Talk to me about McKinley

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We thought the physical plant at McKinley was great, especially the engineering lab. The teachers also seemed dedicated and accomplished.

Unfortunately, for us, we were hoping the school was akin to Blair Magnet or TJ, but it is absolutely not anywhere close. We wish DCPS would transform McKinley into a DC TJ, but that doesn't seem like it will ever happen.

The commute was too much for us as well...if it was located where Walls is located (or anywhere in central DC) then the calculation would have been different

There just aren't that many educated/education-pushing households with high school aged kids in DC compared to the TJ or Blair catchment areas.

Banneker is the DC TJ

This may be the most delusional thing I've read on this very bizarre board! Banneker is great at what it does . But it's not in the same galaxy as TJ.

+100. Get real, people. There is not a TJ equivalent in DC. Full stop.

There isn't. However, does there really need to be?

There are students who could use a top-tier science high school. My DC is one of them.

So move and get your DC into a magnet. Then you’ll be on the MoCo or AAP board obsessing over how your “cogat 262” kid did not get admitted or whatever. It ain’t pretty over there.

Walls or Banneker can provide plenty of challenges for a kid who actually is bright and science-focused. (McKinley I think the jury is still out.) DC doesn’t need another selective HS - it needs better MS and ES instruction.

Thoughtful suggestion, but we can't move out of DC.

And no, Walls and Banneker do not have sufficient advanced science offerings. J-R is more promising, but then again, it is a neighborhood high school and not the one we are zoned for.

There is no reason that a city the size of DC shouldn't have programs suitable for strong STEM students. McKinley is the right idea, but it isn't high-level enough for top students.

Since when do HS students have to have “advanced science offerings” to be able to handle science courses in college? SWW has 4 AP science classes and 3 AP math classes. It also has AP seminar and AP research that can be a platform for a STEM project.

Does Walls offer those courses consistently? The website says they have to have at least 15 students to offer the course.

And a science-loving student would have no trouble handling college science offerings. But they have little chance of getting in top science colleges (like MIT or CalTech) if they have had no chance to show that they are at all competitive with students from the many, many high schools around the country with strong STEM offerings.

I don't understand why anyone is conflating college acceptances with a student's interests. There are Walls kids getting into MIT because Math is really most important and you are also generally judged more against other Walls kids and taking the most rigorous classes offered by the school vs. kids from TJ. However, there are definitely Walls kids that are more interested in STEM and wish it offered more or they had an "acceptable" option at another school.

On the flip side...there are many threads on DCUM from Walls parents complaining about the lack of sports facilities (and facilities in general). They complain even though there is literally nothing that DCPS can or will do about that...and it is head-scratching why they go to Walls when they know full well none of this will change.

I gather it is now acceptable to respond: (i) you don't need good sports to do well academically in college, and (ii) go move to MoCo or VA to a school with great sports facilities.

[Anonymous]

We live close to Banneker but our kid goes to JR. Would have loved mckinley to be a strong option, but it’s not currently a high achieving school. Banneker is a great school for bright and motivated students willing to work hard, but my kid thought it seemed like a grind.

JR has a creative media academy that might be good for OP’s kid.

[Anonymous]

JR poster here. I will say i am not personally impressed with the teaching (or the learning), but it’s free. Socially it’s been a great fit for our kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We live close to Banneker but our kid goes to JR. Would have loved mckinley to be a strong option, but it’s not currently a high achieving school. Banneker is a great school for bright and motivated students willing to work hard, but my kid thought it seemed like a grind.

JR has a creative media academy that might be good for OP’s kid.

In the same boat, though my kid is in 8th grade and doesn't have the JR escape valve. I really want McKinley to be an option, but after the last couple years watching him top out in middle school (both in terms of curriculum challenge and in terms of being surrounded by a large group of high achieving peers), I don't think it's enough. I'm really glad it fills the need it does, though, and it seems like the community is really great.

[Anonymous]

My kid originally ranked Banneker over McKinley Tech then changed it after both of his interviews. He is now attending McKinley Tech.

How do you like McKinley? How does your child like McKinley?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We thought the physical plant at McKinley was great, especially the engineering lab. The teachers also seemed dedicated and accomplished.

Unfortunately, for us, we were hoping the school was akin to Blair Magnet or TJ, but it is absolutely not anywhere close. We wish DCPS would transform McKinley into a DC TJ, but that doesn't seem like it will ever happen.

The commute was too much for us as well...if it was located where Walls is located (or anywhere in central DC) then the calculation would have been different

There just aren't that many educated/education-pushing households with high school aged kids in DC compared to the TJ or Blair catchment areas.

Banneker is the DC TJ

This may be the most delusional thing I've read on this very bizarre board! Banneker is great at what it does . But it's not in the same galaxy as TJ.

+100. Get real, people. There is not a TJ equivalent in DC. Full stop.

There isn't. However, does there really need to be?

My thoughts too. I feel like DC parents with the kind of kids who potentially could be TJ (or Blair or RMIB) students have self-selected to stay in DC because we don’t like that arms race. I feel sorry for those kids. I went to HS with an extremely smart and high-performing cohort (lots of MIT, CalTech, Stanford admissions) but we all just were very laid back in HS with our 5 APs.

Here is a fact. TJ isn’t high pressure and an arms race to students who really need TJ because they are topped out of courses and challenge in the other schools. These kids do really well in addition to balancing extracurricular, clubs, etc…

It’s the students whose parents do alot of outside tutoring and prep who push kids who really don’t belong in TJ and thus don’t have a good experience. Lots of kids in DC who fit above paragraph who are not getting what they need.

[Anonymous]

So seriously, the standard we're setting for McKinley Tech is "how many of its students are going to Caltech?"

Love that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So seriously, the standard we're setting for McKinley Tech is "how many of its students are going to Caltech?"

Love that.

No, McKinley Tech is fine for many science-focused students. But for the kids who have the potential for CalTech, DCPS does not offer a good solution. Don't those students matter too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So seriously, the standard we're setting for McKinley Tech is "how many of its students are going to Caltech?"

Love that.

No, McKinley Tech is fine for many science-focused students. But for the kids who have the potential for CalTech, DCPS does not offer a good solution. Don't those students matter too?

CalTech is only 980 students total...so only about 245 per class. It is my understanding that not a single kid from any DC school (public, private or charter) was admitted to CalTech for the 2023 class. That said, very few applied.

DCPS sends kids to MIT, Ivy League, Stanford, UC schools, Michigan, UVA, etc. every year. Yes, probably 90%+ of those students attend Walls or JR (though McKinley sent some as well...believe the Valedictorian last year is at Cornell). You would agree those are strong schools.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We thought the physical plant at McKinley was great, especially the engineering lab. The teachers also seemed dedicated and accomplished.

Unfortunately, for us, we were hoping the school was akin to Blair Magnet or TJ, but it is absolutely not anywhere close. We wish DCPS would transform McKinley into a DC TJ, but that doesn't seem like it will ever happen.

The commute was too much for us as well...if it was located where Walls is located (or anywhere in central DC) then the calculation would have been different

There just aren't that many educated/education-pushing households with high school aged kids in DC compared to the TJ or Blair catchment areas.

Banneker is the DC TJ

This may be the most delusional thing I've read on this very bizarre board! Banneker is great at what it does . But it's not in the same galaxy as TJ.

+100. Get real, people. There is not a TJ equivalent in DC. Full stop.

There isn't. However, does there really need to be?

There are students who could use a top-tier science high school. My DC is one of them.

So move and get your DC into a magnet. Then you’ll be on the MoCo or AAP board obsessing over how your “cogat 262” kid did not get admitted or whatever. It ain’t pretty over there.

Walls or Banneker can provide plenty of challenges for a kid who actually is bright and science-focused. (McKinley I think the jury is still out.) DC doesn’t need another selective HS - it needs better MS and ES instruction.

Thoughtful suggestion, but we can't move out of DC.

And no, Walls and Banneker do not have sufficient advanced science offerings. J-R is more promising, but then again, it is a neighborhood high school and not the one we are zoned for.

There is no reason that a city the size of DC shouldn't have programs suitable for strong STEM students. McKinley is the right idea, but it isn't high-level enough for top students.

Since when do HS students have to have “advanced science offerings” to be able to handle science courses in college? SWW has 4 AP science classes and 3 AP math classes. It also has AP seminar and AP research that can be a platform for a STEM project.

Does Walls offer those courses consistently? The website says they have to have at least 15 students to offer the course.

And a science-loving student would have no trouble handling college science offerings. But they have little chance of getting in top science colleges (like MIT or CalTech) if they have had no chance to show that they are at all competitive with students from the many, many high schools around the country with strong STEM offerings.

That's just not true. I know many people who went to MIT for undergrad (my husband and best friend both went, so I know dozens and dozens of alums) and many of them came from very mediocre -poor public schools in random small towns. They took the hardest classes available to them, got near perfect SATs and were the top student at their school, but it's just not true that you need to go to a pressure cooker suburban high school like TJ to get in and to do well in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We thought the physical plant at McKinley was great, especially the engineering lab. The teachers also seemed dedicated and accomplished.

Unfortunately, for us, we were hoping the school was akin to Blair Magnet or TJ, but it is absolutely not anywhere close. We wish DCPS would transform McKinley into a DC TJ, but that doesn't seem like it will ever happen.

The commute was too much for us as well...if it was located where Walls is located (or anywhere in central DC) then the calculation would have been different

There just aren't that many educated/education-pushing households with high school aged kids in DC compared to the TJ or Blair catchment areas.

Banneker is the DC TJ

This may be the most delusional thing I've read on this very bizarre board! Banneker is great at what it does . But it's not in the same galaxy as TJ.

+100. Get real, people. There is not a TJ equivalent in DC. Full stop.

There isn't. However, does there really need to be?

There are students who could use a top-tier science high school. My DC is one of them.

So move and get your DC into a magnet. Then you’ll be on the MoCo or AAP board obsessing over how your “cogat 262” kid did not get admitted or whatever. It ain’t pretty over there.

Walls or Banneker can provide plenty of challenges for a kid who actually is bright and science-focused. (McKinley I think the jury is still out.) DC doesn’t need another selective HS - it needs better MS and ES instruction.

Thoughtful suggestion, but we can't move out of DC.

And no, Walls and Banneker do not have sufficient advanced science offerings. J-R is more promising, but then again, it is a neighborhood high school and not the one we are zoned for.

There is no reason that a city the size of DC shouldn't have programs suitable for strong STEM students. McKinley is the right idea, but it isn't high-level enough for top students.

Since when do HS students have to have “advanced science offerings” to be able to handle science courses in college? SWW has 4 AP science classes and 3 AP math classes. It also has AP seminar and AP research that can be a platform for a STEM project.

Does Walls offer those courses consistently? The website says they have to have at least 15 students to offer the course.

And a science-loving student would have no trouble handling college science offerings. But they have little chance of getting in top science colleges (like MIT or CalTech) if they have had no chance to show that they are at all competitive with students from the many, many high schools around the country with strong STEM offerings.

That's just not true. I know many people who went to MIT for undergrad (my husband and best friend both went, so I know dozens and dozens of alums) and many of them came from very mediocre -poor public schools in random small towns. They took the hardest classes available to them, got near perfect SATs and were the top student at their school, but it's just not true that you need to go to a pressure cooker suburban high school like TJ to get in and to do well in college.

Of course you don’t have to go to TJ but many students who go to poorly performing schools and get into top schools do in fact struggle and it’s sink or swim because they are just not exposed to the more advanced course materials, used to more challenging materials, etc…..

Sure a student may be gifted and do well no matter where they came from but we are talking your above average bright student with potential and that potential is not reached fully going to a poorly performing school with low expectations and cursing along with little effort.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We thought the physical plant at McKinley was great, especially the engineering lab. The teachers also seemed dedicated and accomplished.

Unfortunately, for us, we were hoping the school was akin to Blair Magnet or TJ, but it is absolutely not anywhere close. We wish DCPS would transform McKinley into a DC TJ, but that doesn't seem like it will ever happen.

The commute was too much for us as well...if it was located where Walls is located (or anywhere in central DC) then the calculation would have been different

There just aren't that many educated/education-pushing households with high school aged kids in DC compared to the TJ or Blair catchment areas.

Banneker is the DC TJ

This may be the most delusional thing I've read on this very bizarre board! Banneker is great at what it does . But it's not in the same galaxy as TJ.

+100. Get real, people. There is not a TJ equivalent in DC. Full stop.

There isn't. However, does there really need to be?

There are students who could use a top-tier science high school. My DC is one of them.

So move and get your DC into a magnet. Then you’ll be on the MoCo or AAP board obsessing over how your “cogat 262” kid did not get admitted or whatever. It ain’t pretty over there.

Walls or Banneker can provide plenty of challenges for a kid who actually is bright and science-focused. (McKinley I think the jury is still out.) DC doesn’t need another selective HS - it needs better MS and ES instruction.

Thoughtful suggestion, but we can't move out of DC.

And no, Walls and Banneker do not have sufficient advanced science offerings. J-R is more promising, but then again, it is a neighborhood high school and not the one we are zoned for.

There is no reason that a city the size of DC shouldn't have programs suitable for strong STEM students. McKinley is the right idea, but it isn't high-level enough for top students.

Since when do HS students have to have “advanced science offerings” to be able to handle science courses in college? SWW has 4 AP science classes and 3 AP math classes. It also has AP seminar and AP research that can be a platform for a STEM project.

Does Walls offer those courses consistently? The website says they have to have at least 15 students to offer the course.

And a science-loving student would have no trouble handling college science offerings. But they have little chance of getting in top science colleges (like MIT or CalTech) if they have had no chance to show that they are at all competitive with students from the many, many high schools around the country with strong STEM offerings.

That's just not true. I know many people who went to MIT for undergrad (my husband and best friend both went, so I know dozens and dozens of alums) and many of them came from very mediocre -poor public schools in random small towns. They took the hardest classes available to them, got near perfect SATs and were the top student at their school, but it's just not true that you need to go to a pressure cooker suburban high school like TJ to get in and to do well in college.

Of course you don’t have to go to TJ but many students who go to poorly performing schools and get into top schools do in fact struggle and it’s sink or swim because they are just not exposed to the more advanced course materials, used to more challenging materials, etc…..

Sure a student may be gifted and do well no matter where they came from but we are talking your above average bright student with potential and that potential is not reached fully going to a poorly performing school with low expectations and cursing along with little effort.

Typo cruising

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Different students apply to McKinley than Walls. Students from Ward 7 and 8, which make up a big part of the McKinley student body, are not applying to Walls, or at least they weren't a couple of years ago:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/school-without-walls-admissions-test-diversity/2021/08/27/6959cec2-0293-11ec-a664-4f6de3e17ff0_story.html

“It could be that our families have gotten wind that certain schools are not for them, or not supportive of them,” said Carlene Reid, the Ward 8 representative on the D.C. State Board of Education. “I would not trust to put my child in a school that has systemically shut out students from Ward 8.”

“Different” in the sense that they could not be admitted to Walls for academic reasons, but could be admitted to McKinley.

Look, I have a privileged white kid who likely would not have gotten into Walls with the prior more selective criteria, but could get into McKinley. No shame in admitting that!

Test scores haven't been used since prior to COVID. The current criteria are GPA, recommendation letter, interview, and writing sample. It is entirely unclear how SWW is implementing any of those besides GPA, and there are kids with high GPAs who are going to McKinley. You have no idea if they could get admitted and neither do they. They are not applying *because they do not want to go*.

as I wrote, he would not have gotten in under the “prior, more selective criteria.” I still think nobody is choosing McKinley over Walls (or Banneker) but feel free to show me data or anecdotes. also not sure why OP or anyone is defensive about this. It’s all part of the picture in understanding the schools.

I definitely think there are kids choosing McKinley over Walls. If you are interested in taking STEM classes in HS and are not inbounds for JR, then McKinley offers much more than Walls. Also, there are definitely many kids that live in parts of DC where McKinley is much more convenient than Walls.

Upper NW DC kids are not choosing McKinley over Walls because they are in bound for JR which offers more STEM classes, ECs and APs than McKinley. That said, if those are their interests, they are not choosing Walls either.

+1. I have a STEM kid and after attending the Walls open house, I'm definitely not sending my kid there. McKinley is still on the table, but I have yet to visit it.

I’m a DCPS HS teacher and no way would I send my kid to McKinley over Walls. Walls has a much higher performing student cohort

What does being a DCPS HS teacher have to do with anything? You don’t reference anything specific to McKinley and are just regurgitating information that anyone can read.

Do you have any unique insight to share?

I assumed you would realize that being a DCPS HS teacher means I am much more familiar with these schools than most people. I attend PD sessions on occasion with teachers from these high schools and we chat about students and the general environment. I teach a STEM subject and I have made an effort to connect with teachers who teach the same courses at different high schools. I also know teachers at my school who have previously worked at Walls and Banneker. The Engineering pathway is nice and many high schools offer it but ultimately the pathway is only as good as the teachers teaching it and your child’s experience may vary considerably.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So seriously, the standard we're setting for McKinley Tech is "how many of its students are going to Caltech?"

Love that.

If it’s claiming to be a STEM school for high-achieving students, yeah, I’d expect at least a handful of CalTech/MIT etc admissions over a fee years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So seriously, the standard we're setting for McKinley Tech is "how many of its students are going to Caltech?"

Love that.

No, McKinley Tech is fine for many science-focused students. But for the kids who have the potential for CalTech, DCPS does not offer a good solution. Don't those students matter too?

CalTech is only 980 students total...so only about 245 per class. It is my understanding that not a single kid from any DC school (public, private or charter) was admitted to CalTech for the 2023 class. That said, very few applied.

DCPS sends kids to MIT, Ivy League, Stanford, UC schools, Michigan, UVA, etc. every year. Yes, probably 90%+ of those students attend Walls or JR (though McKinley sent some as well...believe the Valedictorian last year is at Cornell). You would agree those are strong schools.

By 2023 year, do you mean kids who were admitted in the spring of this year? Because I know that a student at BASIS DC was admitted to Caltech this past spring.