Arguing with DS over major
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Anonymous
do not take CS as a major it is a dead-end career. Study biology or medicine or chemistry. Professor at Duke and Stanford -> In his roles at Stanford and Duke, Wadhwa lectures in class on subjects such as entrepreneurship and public policy, helps prepare students for the real world, and leads groundbreaking research projects. Finally, I don’t know of any university, including the ones I teach at, that tells its engineering students what to expect in the long term or how to manage their technical careers. Perhaps it is time to let students know what lies ahead and prepare them for their difficult careers. They don’t prepare you for this in college or admit it in job interviews. The harsh reality is that if you are middle-aged, write computer code for a living, and earn a six-figure salary, you’re headed for the unemployment lines. Your market value declines as you age and it becomes harder and harder to get a job. see -> http://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20130422020049-8451-the-tech-industry-s-darkest-secret-it-s-all-about-age |
Anonymous
I agree that OP doesn't seem to care if her son is happy or has any passion for his future career...but I've been part of hiring committees and it's definitely obvious when someone is just there for some job, any job vs. really wanting that particular job. Is it better to go with mom and dad's major and flounder on the job hunt or pick something you're actually passionate about and really want to do for a living? |
Anonymous
getting an undergraduate degree in a basic science leads you to being a labtech UNLESS you get into med school....even phd life science people lament over doing postdoc after postdoc struggling to find a good job in their field. A CS degree from a top school puts you on the radar for banking, consulting, trading, industry, tech, startups, etc. As i said, CS is less about programming prowess and more about logic and applied math. You don't have to be a code monkey....the CS grads I know went to work as prop traders, strategy consultants, product managers at google and microsoft and dropbox, M&A bankers on TMT teams at top banks...none will have 'middle aged engineer' issues. |
Anonymous
You're clueless. I feel sorry for your kid. I was a business major and then a CPA- very practical and I had a job right out of school making good money. I was miserable though, and ending up going back to grad school and changing careers to something much less lucrative, but fulfilling. You can't and shouldn't try to game out your child's life to what would seem to give him the best chance for a job unless you are equally willing to deal with the fallout and pay for the therapy bills. |
Anonymous
You're clueless. I feel sorry for your kid. I was a business major and then a CPA- very practical and I had a job right out of school making good money. I was miserable though, and ending up going back to grad school and changing careers to something much less lucrative, but fulfilling. You can't and shouldn't try to game out your child's life to what would seem to give him the best chance for a job unless you are equally willing to deal with the fallout and pay for the therapy bills. OP, this and another one of your posts make it sound like you're not native to the US? I appreciate that you struggled to provide for your kids. But maybe you need to reframe your goals for your kid: your struggle was to provide for your kids' future happiness in a fulfilling career, not to meet a certain dollar earnings bottom line. |
Anonymous
Reposting with corrected formatting and another job.
OP, this and another one of your posts make it sound like you're not native to the US? I appreciate that you struggled to provide for your kids. But maybe you need to reframe your goals for your kid: your struggle was to provide for your kids' future happiness in a fulfilling career, not to meet a certain dollar earnings bottom line. Even history majors aren't homeless. He may end up working for 2-3 years in a rewarding but dead-end job a non-profit before he decides to go to grad school for something practical. FWIW, I was a history major who went to graduate school for economics. At the time, my professor discouraged me from graduate school in history because academia was experiencing a glut in history PhDs. Fast forward 25 years and apparently all the tenured history profs are retiring and there are a lot of history positions in academia. |
Anonymous
Huh? Did you actually try to get one of those positions? It's near impossible to get tenure-track position these days. |
Anonymous
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NP here
OP, you are doing absolutely the right thing and I would ignore much of the claptrap from some of those who are criticizing you. The reality is that you have a decisive say in how a substantial financial commitment in your son's education should be expended. Many of those who are commenting on the opportunities that became available to them are living in the past. In today's job environment, it is necessary to have the right academic background that will enable one to get a job that pays a decent amount. I think the notion of allowing a 18 year old to make a decision that will affect his future livelihood is idiotic because most kids that age will not be able to relate to the economic realities that will face them after they finish college. All this nonsense about kids following their passion is hogwash. We just got through visiting with friends whose daughter followed her "passion" and majored in music and she cannot find a job anywhere. She is now planning on doing a MBA - after her parents expended $150K on her undergrad in music. Totally idiotic ..... and her father urged her to do her major in something else but she wanted to follow her passion. Counselors - both school and college - are part of the problem with this nonsense about following their passion except that they are not going to be around when it comes to paying off any student loans. We have three children and we made it clear to them that we would pay for their college only if they majored in fields that had potential for a job. Today, two have a MBA from excellent business schools after getting the right work experience subsequent to their undergrad degree. The third is a physician. The only thing I would recommend in your situation with your son is to tell him that you will support him if he majors in any area where he will have a decent chance of getting a job. He can do a minor in his "passion" if it is that important to him. Good luck |
Anonymous
NY Times had an article about how academia needs history PhDs. |
Anonymous
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Be prepared to lose your relationship with your son. My parents heavily pushed specific majors and schools. I lasted 1 semester in "their" choice, before dropping out, moving cross country to "my" choice and enrolling in my major. 10+ years later, my father still expresses disappointment in my choices.
I am not wealthy, but completely self sufficient and have filled my life with people who love me and respect my ability to make adult choices. I see my parents once every couple years now. Our relationship has never fully recovered. |
Anonymous
It's all relative. The academic job market for certain areas may be relatively better than it has been in the past few years due to the cycle of people retiring. Then you're looking at a job market that is tough but doable if you are really an exceptional candidate (say, 50-60 poisons for thousands of qualified candidates) compared to virtually impossible (less than five positions for thousands of qualified candidates). |
Anonymous
OP, you sound like the South Asian father of a former student of mine. When she decided to major in sociology instead of chemistry, she had to move out of the house. She's a lawyer now. Yes, a nursing major is probably easier if a kid doesn't know how to figure out what they want to do and is reluctant to network and pursue internships. But, as a former theology major who is now a PhD researcher, I know it's possible to major in something economically "useless" and still go on to make a good living. |
Anonymous
But if the kid gets into a good PhD program as a research or teaching assistant, he will pay his own way so getting a second degree isn't always a huge investment. |
Anonymous
OP here: of course I care about my son's happiness. How happy do you think he will be when he is unemployed and living with us at age 30 because he can't get a job with his history degree? I am enforcing this because I care about his happiness not just now but in 10-20 years. As someone said, I was not born in the US, I grew up in the Ukraine. I got really lucky to move to first the uK for my education, and then to DC after I graduated. Through this I realized that you can't always get what you want, sometimes you have to make the harder choice now to improve your life for the future (choosing engineering rather then history). Of course we all want to marry a superstar and not have to work a day in our lives, but for the vast majority of us that will just not happon. |
Anonymous
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OP, I majored in art history with a minor in classics!! Now I work for a major cultural institution and earn $90,000/year. I realize that's probably pocket change to you, but it's enough for me and I'm happy.
DH majored in political science and now is an executive. My brother majored in history with a minor in Russian and now he is a lawyer. My sister majored in history with a minor in French and now she is a public defender. All of us would have died a slow death if we'd been forced to major in business, accounting, engineering, computer science etc. And all of us can write well and enjoy a real life of the mind. I hope your DS realizes that age 18 he will be autonomous and will move out of your house and figure out on his own how to go to college through working and loans and study what he wants. |