What the heck is happening to DCPS?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:My 2nd grader at a charter school just learned a song that helps them to ask people for their pronouns which is great. They've also learned the phonics, continents, multiplication and the basics of plate tectonics (when they learned about the continents, they learned how the continents got their shape - it was apparently a very exciting lesson because they came home and showed me how various mountain ranges around the world were formed).

We are not at the same charter but my 2nd grader, at an immersion charter, last year spent time in similar topic in science where they learned about earth plates, volcanoes, tsunami, etc…and they built some cool volcanoes using paper and clay and wrote stories about above in both English and Spanish. The kids loved it.

DCPS science curriculum is very strong. The problem here is that science and social studies are not tested subjects (except for a couple of times throughout their 13 years, OSSE tests science knowledge). When the testing stakes are high in terms of bonuses for principals and school rankings and federal funding, of course the no -tested subjects are allotted VERY little time. Many elementary teachers can only teach these subjects when time allows as the focus on math and ELA is relentless. The math curriculum is actually quite good, even if unfamiliar to parents. The steady focus on number sense and flexible operations will pay off! But there is also a time for memorizing basic math facts too. I suggest making some simple multiplication flash cards and doing them at dinner each night If your kid isn’t fluent by the end of third grade.

PARCC numbers don’t support your premise above. The overwhelming majority of kids are way below grade level in math, as in 1 or 2. Look at the science scores, also abysmal.

If the curriculum was strong in content, above would not be so bad.

I think PP is trying to say the content is good, but DCPS teachers cannot spend enough time on it because they have to focus on math & ELA PARCC scores.

NP. I think you miss their point. They are saying that the data doesn't support your position. If what you said was accurate then the Math and ELA scores should be excellent at the expense of science. But those scores suck.

Scores are very dependent upon the socio-economics of particular schools, unfortunately. Math and ELA scores are high where incomes and opportunity are high in DCPS. Emphasis on science is slowly growing and DCPS now has an excellent science curriculum. But there is still not much time left for science and social studies. In schools where these subjects are given more emphasis the students come away with a very strong foundation and are often really excited about what they’re learning.

I hope the science curriculum is excellent at the elementary level. However, as a middle school science teacher I find what downtown provides us to be laughably bad. I write all my own stuff. Kids need to learn science by doing experiments not by watching a screen.

I agree. Another middle school teacher here.
The middle school curriculum in different subjects provided by DCPS is way too easy.
DCPS does not like challenging students for some reason. True rigor only comes in at the HS level in AP courses because DCPS cannot mess with that curriculum. It is a shock to many kids when they get to AP classes because they have not been progressively challenged

+1

I am an AP teacher and get a lot of concerned parents who say their kids had straight As until my class in the subject.

Also my PK3 kid is learning continents at a non DCPS school. It shouldn’t happen in 6th grade.

why would DCPS want classes to be HARDER? the stats are dismal enough with the unchallenging curriculum.

Because there is a large block of kids who are capable and need it to be prepared for college. But yea, forget about them, let’s just focus on the bottom, put everyone in the same class and teach to the bottom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 2nd grader at a charter school just learned a song that helps them to ask people for their pronouns which is great. They've also learned the phonics, continents, multiplication and the basics of plate tectonics (when they learned about the continents, they learned how the continents got their shape - it was apparently a very exciting lesson because they came home and showed me how various mountain ranges around the world were formed).

We are not at the same charter but my 2nd grader, at an immersion charter, last year spent time in similar topic in science where they learned about earth plates, volcanoes, tsunami, etc…and they built some cool volcanoes using paper and clay and wrote stories about above in both English and Spanish. The kids loved it.

DCPS science curriculum is very strong. The problem here is that science and social studies are not tested subjects (except for a couple of times throughout their 13 years, OSSE tests science knowledge). When the testing stakes are high in terms of bonuses for principals and school rankings and federal funding, of course the no -tested subjects are allotted VERY little time. Many elementary teachers can only teach these subjects when time allows as the focus on math and ELA is relentless. The math curriculum is actually quite good, even if unfamiliar to parents. The steady focus on number sense and flexible operations will pay off! But there is also a time for memorizing basic math facts too. I suggest making some simple multiplication flash cards and doing them at dinner each night If your kid isn’t fluent by the end of third grade.

PARCC numbers don’t support your premise above. The overwhelming majority of kids are way below grade level in math, as in 1 or 2. Look at the science scores, also abysmal.

If the curriculum was strong in content, above would not be so bad.

I think PP is trying to say the content is good, but DCPS teachers cannot spend enough time on it because they have to focus on math & ELA PARCC scores.

NP. I think you miss their point. They are saying that the data doesn't support your position. If what you said was accurate then the Math and ELA scores should be excellent at the expense of science. But those scores suck.

Scores are very dependent upon the socio-economics of particular schools, unfortunately. Math and ELA scores are high where incomes and opportunity are high in DCPS. Emphasis on science is slowly growing and DCPS now has an excellent science curriculum. But there is still not much time left for science and social studies. In schools where these subjects are given more emphasis the students come away with a very strong foundation and are often really excited about what they’re learning.

I hope the science curriculum is excellent at the elementary level. However, as a middle school science teacher I find what downtown provides us to be laughably bad. I write all my own stuff. Kids need to learn science by doing experiments not by watching a screen.

I agree. Another middle school teacher here.
The middle school curriculum in different subjects provided by DCPS is way too easy.
DCPS does not like challenging students for some reason. True rigor only comes in at the HS level in AP courses because DCPS cannot mess with that curriculum. It is a shock to many kids when they get to AP classes because they have not been progressively challenged

+1

I am an AP teacher and get a lot of concerned parents who say their kids had straight As until my class in the subject.

Also my PK3 kid is learning continents at a non DCPS school. It shouldn’t happen in 6th grade.

why would DCPS want classes to be HARDER? the stats are dismal enough with the unchallenging curriculum.

Because there is a large block of kids who are capable and need it to be prepared for college. But yea, forget about them, let’s just focus on the bottom, put everyone in the same class and teach to the bottom.

Classic DCPS strategy, lower the top to try to narrow the gap. If the kids who can handle it were taught more challenging material, the top would go up more and the gap would widen. Can’t let that happen, now can we.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 2nd grader at a charter school just learned a song that helps them to ask people for their pronouns which is great. They've also learned the phonics, continents, multiplication and the basics of plate tectonics (when they learned about the continents, they learned how the continents got their shape - it was apparently a very exciting lesson because they came home and showed me how various mountain ranges around the world were formed).

We are not at the same charter but my 2nd grader, at an immersion charter, last year spent time in similar topic in science where they learned about earth plates, volcanoes, tsunami, etc…and they built some cool volcanoes using paper and clay and wrote stories about above in both English and Spanish. The kids loved it.

DCPS science curriculum is very strong. The problem here is that science and social studies are not tested subjects (except for a couple of times throughout their 13 years, OSSE tests science knowledge). When the testing stakes are high in terms of bonuses for principals and school rankings and federal funding, of course the no -tested subjects are allotted VERY little time. Many elementary teachers can only teach these subjects when time allows as the focus on math and ELA is relentless. The math curriculum is actually quite good, even if unfamiliar to parents. The steady focus on number sense and flexible operations will pay off! But there is also a time for memorizing basic math facts too. I suggest making some simple multiplication flash cards and doing them at dinner each night If your kid isn’t fluent by the end of third grade.

PARCC numbers don’t support your premise above. The overwhelming majority of kids are way below grade level in math, as in 1 or 2. Look at the science scores, also abysmal.

If the curriculum was strong in content, above would not be so bad.

I think PP is trying to say the content is good, but DCPS teachers cannot spend enough time on it because they have to focus on math & ELA PARCC scores.

NP. I think you miss their point. They are saying that the data doesn't support your position. If what you said was accurate then the Math and ELA scores should be excellent at the expense of science. But those scores suck.

Scores are very dependent upon the socio-economics of particular schools, unfortunately. Math and ELA scores are high where incomes and opportunity are high in DCPS. Emphasis on science is slowly growing and DCPS now has an excellent science curriculum. But there is still not much time left for science and social studies. In schools where these subjects are given more emphasis the students come away with a very strong foundation and are often really excited about what they’re learning.

People like above is exactly why DCPS curriculum and schools don’t improve. Use socio-economic status as the out without looking closely at what is happening and demanding accountability from DCP perpetuates the cycle of low expectations.

There are school districts where overall low socioeconomic kids do well. The areas where income and opportunity is high in DC, the math and ELA scores are not high, basically mediocre at best, when compared to similar places in the burbs.

If there is a district that has figured out how to solve this long-standing tragedy of outcomes please, for the love of god, share the case study and methods with us, DCPS leaders, and OSSE! This would be the answer to many prayers. Where are these odds-defying outcomes happening? Are the methods transferable to other public districts like DCPS? Please share!!

Of course not whole districts but definitely blocks of school within districts such as LA, Chicago, etc…

The best example is in the test in school/magnets in NYC. Predominantly low SES but high performing and high scorers.

Really you don’t even have to look at above, compare DC to other school districts with low SES and DC does much worst. DC is always at or near the bottom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 2nd grader at a charter school just learned a song that helps them to ask people for their pronouns which is great. They've also learned the phonics, continents, multiplication and the basics of plate tectonics (when they learned about the continents, they learned how the continents got their shape - it was apparently a very exciting lesson because they came home and showed me how various mountain ranges around the world were formed).

We are not at the same charter but my 2nd grader, at an immersion charter, last year spent time in similar topic in science where they learned about earth plates, volcanoes, tsunami, etc…and they built some cool volcanoes using paper and clay and wrote stories about above in both English and Spanish. The kids loved it.

DCPS science curriculum is very strong. The problem here is that science and social studies are not tested subjects (except for a couple of times throughout their 13 years, OSSE tests science knowledge). When the testing stakes are high in terms of bonuses for principals and school rankings and federal funding, of course the no -tested subjects are allotted VERY little time. Many elementary teachers can only teach these subjects when time allows as the focus on math and ELA is relentless. The math curriculum is actually quite good, even if unfamiliar to parents. The steady focus on number sense and flexible operations will pay off! But there is also a time for memorizing basic math facts too. I suggest making some simple multiplication flash cards and doing them at dinner each night If your kid isn’t fluent by the end of third grade.

This matches my experience so well. When the teachers have the opportunity to actually spend time on social studies and science, the kids learn incredibly well and the way it is structured builds upon prior units in past years in a really smart way. I don't know what curriculum they use but I have seen how, for instance, PK units on types of buildings have led to elementary units on architecture, engineering, and government studies. My kid will remember what the learned in prior years and build on that. It works well together.

However, the focus on testing and the pressure on DCPS schools, in particular, to "prove" their worth (as compared to charters) with high test scores really makes it hard for teachers to actually do this. I think this is the worst year I've seen, and I think it's due to the freak out over 2022 test scores and pandemic learning loss. The schedule that my K and 2nd grader are doing this year is bananas. My Ker's day is packed full of ELA and math to a degree that is not realistic, science/social studies get shoehorned into the period of lunch/recess, and it's the first thing to go when schedule disruptions limit available time because the pressure on teachers to get students at or above grade level in tested subjects is so intense. Right now my kids are both technically supposed to get a 20 minute recess daily but it winds up being like 8 minutes because once you've wrangled these kids from their special back to the classroom and to the lunchroom and then tried to get them to eat on a tight schedule, you are out of time and you have to get them back inside for afternoon curriculum. It's awful for the kids and the teachers and it's just not a good learning environment. I am frustrated with the school and with DCPS because it's way more intense than previous years, but when I've raised it, there's a lot of buck passing and then I get told that they have to worry about making sure the kids most impacted by learning loss (FARMS and SpeD kids) "catch up" but I know this isn't serving those kids either.

For these reasons, we're looking at charters and all-city schools for next year. We love our teachers and know what they are capable of, but DCPS is having some kind of melt-down over test scores right now and they've decided the key is to just try to cram all these kids with as much math and phonics as possible before 3rd grade. I know it's a complex problem but it's just not at all what I want for my kids. I am fortunate to have kids who are already at or above grade level in all subjects and I just don't stress about PARCC scores. We're looking for a school where my kids might actually spend some time outside, get more than 8 minutes of free play time during the day, and where there is better balance between tested academics and other subjects so that they get a well rounded education. I wish the teachers were in charge of the curriculum and schedule because I know for a fact they'd make better choices than this. But they aren't.

Wow, this sounds awful PP. it’s not developmental appropriate and will just kill the love of learning.

Definitely play the lottery. There is so much better options out there. Best of luck.

Thank you, but to be honest I'm sad about it. We like our school and we especially like going to the neighborhood school and having school friends nearby and feeling like we are part of a local school community. I'm not actually that enthusiastic about having to commute to a charter instead of walking a few blocks to our current school, and also having to work harder to make school friends and deal with having school friends living in other parts of the city. But I also don't want my kids to spend 7+ hours a day indoors with an intense focus on math/reading (that they don't really need because they were doing fine in these areas before with less intense academics) and less time for specials and other academics, or just socialization and play. I'm pretty frustrated to be in this situation.

Sounds like you are at a title 1 or low performing school. Sorry but what you don’t know, you don’t know.

Sure being able to walk to school is great but that benefit doesn’t outweigh all the many numerous other benefits, of which there are many. BTW the school community at our charter was way better and tighter than our title 1.

This might be the case but you don't have to be rude about it. I already said we're trying to leave. For the record, we tried to lottery into other schools in PK but didn't get in, but then decided to give the IB a chance. We do like the proximity and the neighborhood feel, and we had good ECE experiences with our oldest. And guess what, there's no guarantee we will get into a better school this year either. At which point we'll need to look at moving out of the city or coming to terms with the situation at our school. It sucks. I know it's a common situation but you could have a bit of empathy instead of being smug about the charter you were fortunate enough to lottery into.

PP here. No intent to be rude and where in my post is the rudeness. My point was until you have been on the other side, you have no idea what you are missing and it’s not just the higher academics. It’s so much more than that from communication, enrichment, direct access to leadership, field trips, parent involvement, social events, etc…. I could go on.

Even at the ECE level, the experience is so different and much more enriching, fun, and play based

Your perception about less of a school community, harder to make friends at a charter is also just wrong. It’s actually a much better and involved community and so much easier to make friends.

Good luck with the lottery. If it doesn’t work out, I would recommend moving. It’s not worth it to stick it out. Sure you could supplement a lot which is a lot of work in itself. But that is just one small part of the big picture of the overall school experience for your child. You can’t supplement all the other positive benefits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 2nd grader at a charter school just learned a song that helps them to ask people for their pronouns which is great. They've also learned the phonics, continents, multiplication and the basics of plate tectonics (when they learned about the continents, they learned how the continents got their shape - it was apparently a very exciting lesson because they came home and showed me how various mountain ranges around the world were formed).

We are not at the same charter but my 2nd grader, at an immersion charter, last year spent time in similar topic in science where they learned about earth plates, volcanoes, tsunami, etc…and they built some cool volcanoes using paper and clay and wrote stories about above in both English and Spanish. The kids loved it.

DCPS science curriculum is very strong. The problem here is that science and social studies are not tested subjects (except for a couple of times throughout their 13 years, OSSE tests science knowledge). When the testing stakes are high in terms of bonuses for principals and school rankings and federal funding, of course the no -tested subjects are allotted VERY little time. Many elementary teachers can only teach these subjects when time allows as the focus on math and ELA is relentless. The math curriculum is actually quite good, even if unfamiliar to parents. The steady focus on number sense and flexible operations will pay off! But there is also a time for memorizing basic math facts too. I suggest making some simple multiplication flash cards and doing them at dinner each night If your kid isn’t fluent by the end of third grade.

This matches my experience so well. When the teachers have the opportunity to actually spend time on social studies and science, the kids learn incredibly well and the way it is structured builds upon prior units in past years in a really smart way. I don't know what curriculum they use but I have seen how, for instance, PK units on types of buildings have led to elementary units on architecture, engineering, and government studies. My kid will remember what the learned in prior years and build on that. It works well together.

However, the focus on testing and the pressure on DCPS schools, in particular, to "prove" their worth (as compared to charters) with high test scores really makes it hard for teachers to actually do this. I think this is the worst year I've seen, and I think it's due to the freak out over 2022 test scores and pandemic learning loss. The schedule that my K and 2nd grader are doing this year is bananas. My Ker's day is packed full of ELA and math to a degree that is not realistic, science/social studies get shoehorned into the period of lunch/recess, and it's the first thing to go when schedule disruptions limit available time because the pressure on teachers to get students at or above grade level in tested subjects is so intense. Right now my kids are both technically supposed to get a 20 minute recess daily but it winds up being like 8 minutes because once you've wrangled these kids from their special back to the classroom and to the lunchroom and then tried to get them to eat on a tight schedule, you are out of time and you have to get them back inside for afternoon curriculum. It's awful for the kids and the teachers and it's just not a good learning environment. I am frustrated with the school and with DCPS because it's way more intense than previous years, but when I've raised it, there's a lot of buck passing and then I get told that they have to worry about making sure the kids most impacted by learning loss (FARMS and SpeD kids) "catch up" but I know this isn't serving those kids either.

For these reasons, we're looking at charters and all-city schools for next year. We love our teachers and know what they are capable of, but DCPS is having some kind of melt-down over test scores right now and they've decided the key is to just try to cram all these kids with as much math and phonics as possible before 3rd grade. I know it's a complex problem but it's just not at all what I want for my kids. I am fortunate to have kids who are already at or above grade level in all subjects and I just don't stress about PARCC scores. We're looking for a school where my kids might actually spend some time outside, get more than 8 minutes of free play time during the day, and where there is better balance between tested academics and other subjects so that they get a well rounded education. I wish the teachers were in charge of the curriculum and schedule because I know for a fact they'd make better choices than this. But they aren't.

Wow, this sounds awful PP. it’s not developmental appropriate and will just kill the love of learning.

Definitely play the lottery. There is so much better options out there. Best of luck.

Thank you, but to be honest I'm sad about it. We like our school and we especially like going to the neighborhood school and having school friends nearby and feeling like we are part of a local school community. I'm not actually that enthusiastic about having to commute to a charter instead of walking a few blocks to our current school, and also having to work harder to make school friends and deal with having school friends living in other parts of the city. But I also don't want my kids to spend 7+ hours a day indoors with an intense focus on math/reading (that they don't really need because they were doing fine in these areas before with less intense academics) and less time for specials and other academics, or just socialization and play. I'm pretty frustrated to be in this situation.

Sounds like you are at a title 1 or low performing school. Sorry but what you don’t know, you don’t know.

Sure being able to walk to school is great but that benefit doesn’t outweigh all the many numerous other benefits, of which there are many. BTW the school community at our charter was way better and tighter than our title 1.

This might be the case but you don't have to be rude about it. I already said we're trying to leave. For the record, we tried to lottery into other schools in PK but didn't get in, but then decided to give the IB a chance. We do like the proximity and the neighborhood feel, and we had good ECE experiences with our oldest. And guess what, there's no guarantee we will get into a better school this year either. At which point we'll need to look at moving out of the city or coming to terms with the situation at our school. It sucks. I know it's a common situation but you could have a bit of empathy instead of being smug about the charter you were fortunate enough to lottery into.

PP here. No intent to be rude and where in my post is the rudeness. My point was until you have been on the other side, you have no idea what you are missing and it’s not just the higher academics. It’s so much more than that from communication, enrichment, direct access to leadership, field trips, parent involvement, social events, etc…. I could go on.

Even at the ECE level, the experience is so different and much more enriching, fun, and play based

Your perception about less of a school community, harder to make friends at a charter is also just wrong. It’s actually a much better and involved community and so much easier to make friends.

Good luck with the lottery. If it doesn’t work out, I would recommend moving. It’s not worth it to stick it out. Sure you could supplement a lot which is a lot of work in itself. But that is just one small part of the big picture of the overall school experience for your child. You can’t supplement all the other positive benefits.

It’s rude to tell someone who has stated they are unhappy with their school snd us actively poking to leave it that they don’t understand what they are missing (they obviously do, thus the choice to leave). Especially rude when the lottery is a crapshoot and many people do not get into their desired school and must make go with a school they aren’t happy with. Glad you are happy with your charter but your posts are condescending. You got lucky in the lottery and now think you’re an education expert. Just stop.

[Anonymous]

It’s rude not to tell us which school it is and get everyone wound up with ambiguous postings about things everyone cares about like curriculum, regardless of politics.