House budget of $450k. Looking for good schools. Where to buy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Friends of mine really love the Westlawn and Sleepy Hollow Elementary area. Great walking communities. FARMS rates are high, but the class sizes are lower.

Sleepy hollow ES is fine, but the middle school and high school are not.

Do you speak from experience? I live in that area and the people I know who send their kids to Glasgow and Stuart are happy with them.

The Valley Brook part of 22042 (near sleepy hollow road, feeds into Glasgow/Stuart, with a Level IV elementary school (Beech Tree) is also nice with good neighbors/schools.

No one doubts that there are good elementary schools that feed bad high schools. But what do you do after elementary school?

[Anonymous]

As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

If you want to compare apples to apples, the numerical number for each demographic is compared to the state average of that said demographic . Meaning 3 or 4 rating of Hispanics is bad compared to a 9 Hispanic rating elsewhere in the state.

So your theory doesn't hold water.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

If you want to compare apples to apples, the numerical number for each demographic is compared to the state average of that said demographic . Meaning 3 or 4 rating of Hispanics is bad compared to a 9 Hispanic rating elsewhere in the state.

So your theory doesn't hold water.

Can someone link me to the source of these SOL pass rates by race per school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can someone link me to the source of these SOL pass rates by race per school?

Select the customized school achievement records link:

http://www.doe.virginia.gov/statistics_reports/school_report_card/

[Anonymous]

^^customized school achievement reports

[Anonymous]

So this is a stupid questions but why do people have preference between IB and AP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So this is a stupid questions but why do people have preference between IB and AP?

Can open

Worms everywhere

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So this is a stupid questions but why do people have preference between IB and AP?

Can open

Worms everywhere

LOL!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

And that would affect smart kids how? This constant focus on test scores as a measure of how your kids will do in a school is really ridiculous. I suspect my son would have gotten a near-perfect score on the SAT no matter where he went. He also knows a senior from Edison who is going to Harvard --- which rejected plenty of his TJ friends.

Go see the schools you're interested in. Talk to the teachers. Can you picture your child there? So many DCUM posters are such lemmings they can only appreciate a school when some magazine ranks it and it's bursting at the seams from overcrowding. When we moved here nearly 10 years ago, people didn't give our elementary school a second thought. It's now an AAP center and *surprise* house prices have gone up as people rush to move to the neighborhood. Things change here really quickly and many schools have outpaced their supposedly bad reputations. Some of the best situations in terms of teaching and class size are now at schools well-outside of popular areas like McLean or Vienna. But the only way you're going to find that out is to go there and investigate for yourself.

No school is perfect -- two of the highest rated schools in the area Langley and Woods are also leading FCPS in suicides.

[Anonymous]

I meant Langley and Woodson High Schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

If you want to compare apples to apples, the numerical number for each demographic is compared to the state average of that said demographic . Meaning 3 or 4 rating of Hispanics is bad compared to a 9 Hispanic rating elsewhere in the state.

So your theory doesn't hold water.

Please provide proof of your assertion (bolded). I believe the comparison group is the state as a whole -- there would be no point in comparing the lowest groups against themselves. The only valuable data would be a comparison to students in Va. overall. But, even if you are correct, it doesn't change anything. What I'm saying is not a "theory" -- it's a fact that if you have high performing students and low performing students, the average of all of them will be somewhere in between. That is not a "theory." Schools that have very few minorities or low income students are obviously going to have higher scores. So what. Compare those schools (or groups) to similar sub-groups in schools that are diverse. That's a fair comparison.

Please show your source. I'll look for the opposite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

And that would affect smart kids how? This constant focus on test scores as a measure of how your kids will do in a school is really ridiculous. I suspect my son would have gotten a near-perfect score on the SAT no matter where he went. He also knows a senior from Edison who is going to Harvard --- which rejected plenty of his TJ friends.

Go see the schools you're interested in. Talk to the teachers. Can you picture your child there? So many DCUM posters are such lemmings they can only appreciate a school when some magazine ranks it and it's bursting at the seams from overcrowding. When we moved here nearly 10 years ago, people didn't give our elementary school a second thought. It's now an AAP center and *surprise* house prices have gone up as people rush to move to the neighborhood. Things change here really quickly and many schools have outpaced their supposedly bad reputations. Some of the best situations in terms of teaching and class size are now at schools well-outside of popular areas like McLean or Vienna. But the only way you're going to find that out is to go there and investigate for yourself.

No school is perfect -- two of the highest rated schools in the area Langley and Woods are also leading FCPS in suicides.

Controversy over disciplinary policies[edit]
Fairfax County Public Schools have been criticized for the Fairfax County school system disciplinary process, which has been blamed for the recent suicides of two students: Josh Anderson of South Lakes High School and Nick Stuban of W.T. Woodson High School.[16] In February 2011, responding to the criticism by County Supervisors Catherine Hudgins and Penelope Gross, Superintendent Jack D. Dale maintained that the disciplinary policy did not constitute "zero tolerance" and said that Hudgins' statements associating the disciplinary process with the suicides "for the purpose of furthering a falsehood" was "unconscionable and a blow to those who have already suffered great pain." FCPS has since agreed to review its disciplinary procedures.[17]

Prior to the above incident Kilmer Middle had a strict rule/policy of "no physical contact", meaning that contact such as high fives or hugs between friends were not allowed. The FCPS stood behind the rule and refused to rescind the rule. The issue was brought to light after a 13-year-old student was reprimanded for putting his arm around his girlfriend during a break, and his parents wrote to the Fairfax County School Board.[18][3][4][5][6][7]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

And that would affect smart kids how? This constant focus on test scores as a measure of how your kids will do in a school is really ridiculous. I suspect my son would have gotten a near-perfect score on the SAT no matter where he went. He also knows a senior from Edison who is going to Harvard --- which rejected plenty of his TJ friends.

Go see the schools you're interested in. Talk to the teachers. Can you picture your child there? So many DCUM posters are such lemmings they can only appreciate a school when some magazine ranks it and it's bursting at the seams from overcrowding. When we moved here nearly 10 years ago, people didn't give our elementary school a second thought. It's now an AAP center and *surprise* house prices have gone up as people rush to move to the neighborhood. Things change here really quickly and many schools have outpaced their supposedly bad reputations. Some of the best situations in terms of teaching and class size are now at schools well-outside of popular areas like McLean or Vienna. But the only way you're going to find that out is to go there and investigate for yourself.

No school is perfect -- two of the highest rated schools in the area Langley and Woods are also leading FCPS in suicides.

Controversy over disciplinary policies[edit]
Fairfax County Public Schools have been criticized for the Fairfax County school system disciplinary process, which has been blamed for the recent suicides of two students: Josh Anderson of South Lakes High School and Nick Stuban of W.T. Woodson High School.[16] In February 2011, responding to the criticism by County Supervisors Catherine Hudgins and Penelope Gross, Superintendent Jack D. Dale maintained that the disciplinary policy did not constitute "zero tolerance" and said that Hudgins' statements associating the disciplinary process with the suicides "for the purpose of furthering a falsehood" was "unconscionable and a blow to those who have already suffered great pain." FCPS has since agreed to review its disciplinary procedures.[17]

Prior to the above incident Kilmer Middle had a strict rule/policy of "no physical contact", meaning that contact such as high fives or hugs between friends were not allowed. The FCPS stood behind the rule and refused to rescind the rule. The issue was brought to light after a 13-year-old student was reprimanded for putting his arm around his girlfriend during a break, and his parents wrote to the Fairfax County School Board.[18][3][4][5][6][7]

Although the above issues have been resolved, not all the Suicides can be linked to over achieving if any at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As long as there are apartment units feeding into Edison (think Rose Hill and along Franconia Rd.) or into Hayfield (think Lorton along Rt. 1) -- there will always be significant diversity of color, wealth, and academic motivation. That is not going to change until the housing style changes. The same can be said for South Lakes and Herndon. The HS that don't have any apartments feeding into them will always be wealthier and whiter and have higher scores.

If you look at the test scores for Twain MS, Clermont, Island Creek, Lorton Station, and Hayfield Elementary -- you see that at each school, the white and asian kids have SOL pass rates that are an 8 or 9 out of 10 (compared to all kids in the state). That's comparable to many of the schools that people are always bragging about. Hayfield ES and Island Creek ES are the "best" (highest scoring, highest income, lowest FARMS) schools that feed into Hayfield HS. The other schools that feed into it have much higher FARMS rates and the black and hispanic pass rates are "3" or "4" out of 10 (meaning they are lower than the average pass rate across the state). It's going to pull the average passing rate down. It doesn't mean that the school is bad. It's really about the types of housing (and therefore wealth or lack of wealth) that feed into a school.

Mix of housing = mixed bag of achievement (test scores).

And that would affect smart kids how? This constant focus on test scores as a measure of how your kids will do in a school is really ridiculous. I suspect my son would have gotten a near-perfect score on the SAT no matter where he went. He also knows a senior from Edison who is going to Harvard --- which rejected plenty of his TJ friends.

Go see the schools you're interested in. Talk to the teachers. Can you picture your child there? So many DCUM posters are such lemmings they can only appreciate a school when some magazine ranks it and it's bursting at the seams from overcrowding. When we moved here nearly 10 years ago, people didn't give our elementary school a second thought. It's now an AAP center and *surprise* house prices have gone up as people rush to move to the neighborhood. Things change here really quickly and many schools have outpaced their supposedly bad reputations. Some of the best situations in terms of teaching and class size are now at schools well-outside of popular areas like McLean or Vienna. But the only way you're going to find that out is to go there and investigate for yourself.

No school is perfect -- two of the highest rated schools in the area Langley and Woods are also leading FCPS in suicides.

I'm the PP you quoted -- I think we are in agreement. I don't think it affects my kids to go to a HS that has a mixed bag of achievement. I think people get swept away by the composite scores of schools as though it is some source team pride (kind of like "my college's team won the NCAA championship so I must be something special... never mind that I had nothing to do with it and the championship has nothing to do with the quality of my education... but hey -- aren't we great.)