Gifted kid - APS, FCPS, or Nysmith?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:What I have learned from seeing my highly intelligent kid faltering in AAP is that, at least in this case, maturity, concentration and work ethics are more important than intelligence. AAP may work better for kids that are more mature, self-driven and less distracted. Highly intelligent or not is less relevant.

This is precisely what happens when gifted programs are turned into high achiever programs.

Thanks, PP. So where should my highly intelligent but less mature, easily distracted kid go?

The whole point of a gifted program is to help really bright kids who don't fit in in a regular classroom, the very kids who might be less mature and easily distracted. It is unfortunate that FCPS has moved away from this model, because it worked well for many years.

Not sure what to tell you to do to help your child, except to stay in communication with his/her teacher and hope you get a good teacher who knows how to work with bright kids like yours.

The current thinking is that you want to push bright/gifted kids when they're young, teach them that it's okay to fail, and teach them to work. Otherwise, when they get to the hard stuff in high school, college, grad school or beyond, they'll crash and burn, give up, and be doomed.

It seems you disagree.

Hmm, not sure what I wrote that makes you think that. I made no reference to the specifics of how gifted kids should be taught, just that they should be taught by teachers that understand their needs. Their needs surely do include needing to be pushed, having the opportunity to fail, and learning how to work and I never said otherwise. I was not discussing how gifted kids should be taught, but instead the idea that they need teachers who understand how they can best learn, ideally in a program set up to meet their needs.

If you have worked with gifted children, been a parent to one, or been one yourself, you will understand how the needs of gifted children are different from those of above average kids who "work hard."

I disagree with the idea that gifted kids need to be pushed when young, need to learn to fail, or they're doomed to crash and burn later on in their academic and/or professional career. But that is what I understand the current thinking to be.

I was in a gifted program as a child and my kids are in AAP. If gifted kids are faltering in AAP, I would look more at the particular teacher or the grade/school rather than at AAP in general. I don't think AAP has changed, become a worse GT program than it used to be. That's only my opinion, though.

So, it isn't clear from your post. Do you think it is good for FCPS to include above-average intelligence kids in an expansive AAP or do you think it would be better for FCPS to have available a program focused on the top percentile of kids whose needs cannot be met in the regular classroom?

Oh, and just to be clear, I don't believe, nor do I think the current thinking is that gifted kids are "doomed to crash and burn" without the experience of being "pushed."

And AAP has changed over the years. I've been watching it for at least 18 years now, and it is a different program in terms of the percentage of kids it includes than when I first became familiar with it roughly 18 or so years ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP has changed from what it once was. Primarily it was a gifted program with requirements to get in. Today it is not for the gifted, but rather the high achieving. No IQ test is required for entry. People who have gifted children understand the differing needs of a gifted child vs one who gets good grades at school because they try hard. FCPS has moved to a holistic approach to AAP admission. There are no set guidelines for entry. Your child’s teacher”s opinion weighs heavily on whether or not your child is found eligible. As a result, a large number of AAP students are not gifted, per se, according to an IQ rest. On the flip side, there are gifted children who are not getting in to AAP with the new FCPS system. Your child with an IQ of 150 has no guarantee of getting in. The system is not standardized . Nysmith is a good place for kids who are gifted who did not impress their teacher and therefore did not get in to AAP. Keep an open mind when deciding where to live as there is no rhyme or reason as to who gets in and who doesn’t . Don’t rely on it.

That’s troubling to hear. How have these changes affected kids who are gifted? If an AAP is full,of kids who aren’t gifted but try hard, it seems that it would become less able to offer differentiation that meets the needs of gifted kids.

The PP is incorrect, most years students need a 131-133 on the CogAt to be in the pool. Parents do fill out forms to have their child considered if they fall below that line, but unless the teacher has a very strong recommendation, they still need a score of 130or so on another test like the WISC. When Fairfax decided to do its own version of the CogAt because of remapnt cheating, there was a bubble group year where more were accepted because there was quite a bit of leeway.

Kept seeing this "AAP cheating" thing, what year was this? I wonder why that only happened once since that prep school is in business and many kids go there all the time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:
RRMS, I know Greenbriar West and Mosby Woods are very strong. There are other Centers I don’t know about.

DD will be starting at Bull Run Elementary, which feeds into Rocky Run. What I have seen so far, I have liked. There are two AAP classrooms for third grade, and they are going to be team taught. 37 kids and two teachers. There will be no homework. There will be no test prep for SOLs, and parents are welcome to have their kids opt out of SOLs if they want. The only thing the teachers emphasized the parents must do outside of the classroom, is to read. Read themselves, read to the kids, have the kids read to you, to their pets, their siblings, etc. They also suggested that since there is no homework, it opens up family time - to play games, go for walks, do things together and expose kids to things that they cannot learn in a classroom. I hope this isn't all lip service.

So, 18-19 kids per classroom? That's a very small class.

I used to teach at Bull Run and one of the other schools that send kids to that center. The schools are a mix of middle class mostly white kids and poorer ELL kids. The test-prep and weekend schools aren't as big in those two groups as with wealthier white people (who secretly do workbooks at home) and Asian/Indian families who do Sunshine Academy and weekend church school, etc. Not as many kids get into AAP when test prep isn't rampant-my schools usually only sent a handful of kids each year to the AAP class (2, 3, 4 etc). Centre Ridge, Deer Park, London Towne, and Virginia Run all go to Bull Run. Now when you get to the other side of Centreville, in the Colin Powell, Eagle View area you get a lot more competition and parent pushing to get into the program. It was unusual at Bull Run and my other school for parents to apply if their child didn't meet the cutoff. My old coworkers like the new principal there FWIW.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

+ 1. My AAP kid moves to Nysmith and is behind, not ahead.

[Anonymous]

Nysmith is definitely more advanced than AAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

+ 1. My AAP kid moves to Nysmith and is behind, not ahead.

As a Nysmith parent, I would like to say Nysmith is way way ahead of AAP kids. There is no comparison. And its not true that kids who do not get into AAP go into Nysmith.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nysmith is definitely more advanced than AAP.

+1 Agree absolutely.

[Anonymous]

The curriculum of Fcps and Nysmith are quite different. AAP has very bright kids as well, but the quality and depth of education Nysmith or any other private school offers,is way beyond a FCPS school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

+ 1. My AAP kid moves to Nysmith and is behind, not ahead.

As a Nysmith parent, I would like to say Nysmith is way way ahead of AAP kids. There is no comparison. And its not true that kids who do not get into AAP go into Nysmith.

Okay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

+ 1. [b]My AAP kid moves to Nysmith and is behind, not ahead.[/b]

As a Nysmith parent, I would like to say Nysmith is way way ahead of AAP kids. There is no comparison. And its not true that kids who do not get into AAP go into Nysmith.

Okay.

Question to the poster above. Your kid is behind because he/she came from the FCPS AAP, or were they doing well in AAP and now falling behind because you feel Nysmith is not good enough?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

+ 1. [b]My AAP kid moves to Nysmith and is behind, not ahead.[/b]

As a Nysmith parent, I would like to say Nysmith is way way ahead of AAP kids. There is no comparison. And its not true that kids who do not get into AAP go into Nysmith.

Okay.

Question to the poster above. Your kid is behind because he/she came from the FCPS AAP, or were they doing well in AAP and now falling behind because you feel Nysmith is not good enough?

My 7th grader is doing algebra 1 honors in Nysmith. About half of the class are doing Geometry or above. For language arts, they were reading Henry 4, Henry 5, Animal Farm and my kid is struggling to keep up with the daily homework on writing. Science Fair projects are very impressive in Nysmith.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The curriculum of Fcps and Nysmith are quite different. AAP has very bright kids as well, but the quality and depth of education Nysmith or any other private school offers,is way beyond a FCPS school.

Bc of this- nothing you’re saying is believable now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sounds like an average kid in AAP who has had an actual WISCONSIN. Nysnith is for the kids who don’t get into AAP.

I don't know from where do people get the impression that Nysmith is for kids who didn't get into AAP. It's more like AAP is for kids whose parents can't afford or don't want to spend money for private education.

I am not making any general or broad statement. No body has any stats to back up any claims.

People will say that they have seen kids going to Nysmith because they didn't get into AAP and also kids went to AAP because they couldn't get into Nysmith.

I would say do you own research. Go to Nysmith/AAP center, talk to teachers, observe hows classes are taught and then make your own judgement.

Ha, ha - of course you are making general and broad statements.

[Anonymous]

We know 4 different families who did not get into aap so they enrolled one or more kids in nysmith. Other friends who took algebra in 6th got b’s. I would not say that’s a kid necessarily ready for advancing into high school math, in my opinion. The kid can do the work but not well enough to be doing it in 6th.