich.

[Anonymous]

UK citizenship means you have a right to move and live in the country. If you want the residency rates to attend university, you need to have had established residency for 4 years.

I would not go as far as worry about the kid missing out on overrated US college experience. Networking does not happen, most people loose touch after graduating. Jobs here in the DC area are taken by expats and H1b workers.
You really have nothing to loose by going there. Some US colleges are not so reputable even though they cost a lot of money.
Fortunately it is a system that does not care if you are a legacy or your silly high school extracurricular activities, daddy's money or family name, skin color etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if I'm the only one who saw the topic and thought University of Kentucky?

Yep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have had occasion to work with Canadian and Oxbridge educated Brits. My Canadian and US colleagues often remark on how different the Brits are from us in the way they think.

They are very good in coming up with elegant concepts, but as soon as one scratches below the surface it becomes pretty obvious to the North Americans they are simply not operational. For us, having something that is operational is critical; not so much to the Brits.

Perhaps the way they are educated?

A person I know works for a big 3 in international tax accounting. This friend said the same thing about Americans, that their knowledge was less deep than their internationally educated counterparts. I really think it has to do with specific people, possibly the major and what school you went to both in the US and UK.

We are making quite a sweeping generalization here. There are smart/talented people from both sides, notwithstanding what university they went to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am English, and am telling my kids to go to University in the UK anyway, because the education is better. I just don't know if they will be able to get in anywhere good after going through the system here.

I know, right??!

I'm German and while I know we'll only be here a few years, I worry the school system here will dumb our kids down. They'll have a lot of catching up to do when I compare with the levels German kids are at. I would never send them to university over here. Especially since college in Germany is completely free!
I've taken a few classes over here myself and have never seen so many lazy uneducated people at a university level. They need to sort them out, like many European countries do. The fact is, not everybody should go to college. But of course here it's all about money. That's the problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am English, and am telling my kids to go to University in the UK anyway, because the education is better. I just don't know if they will be able to get in anywhere good after going through the system here.

I know, right??!

I'm German and while I know we'll only be here a few years, I worry the school system here will dumb our kids down. They'll have a lot of catching up to do when I compare with the levels German kids are at. I would never send them to university over here. Especially since college in Germany is completely free!
I've taken a few classes over here myself and have never seen so many lazy uneducated people at a university level. They need to sort them out, like many European countries do. The fact is, not everybody should go to college. But of course here it's all about money. That's the problem.

I wish more German universities had courses (majors) taught in English. What do you feel are the top schools in Germany? I had friends do grad programs at TUM and they all enjoyed it.