Overcrowding at Bethesda Elementary (BE)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, last night was back to school night at BE. I expected overcrowding, but this was a new low. Physical Education classes have been doubled up, with almost 60 kids in a period. This means that for half the time, half the kids sit while the other run around. Not kidding--this is really happening, have verified with a couple of parents. They can no longer fit all the kids into the art room, so they now wheel an "art cart" into some classrooms for the kids to do art. The school is now so overcrowded that it seems to me like an emergency. What is most frustrating is the total lack of concern by our elected officials and school administrators. We (parents) have been warning about this for years. We've all seen the construction. Whatever the cause--teardowns, condos, apartments--does it matter? What is the plan for next year? Three classes in one P.E. period? I know the boundary study is forthcoming, but this is an issue now.

PP - I am also a BE parent, and at least for the 4th grade, this is not true about doubling up for PE and not having art in the art room. My DC has already had PE (with just her class, in the gym) and art (again, with just her class and in the art room). What grade is your child?

DP

IME, this definitely can differ per grade. I have two kids at Focus ES. The older one does have her own PE class, and her class does go to the Art Room for Art. However, the younger DD has PE doubled up with another class this year (2nd grade) and also had that last year. This year, she has Art on a Cart, but last year she did have Art in the Art Room.

PP, have you been at BE every year, or is this your first year there?

PP here. We have been at BE for four years. Our child is in 3rd grade. The school has gotten noticeably more crowded every year we have been there.

Argh...I can’t even imagine. We left right when you arrived, three years ago, and I remember how miserably overcrowded classrooms were for class events, and trying to cram in the gym for back to school night. And those stupid playground rules!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My youngest just graduated from Bethesda Elementary last year and I love that school.

Ms. Seymour has worked incredibly hard for years to bring awareness of downtown overcrowding, as have the Principals at the middle school and high school level for our cluster, as well as the surrounding clusters. I hope you're not blaming each school's administration, but rather the lack of funding and inertia at the County and State level. They hold the purse-strings.

There is a study being done right now to assess where to put in a new elementary in our area, and whether to share it with the Walter Johnson cluster, also overcrowded. Woodward high school will be opened in 2025 on Old Georgetown Rd, which will provide some relief at the high school level.

MCPS IS OVERCROWDED AND IT'S SHAMEFUL HOW LATE THE STATE AND COUNTY ARE RESPONDING. DEVELOPERS ARE FRIENDS WITH OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS AT EVERY LEVEL. THEY ARE GIVEN PRIORITY OVER OUR CHILDREN'S EDUCATION.

I'll tell you what we need to do: something has to give. The public school budget is already weighing extremely heavily on the State's finances. We need to take a good hard look at what we can cut from MCPS, to preserve a decent teacher:student ratio in core classes, which is the backbone of a good education. It's sad to say, but as a parent who has lived through multiple private and public school systems, here and in different countries, we cannot have our cake and eat it too. We can enact laws to stave off development, which will impact our local economy but stabilize the school system so it doesn't traumatize a generation of kids, but we can't magic money that doesn't exist to build new schools. Cuts are in order, whether we like it or not.

The question is: where?

+ 1 million

Adding additional Accessory Dwelling Units, and more high density housing is not going to alleviate any of the overcrowding in MCPS. Yet, County leadership continues to advocate for more development.

Umm...the “County leadership” that advocated for this nonsense is Hans Reimer. Remember his name as he is already gunning to run for County Exec.

Agreed. Reimer is terrible. Especially with his recent push for ADUs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BE is the worst school in lower montgomery county and has been for years.

Why would you say this?

Because my kids have attended several MCPS schools over the years (plus out of state). BE is the worst school, hands down. The principle is neurotic, the school is uninviting, the kids are obnoxious and rude and no one corrects them. This has not been our experience at any other school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My youngest just graduated from Bethesda Elementary last year and I love that school.

Ms. Seymour has worked incredibly hard for years to bring awareness of downtown overcrowding, as have the Principals at the middle school and high school level for our cluster, as well as the surrounding clusters. I hope you're not blaming each school's administration, but rather the lack of funding and inertia at the County and State level. They hold the purse-strings.

There is a study being done right now to assess where to put in a new elementary in our area, and whether to share it with the Walter Johnson cluster, also overcrowded. Woodward high school will be opened in 2025 on Old Georgetown Rd, which will provide some relief at the high school level.

MCPS IS OVERCROWDED AND IT'S SHAMEFUL HOW LATE THE STATE AND COUNTY ARE RESPONDING. DEVELOPERS ARE FRIENDS WITH OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS AT EVERY LEVEL. THEY ARE GIVEN PRIORITY OVER OUR CHILDREN'S EDUCATION.

I'll tell you what we need to do: something has to give. The public school budget is already weighing extremely heavily on the State's finances. We need to take a good hard look at what we can cut from MCPS, to preserve a decent teacher:student ratio in core classes, which is the backbone of a good education. It's sad to say, but as a parent who has lived through multiple private and public school systems, here and in different countries, we cannot have our cake and eat it too. We can enact laws to stave off development, which will impact our local economy but stabilize the school system so it doesn't traumatize a generation of kids, but we can't magic money that doesn't exist to build new schools. Cuts are in order, whether we like it or not.

The question is: where?

+ 1 million

Adding additional Accessory Dwelling Units, and more high density housing is not going to alleviate any of the overcrowding in MCPS. Yet, County leadership continues to advocate for more development.

Umm...the “County leadership” that advocated for this nonsense is Hans Reimer. Remember his name as he is already gunning to run for County Exec.

Agreed. Reimer is terrible. Especially with his recent push for ADUs.

I thought there was a moratorium in place for building in areas with overcrowded schools. And yet there are high rises going up all over bethesda, plus the ADUs.

[Anonymous]

I thought there was a moratorium in place for building in areas with overcrowded schools. And yet there are high rises going up all over bethesda, plus the ADUs.

I live in a neighborhood impacted by the moratorium, and it's kind of complicated. Buildings that were already approved are moving forward. Given the construction timeline, that means buildings will continue to go up for years before the actual impact of the moratorium hits.

One building slated to be renovated in our neighborhood will instead be used for senior housing, but Riemer tried to get around even that. He introduced legislation saying that the moratorium wouldn't "count" if the building served as low income housing.

It was egregious, because kids are kids and overcrowding is overcrowding. Trying to get around the moratorium by designating the housing for low income families doesn't exactly solve the problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I thought there was a moratorium in place for building in areas with overcrowded schools. And yet there are high rises going up all over bethesda, plus the ADUs.

I live in a neighborhood impacted by the moratorium, and it's kind of complicated. Buildings that were already approved are moving forward. Given the construction timeline, that means buildings will continue to go up for years before the actual impact of the moratorium hits.

One building slated to be renovated in our neighborhood will instead be used for senior housing, but Riemer tried to get around even that. He introduced legislation saying that the moratorium wouldn't "count" if the building served as low income housing.

It was egregious, because kids are kids and overcrowding is overcrowding. Trying to get around the moratorium by designating the housing for low income families doesn't exactly solve the problem.

Kids are kids, overcrowding is overcrowding, and a severe shortage of housing for people with low incomes is a severe shortage of housing for people with low incomes.

[Anonymous]

Big schools doesn’t mean crowded, our fairly large Bethesda elementary, my two kids have class sizes 22 & 23 grades 2 &4

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BE is the worst school in lower montgomery county and has been for years.

Why would you say this?

Because my kids have attended several MCPS schools over the years (plus out of state). BE is the worst school, hands down. The principle is neurotic, the school is uninviting, the kids are obnoxious and rude and no one corrects them. This has not been our experience at any other school.

I'm sorry you had a poor experience at BE, but we've found the principal to be a great advocate for her school with the county etc. (including miraculously getting additional portables and teachers after the year starts), the kids to be surprisingly well-behaved (they are kids after all) and the teachers mostly excellent. Yes, the class sizes are too large. But that's certainly not the fault of the principal, the teachers, or the students.

On principle, I feel badly that your family wasn't a good fit at BE, but it sounds like you're in a better place now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

DP

Sure it does.

If the pro-development crowd is arguing that you don't have many kids living in 1 and 2BR apartments, yet the bus routes from those apartments are full, then MCPS needs to change the way it makes projections.

Let's say that there are 1,000 apartments in a building. Now let's say that 5% of those apartments of kids living in them - specifically, 2 kids each.

a. How many kids live in the building?
b. What percentage of apartments don't have kids living in them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, last night was back to school night at BE. I expected overcrowding, but this was a new low. Physical Education classes have been doubled up, with almost 60 kids in a period. This means that for half the time, half the kids sit while the other run around. Not kidding--this is really happening, have verified with a couple of parents. They can no longer fit all the kids into the art room, so they now wheel an "art cart" into some classrooms for the kids to do art. The school is now so overcrowded that it seems to me like an emergency. What is most frustrating is the total lack of concern by our elected officials and school administrators. We (parents) have been warning about this for years. We've all seen the construction. Whatever the cause--teardowns, condos, apartments--does it matter? What is the plan for next year? Three classes in one P.E. period? I know the boundary study is forthcoming, but this is an issue now.

There is no plan. The BOE cares about equity and transgender restrooms. Seriously. They do not care about overcrowded classrooms. A group of parents from our nonW cluster testified about this last year and we were completely shut down.

The schools Principals are left to piece together coverage and classrooms and hallways are filled to capacity.

They were trying to a boundary study which hasn't been done in over a decade but mcps parents threaten to die if their kid gets redistricted to a school with a lower gs rating than their current rating. Because your high mortgage was predicated on that.great schools rating do you're entitled to attend am overcrowded gs 9

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BE is the worst school in lower montgomery county and has been for years.

Why would you say this?

Because my kids have attended several MCPS schools over the years (plus out of state). BE is the worst school, hands down. The principle is neurotic, the school is uninviting, the kids are obnoxious and rude and no one corrects them. This has not been our experience at any other school.

I'm sorry you had a poor experience at BE, but we've found the principal to be a great advocate for her school with the county etc. (including miraculously getting additional portables and teachers after the year starts), the kids to be surprisingly well-behaved (they are kids after all) and the teachers mostly excellent. Yes, the class sizes are too large. But that's certainly not the fault of the principal, the teachers, or the students.

On principle, I feel badly that your family wasn't a good fit at BE, but it sounds like you're in a better place now.

The problem isn’t the Principle or the teachers, it’s the number of kids. And it’s not a class size thing; there are just too many kids crammed into a small physical plant. There’s only one lunchroom and gym. You can’t just keep adding classes. The school has at least 100 too many kids now. What most parents who aren’t all up in County politics wonder is this: why don’t they refurbish and reopen Lynbrook? Half the kids at BE live in East Bethesda. They could all walk to school. If that can’t happen, send some kids to Chevy Chase ES. These of course seem like far too practical solutions, so they’ll never happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:[

The problem isn’t the Principle or the teachers, it’s the number of kids. And it’s not a class size thing; there are just too many kids crammed into a small physical plant. There’s only one lunchroom and gym. You can’t just keep adding classes. The school has at least 100 too many kids now. What most parents who aren’t all up in County politics wonder is this: why don’t they refurbish and reopen Lynbrook? Half the kids at BE live in East Bethesda. They could all walk to school. If that can’t happen, send some kids to Chevy Chase ES. These of course seem like fartoo practical solutions, so they’ll never happen.

As far as I know, this is included in the study of options for Bethesda ES.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[

The problem isn’t the Principle or the teachers, it’s the number of kids. And it’s not a class size thing; there are just too many kids crammed into a small physical plant. There’s only one lunchroom and gym. You can’t just keep adding classes. The school has at least 100 too many kids now. What most parents who aren’t all up in County politics wonder is this: why don’t they refurbish and reopen Lynbrook? Half the kids at BE live in East Bethesda. They could all walk to school. If that can’t happen, send some kids to Chevy Chase ES. These of course seem like fartoo practical solutions, so they’ll never happen.

As far as I know, this is included in the study of options for Bethesda ES.

Great, but my point is, it’s a problem *now*, and while studies are being done, kids are suffering. The bureaucratic sluggishness is a killer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:BE is the worst school in lower montgomery county and has been for years.

Why would you say this?

Because my kids have attended several MCPS schools over the years (plus out of state). BE is the worst school, hands down. The principle is neurotic, the school is uninviting, the kids are obnoxious and rude and no one corrects them. This has not been our experience at any other school.

I'm sorry you had a poor experience at BE, but we've found the principal to be a great advocate for her school with the county etc. (including miraculously getting additional portables and teachers after the year starts), the kids to be surprisingly well-behaved (they are kids after all) and the teachers mostly excellent. Yes, the class sizes are too large. But that's certainly not the fault of the principal, the teachers, or the students.

On principle, I feel badly that your family wasn't a good fit at BE, but it sounds like you're in a better place now.

This PP must be the principle....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[

The problem isn’t the Principle or the teachers, it’s the number of kids. And it’s not a class size thing; there are just too many kids crammed into a small physical plant. There’s only one lunchroom and gym. You can’t just keep adding classes. The school has at least 100 too many kids now. What most parents who aren’t all up in County politics wonder is this: why don’t they refurbish and reopen Lynbrook? Half the kids at BE live in East Bethesda. They could all walk to school. If that can’t happen, send some kids to Chevy Chase ES. These of course seem like fartoo practical solutions, so they’ll never happen.

As far as I know, this is included in the study of options for Bethesda ES.

Great, but my point is, it’s a problem *now*, and while studies are being done, kids are suffering. The bureaucratic sluggishness is a killer.

They are balancing needs and priorities across the whole County and it makes the process very slow. Also, MCPS is moving to bigger and bigger schools at every level to deal with there being more and more kids. They are not going to open new schools with 450 capacity. Most of the old closed schools have capacity in the 350-400 range (if they just opened them up as a school without demolishing the old building and putting up a new one) and many are on sites that can't accommodate a 750 capacity ES. It's a down-side of running a very large system. If they move one project to the front of the line, other projects get pushed back, etc.