Come in if you are "successful" today but didn't go to an elite school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyone in HR with brains knows that there are a lot of factors that go into what school someone chooses. A majority of my dd's friends have GPAs over 4.0, full IB diplomas, and top SAT scores, and they're only looking at in-state schools because that's all their parents are willing to pay for. The top student that chooses to go over $200k in debt for undergrad is not necessarily someone I would view as "smart."

You don't understand how HR works. For premier gigs, software screens you [out] before human eyes even read your resume (or linkedin).

Top firms want aggressive competitive ambitious people. Going to podunk college because it saved some cash teases out you may be smart, but most likely a provincial sheltered bumpkin fearful of top competition, who will likely crumble around assertive super sharp peers.

Notice the use of "firms". I think this is true for lawyers. It isn't true for anything else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyone in HR with brains knows that there are a lot of factors that go into what school someone chooses. A majority of my dd's friends have GPAs over 4.0, full IB diplomas, and top SAT scores, and they're only looking at in-state schools because that's all their parents are willing to pay for. The top student that chooses to go over $200k in debt for undergrad is not necessarily someone I would view as "smart."

You don't understand how HR works. For premier gigs, software screens you [out] before human eyes even read your resume (or linkedin).

Top firms want aggressive competitive ambitious people. Going to podunk college because it saved some cash teases out you may be smart, but most likely a provincial sheltered bumpkin fearful of top competition, who will likely crumble around assertive super sharp peers.

Notice the use of "firms". I think this is true for lawyers. It isn't true for anything else.

No this is true amongst consultancies as well. The firm I was with only recruited off six of the top B-school campuses because recruiting is a big investment of time by the professionals in the firm. It i also true for the bulge bracket investment banks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anyone in HR with brains knows that there are a lot of factors that go into what school someone chooses. A majority of my dd's friends have GPAs over 4.0, full IB diplomas, and top SAT scores, and they're only looking at in-state schools because that's all their parents are willing to pay for. The top student that chooses to go over $200k in debt for undergrad is not necessarily someone I would view as "smart."

You don't understand how HR works. For premier gigs, software screens you [out] before human eyes even read your resume (or linkedin).

Top firms want aggressive competitive ambitious people. Going to podunk college because it saved some cash teases out you may be smart, but most likely a provincial sheltered bumpkin fearful of top competition, who will likely crumble around assertive super sharp peers.

Notice the use of "firms". I think this is true for lawyers. It isn't true for anything else.

No this is true amongst consultancies as well. The firm I was with only recruited off six of the top B-school campuses because recruiting is a big investment of time by the professionals in the firm. It i also true for the bulge bracket investment banks.

Yes the end all be all is Big Law/ Big 3 Consulting and I-Banking You sound like most of my B-school classmates

5 years out 2/3 of my class is no longer in any of these roles. The ones that are left privately vent about the insane hours/travel/lack of any social relationships/not seeing their spouse/kids etc

To each their own. There are multiple paths to happiness and I still say sales/entrepreneurship is the easier way to go if you are obsessed with chasing $$$$$$.

[Anonymous]

i went to community college for about 6 years then went to a 4 year school for about 15 the entire time i worked full time climbing the ladder doing any and every job asked.

Today I have a wonderful family, wonderful home, and seeing most around here are all about money, making much more than most who have a traditional education.

I would do it all over again in a heartbeat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody would ever claim there aren't successful alums from gigantic 10,000-40,000 student universities.

But it's like, great, you know one person from Indiana University who is a multi-millionaire? Good for him. Really. That's awesome. But that's one person. On average, from which school (Harvard or Indiana) would you say their respective graduates are enjoying better relative success? Since that data is readily available, let's take a look:

Kelley: https://kelley.iu.edu/recruiters-companies/graduate/_files/GCSEmploymentReport17-18.pdf
Harvard: http://ocs.fas.harvard.edu/files/ocs/files/final_20152016_annual_report.pdf

It's clearly Harvard. To say that "it doesn't matter where you go to school" is objectively idiotic. So, brush up on those logical reasoning skills, too. Ever hear of a small sample size? An anecdote doesn't combat hard data.

Sharp parents pay big bucks to live in the tippy top public districts or claw their way into expensive premier privates to get a shot at the creme de la creme colleges. The "only grad school matters" and "we're not into the rat race" memes are what parents tell themselves after they've raised merely average children. You're just trying to rationalize your underachieving kids.

God you really suck at this human being thing. Really really suck.

+1. "Tippy top?" Whatever Buffy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, smart students do make it. I like to think I'm one. But, if you do end up with a corporate career, it is so nice to have that elite school credential when you want to switch between industries. That's a real possibility given how fast relevant careers are shifting and I think more so true today than yesterday. Being rubber stamped as smart lasts your whole life. It's a nice luxury.

Yup, this is the value of an elite school in a nutshell.

Anyone in HR with brains knows that there are a lot of factors that go into what school someone chooses. A majority of my dd's friends have GPAs over 4.0, full IB diplomas, and top SAT scores, and they're only looking at in-state schools because that's all their parents are willing to pay for. The top student that chooses to go over $200k in debt for undergrad is not necessarily someone I would view as "smart."

Well, HR people might be brainless, then, since they are the people who have made the biggest deal about my elite schools. But it's also true that after your first job, you don't really get jobs through a standard application process but rather through networking. Your alumni network from an elite school is more likely to be well-placed, as stats shared in this thread bear out.

Ultimately, though, I don't think it makes sense to go into 6 figure debt for school either (and I didn't). But it has absolutely not been my experience that employers are thinking about that when they hire people. As a hiring manager, I will say that when I am flooded with applications for a job, schools and past employers are an easy way to whittle down the list to a manageable set of candidates to interview.

Well, in my field HR has minimal impact on hiring. They just try to make sure the people doing the hiring and firing follow the proper protocol. So, I do not care what HR thinks of your elite degree. What matters is what the hiring manager thinks of my capabilities.

You seem pretty defensive...especially in response to my saying that elite educations are only marginally worth it. I liked the schools I went to, and they provided me with some unique opportunities. I know plenty of successful people, defined in much broader terms than the financial lens DCUM-ers seem to be obsessed with, who went to a pretty broad range (by ranking) of schools.

There are some advantages to going to an elite school, but it doesn't guarantee anything...nor does not attending mean you will be a failure.

[Anonymous]

Nobody gave a crap about where you went to college until USNWR took over everyone's brains.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: Big Ten all the way. I feel fine about it. People tend to underestimate me, which often works to my advantage.

Big 10 is not a school. It's a conference. And it has three good schools. Northwestern. And then, to a lesser extent, Michigan and Wisconsin. Cow colleges after that.

I went to one of the cow colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Successful meaning financially or otherwise (maybe you're at the tippy top of a lowly paid field), do you still feel insecure about where you went to college?

I'm in my early twenties, just starting out. So many people say that it's what you do after school that matters most and that makes sense to me, logically speaking. But then I see posts from people saying they make a small fortune (high six figures/low seven) and still feel insecure about where they went to college. I'm just wondering how common that is.

Went to mid-west State U. Nothing special about it but my parents begged me to go b/c they could afford the tuition (but then ended up not paying anyway). So I went out of guilt.

I subsequently went to grad school.

Now I'm working as a GS-15 (I took a step down from SES for work-life reasons). We're comfortable (not rich), have a great work life balance, and lots of vacation time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Successful meaning financially or otherwise (maybe you're at the tippy top of a lowly paid field), do you still feel insecure about where you went to college?

I'm in my early twenties, just starting out. So many people say that it's what you do after school that matters most and that makes sense to me, logically speaking. But then I see posts from people saying they make a small fortune (high six figures/low seven) and still feel insecure about where they went to college. I'm just wondering how common that is.

Went to mid-west State U. Nothing special about it but my parents begged me to go b/c they could afford the tuition (but then ended up not paying anyway). So I went out of guilt.

I subsequently went to grad school.

Now I'm working as a GS-15 (I took a step down from SES for work-life reasons). We're comfortable (not rich), have a great work life balance, and lots of vacation time.

There's some insecurity on my part and it has nothing to do with money. I don't think that I really received a good education. College at a large university prepared me well enough to earn a good income but it didn't really educate me. I think if I had the family background to know better, the resources would have been there but I didn't know to look and zero guidance. The emphasis was heavily on graduating to a good job. I didn't realize this until my kids went to private schools and I was surrounded by well read friends. Not that you can't be well read on your own but I do believe that most elite schools provide a baseline whether it be by mandatory coursework or peer influence.

[Anonymous]

I went to my state flagship and then to a good (but not great) law school. The legal field is very snooty and lends itself to insecurities about schools. I think (or hope) that it's unique to this profession. That said, I did "make it" despite not going to HYPS.

[Anonymous]

My DW went to Universty of Miami for law school. Just made partner at a BigLaw firm. She's a rainmaker. Some Ivy associates who go couldn't pack the baggage are out. Also, her firm seems to cast a wide net in recruiting and you'll find quite a few partners and associates from good but non-top tier schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you're not good looking you're of no consequence and I don't listen to anything that comes out of your mouth , elite education or not.

This is so true, but I think its a different thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went to my state flagship and then to a good (but not great) law school. The legal field is very snooty and lends itself to insecurities about schools. I think (or hope) that it's unique to this profession. That said, I did "make it" despite not going to HYPS.

The legal field doesn't care about your undergrad tho.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: Big Ten all the way. I feel fine about it. People tend to underestimate me, which often works to my advantage.

Big 10 is not a school. It's a conference. And it has three good schools. Northwestern. And then, to a lesser extent, Michigan and Wisconsin. Cow colleges after that.

I went to one of the cow colleges.

So did I - proudly, and I have more than a dozen HYPS (as well as other great schools) graduates working for me - school selection matters from 18 to 23 or so, then everyone has to grow up and join the real world. That's when you find out who has survival instincts and grit.