Advice from experienced parents please - worried about class sizes

[Anonymous]

I'm a first time mom with a one-year old, who grew up far, far away from this area. Now I've met many people who talk about the problems with MoCo public schools, the large class sizes for early grades, made worse by the lack of teacher aides and such. We moved to MoCo so that we could send our daughter to public school.

I'd love some reassurance that even with the large class sizes, kids do live up to their potential. The same folks are telling me that if I don't pay attention to what nursery school she gets into she won't be able to get into a private kindergarten and now I've spent 2 days surfing websites for private K-3 that, as you all probably know, are very expensive. I feel like a neurotic caricature of a yuppie mom from some movie . . . .

[Anonymous]

...and breathe.

For preschools, visits and talks with the teachers help determine the character/personality of the teacher and her assistants. And really that is the most important thing, because it sets the tone of the whole classroom! My son is in a Montessori classroom with 35 children total, one head teacher and 2 assistants. Crazy ratio, you would think? But we love the three teachers, who discipline firmly yet lovingly. The children get individual attention and are well-behaved. I have seen tiny classes that border on the psychedelic because teachers are worthless.

So take your time, do your homework, and you will find something that is just right for you and your child.

[Anonymous]

My kids go to MoCo schools. And, even with the crazy class sizes, they are doing well - in fact, far better than I expected. Neither of my kids is all that easy - one has an IEP, but is in a regular class and the other needs extra help in reading and language arts, but does not have an IEP. But, in addition to the regular teacher, there are paraeducators, special education staff and a guidance counselor, as well as parent volunteers, all of whom contribute to the successful functioning of the classrooms. I have no concerns whatsoever about my kids' educational experience and I have no qualms about sending my youngest child when she hits school age.

I think one of the keys to your child having a good educational experience is your involvement. Join the PTA. Volunteer when you can. E-mail and talk with the teachers and principal regularly. Go to birthday parties - don't just drop your kid off. That's how you meet the other parents who interact regularly with your kids and you can get great feedback as to what is happening. If you have a concern, talk with the principal and teacher right away. And, do the reading and homework with your child so that you can see that she's progressing and identify areas where she has difficulty.

I'm not saying that MoCo will be right for your child. I'm just writing to reassure you that we have not experienced any problems as a result of class size.

[Anonymous]

I did the same thing - spent a lot of time surfing websites for privates, parochials and other MoCo elementaries out of concern that ours wouldn't be a good fit. Our oldest (a very active, sometimes defiant boy) is now halfway through the year in K and while it is a real adjustment, he's doing great - loves school and is learning lots. It's certainly possible that a smaller class might have added advantages, but particularly at this stage so much of what they are learning involves socialization - how to get along, solve problems, etc etc. I'll always be a neurotic yuppie mom and so will probably obsess over alternatives, but I can tell you so far it's been a very good experience. If we ever do go the private route, I'd rather invest the money where the academics are worth the cost. Give it time, get to know your school and the parent community (ours is crazy involved) and don't overthink it before you have to (unless you just have money to burn and think the prestige factor is worth $35k.)

[Anonymous]

Perhaps you'd be more comforted learning about the specific elementary school for which you are zoned. MoCo is a great system, but there are certainly differences between the schools, and it might be helpful for you to ask about your school specifically (if you haven't done this already). I can say that my 1st grader has had teachers who have done wonderfully with the 24 or so kids in each class.

[Anonymous]

Class size is important, but it is not everything. A lousy teacher with a small class to teach is still a lousy teacher!!

[Anonymous]

OP, the proposed cuts will likely increase class size, and cut extra staff for special programs.
That said, there are models like Montessori where large classes can work, but those are special situations. Montessori classes are normally large, and the activities are set up so the child can do a lot of self teaching.
For class size, look at the number of people in the room, not the student teacher ratio. This thing about 25 kids plus an aid is really not helpful. Too many people. In grades K-3, you want class sizes of 12-15. The benefits are supposedly life long.
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.
Also, I think my money is better spent in the early years. I have a lot more confidence in MC high schools than lower schools. HS students can better handle class sizes of 30 than a 6 year old can. Which begs the question, why is the county set to increase class size evenly across the grades, rather than disproportionately in the later grades?
That said, you do not need to be in a special nursery school, myth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.

Totally, totally disagree with this. Lousy teachers can do great damage.

[Anonymous]

Oops. Misread there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.

Totally, totally disagree with this. Lousy teachers can do great damage.

I am not saying lousy is not a problem, I m just saying it is an even bigger problem in large classes. You could get a lousy teacher in (public) school with a large class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, the proposed cuts will likely increase class size, and cut extra staff for special programs.
That said, there are models like Montessori where large classes can work, but those are special situations. Montessori classes are normally large, and the activities are set up so the child can do a lot of self teaching.
For class size, look at the number of people in the room, not the student teacher ratio. This thing about 25 kids plus an aid is really not helpful. Too many people. In grades K-3, you want class sizes of 12-15. The benefits are supposedly life long.
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.
Also, I think my money is better spent in the early years. I have a lot more confidence in MC high schools than lower schools. HS students can better handle class sizes of 30 than a 6 year old can. Which begs the question, why is the county set to increase class size evenly across the grades, rather than disproportionately in the later grades?
That said, you do not need to be in a special nursery school, myth.

Very well said and I completely agree! Pulled my kids out of public K for private. Will hopefully transition them back in at either the middle school level, if we can get into a magnet, or high school, where they are older and better equipped to do well in a larger class size.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, the proposed cuts will likely increase class size, and cut extra staff for special programs.
That said, there are models like Montessori where large classes can work, but those are special situations. Montessori classes are normally large, and the activities are set up so the child can do a lot of self teaching.
For class size, look at the number of people in the room, not the student teacher ratio. This thing about 25 kids plus an aid is really not helpful. Too many people. In grades K-3, you want class sizes of 12-15. The benefits are supposedly life long.
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.
Also, I think my money is better spent in the early years. I have a lot more confidence in MC high schools than lower schools. HS students can better handle class sizes of 30 than a 6 year old can. Which begs the question, why is the county set to increase class size evenly across the grades, rather than disproportionately in the later grades?
That said, you do not need to be in a special nursery school, myth.

Some of you are sadly misinformed regarding class sizes at the high school level - especially you, PP.

A class of 30+ on level 9th graders in an English class will not do as well as those in a smaller setting. 9th and 10th graders are not the most mature beings. Groups of unruly students at this age can ruin the atmosphere of any classroom. And despite how talented a teacher is and how much control s/he has, no one - except for some god - can ensure that each student is mastering hundreds of indicators found in a curriculum guide by the time finals come.

And please remember that high school teachers have 150+ students they see in a day - not 25. And depending upon the school, the number of FARMS, ESOL and SPED students can be quite high, which means that these students (when they attend) need a lot of attention and extra help.

Furthermore, let's discuss teacher burn out. How many assignments and essays can a teacher expect to grade on a regular basis in a large honors/AP/IB class when the majority of work is turned in? How much attention can s/he spend on individual students who many need enrichment or extra help?

Certainly there are mature HS students who can "handle" a larger class - who are resourceful enough to help themselves should the teacher be overburdened. However, no one is thinking about the teacher here either. An overworked teacher is not effective in the classroom.

So before you're so eager to comment on the system, examine it first to understand how it really works.

[Anonymous]

Which schools have large classes? Our K has 17 students, and everyone we know is in a school with around that number for K-2nd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, the proposed cuts will likely increase class size, and cut extra staff for special programs.
That said, there are models like Montessori where large classes can work, but those are special situations. Montessori classes are normally large, and the activities are set up so the child can do a lot of self teaching.
For class size, look at the number of people in the room, not the student teacher ratio. This thing about 25 kids plus an aid is really not helpful. Too many people. In grades K-3, you want class sizes of 12-15. The benefits are supposedly life long.
BTW, I disagree a little with two pps.
Small class with a lousy teacher is better than large class and lousy teacher.
Also, I think my money is better spent in the early years. I have a lot more confidence in MC high schools than lower schools. HS students can better handle class sizes of 30 than a 6 year old can. Which begs the question, why is the county set to increase class size evenly across the grades, rather than disproportionately in the later grades?
That said, you do not need to be in a special nursery school, myth.

Some of you are sadly misinformed regarding class sizes at the high school level - especially you, PP.

A class of 30+ on level 9th graders in an English class will not do as well as those in a smaller setting. 9th and 10th graders are not the most mature beings. Groups of unruly students at this age can ruin the atmosphere of any classroom. And despite how talented a teacher is and how much control s/he has, no one - except for some god - can ensure that each student is mastering hundreds of indicators found in a curriculum guide by the time finals come.

And please remember that high school teachers have 150+ students they see in a day - not 25. And depending upon the school, the number of FARMS, ESOL and SPED students can be quite high, which means that these students (when they attend) need a lot of attention and extra help.

Furthermore, let's discuss teacher burn out. How many assignments and essays can a teacher expect to grade on a regular basis in a large honors/AP/IB class when the majority of work is turned in? How much attention can s/he spend on individual students who many need enrichment or extra help?

Certainly there are mature HS students who can "handle" a larger class - who are resourceful enough to help themselves should the teacher be overburdened. However, no one is thinking about the teacher here either. An overworked teacher is not effective in the classroom.

So before you're so eager to comment on the system, examine it first to understand how it really works.

Sorry to offend you. I was really referring to 11 and 12 grades. In NY, I know schools who teach AP classes like college classes with lots of students. Techers give fewer assignments and let students self grade the homework. Also, depend more on exams for final grade.
Sorry again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Which schools have large classes? Our K has 17 students, and everyone we know is in a school with around that number for K-2nd. [/quote
When you get to SW MC, they classes can swell to 25 kids per class.