Luther Jackson or Thoreau?

[Anonymous]

AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the difference in actual examples of how GE, Hon and AAP are differentiated is quite stark! It's apparent which school has an actual program of differentiated teaching and which school is shooting from the hip. What a shame.

And you know what? If your kid is really smart IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. Bravo to the poster with enough gumption to just send her brilliant kid to Thoreau because he was only a kid once.

The only people who spend time worrying about which center and dissecting how many non-AAP kids their prodigies might have to rub elbows with (horrors!) are people who don't have enough confidence in their own kids.

Actually, it does matter. Being gifted means being just as different, and learning just as differently, as those with intellectual disabilities. Different kids will be suited to different environments, but it is a fallacy to say that smart kids can do well anywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the difference in actual examples of how GE, Hon and AAP are differentiated is quite stark! It's apparent which school has an actual program of differentiated teaching and which school is shooting from the hip. What a shame.

And you know what? If your kid is really smart IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. Bravo to the poster with enough gumption to just send her brilliant kid to Thoreau because he was only a kid once.

The only people who spend time worrying about which center and dissecting how many non-AAP kids their prodigies might have to rub elbows with (horrors!) are people who don't have enough confidence in their own kids.

Actually, it does matter. Being gifted means being just as different, and learning just as differently, as those with intellectual disabilities. Different kids will be suited to different environments, but it is a fallacy to say that smart kids can do well anywhere.

I know. I have a gifted child. But those children are no longer the majority in AAP programs and to pretend that most people asking about which center truly have a gifted kid is silly. Most are just trying to figure out which place will provide a smoother launch to TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the difference in actual examples of how GE, Hon and AAP are differentiated is quite stark! It's apparent which school has an actual program of differentiated teaching and which school is shooting from the hip. What a shame.

And you know what? If your kid is really smart IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. Bravo to the poster with enough gumption to just send her brilliant kid to Thoreau because he was only a kid once.

The only people who spend time worrying about which center and dissecting how many non-AAP kids their prodigies might have to rub elbows with (horrors!) are people who don't have enough confidence in their own kids.

Actually, it does matter. Being gifted means being just as different, and learning just as differently, as those with intellectual disabilities. Different kids will be suited to different environments, but it is a fallacy to say that smart kids can do well anywhere.

+1

Also, the staff supports are different. For example, 2e kids may benefit from a school where staff have more experience and expertise in supporting the needs of 2e kids. Center schools often (but not always) have more experience/expertise with 2e kids than schools with local level IV programs simply due to numbers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the difference in actual examples of how GE, Hon and AAP are differentiated is quite stark! It's apparent which school has an actual program of differentiated teaching and which school is shooting from the hip. What a shame.

And you know what? If your kid is really smart IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. Bravo to the poster with enough gumption to just send her brilliant kid to Thoreau because he was only a kid once.

The only people who spend time worrying about which center and dissecting how many non-AAP kids their prodigies might have to rub elbows with (horrors!) are people who don't have enough confidence in their own kids.

Actually, it does matter. Being gifted means being just as different, and learning just as differently, as those with intellectual disabilities. Different kids will be suited to different environments, but it is a fallacy to say that smart kids can do well anywhere.

+1

Also, the staff supports are different. For example, 2e kids may benefit from a school where staff have more experience and expertise in supporting the needs of 2e kids. Center schools often (but not always) have more experience/expertise with 2e kids than schools with local level IV programs simply due to numbers.

OK, but what if my kid isn't 2E, but "legit" AAP (no appeals, tested in with ease, Math star). Of course, I agree being with other gifted kids and getting a differentiated education matters, but is an AAP class at Thoreau much different than an AAP class at LJ? I mean, I would imagine these are Hall of Fame teachers at LJ (or horrible teachers at Thoreau) for it to make a significant difference in my kids education?

I also am skeptical of the "LJ gets more kids into TJ" argument. I don't know much about the TJ admissions process, but I assume its student dependent with little impact from the school. With more AAP students at LJ and more marginal AAP students probably choosing Thoreau, the acceptance numbers would obviously be different. Unless there's alot of peers who assist each other in the application process or more support for applications at one school that I don't know about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the difference in actual examples of how GE, Hon and AAP are differentiated is quite stark! It's apparent which school has an actual program of differentiated teaching and which school is shooting from the hip. What a shame.

And you know what? If your kid is really smart IT. DOES. NOT. MATTER. Bravo to the poster with enough gumption to just send her brilliant kid to Thoreau because he was only a kid once.

The only people who spend time worrying about which center and dissecting how many non-AAP kids their prodigies might have to rub elbows with (horrors!) are people who don't have enough confidence in their own kids.

Actually, it does matter. Being gifted means being just as different, and learning just as differently, as those with intellectual disabilities. Different kids will be suited to different environments, but it is a fallacy to say that smart kids can do well anywhere. [/quote
+1

Also, the staff supports are different. For example, 2e kids may benefit from a school where staff have more experience and expertise in supporting the needs of 2e kids. Center schools often (but not always) have more experience/expertise with 2e kids than schools with local level IV programs simply due to numbers.

OK, but what if my kid isn't 2E, but "legit" AAP (no appeals, tested in with ease, Math star). Of course, I agree being with other gifted kids and getting a differentiated education matters, but is an AAP class at Thoreau much different than an AAP class at LJ? I mean, I would imagine these are Hall of Fame teachers at LJ (or horrible teachers at Thoreau) for it to make a significant difference in my kids education?

I also am skeptical of the "LJ gets more kids into TJ" argument. I don't know much about the TJ admissions process, but I assume its student dependent with little impact from the school. With more AAP students at LJ and more marginal AAP students probably choosing Thoreau, the acceptance numbers would obviously be different. Unless there's alot of peers who assist each other in the application process or more support for applications at one school that I don't know about?

I think each principals presentation answers your question. Enough said (or not).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

Honestly, my concern has nothing to do with the 3/4 classes and everything to do with the fact that Thoreau students are consistently considered not prepared for high school, whereas LJ students are. The TMS principal even admitted this at the meeting in November, though he did give a list of ways in which they're trying to address this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

Honestly, my concern has nothing to do with the 3/4 classes and everything to do with the fact that Thoreau students are consistently considered not prepared for high school, whereas LJ students are. The TMS principal even admitted this at the meeting in November, though he did give a list of ways in which they're trying to address this.

I think you are exaggerating here. How is it possible that Madison HS is one of the top HS in FCPS and the entire state if in fact, the students coming from TMS (who make up 85% of the Madison HS classes) are "not prepared for high school?"

How is it that the kids at Thoreau are passing their SOLs at such a high rate? You can make the argument that the AAP program at LJMS has X, Y, and Z; but when you start saying that TMS kids are "not prepared for high school" -- I cannot take you seriously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

Honestly, my concern has nothing to do with the 3/4 classes and everything to do with the fact that Thoreau students are consistently considered not prepared for high school, whereas LJ students are. The TMS principal even admitted this at the meeting in November, though he did give a list of ways in which they're trying to address this.

I think you are exaggerating here. How is it possible that Madison HS is one of the top HS in FCPS and the entire state if in fact, the students coming from TMS (who make up 85% of the Madison HS classes) are "not prepared for high school?"

How is it that the kids at Thoreau are passing their SOLs at such a high rate? You can make the argument that the AAP program at LJMS has X, Y, and Z; but when you start saying that TMS kids are "not prepared for high school" -- I cannot take you seriously.

Well, I guess you weren't at the meeting in November and haven't talked to parents of current JMHS students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

Honestly, my concern has nothing to do with the 3/4 classes and everything to do with the fact that Thoreau students are consistently considered not prepared for high school, whereas LJ students are. The TMS principal even admitted this at the meeting in November, though he did give a list of ways in which they're trying to address this.

I think you are exaggerating here. How is it possible that Madison HS is one of the top HS in FCPS and the entire state if in fact, the students coming from TMS (who make up 85% of the Madison HS classes) are "not prepared for high school?"

How is it that the kids at Thoreau are passing their SOLs at such a high rate? You can make the argument that the AAP program at LJMS has X, Y, and Z; but when you start saying that TMS kids are "not prepared for high school" -- I cannot take you seriously.

Well, I guess you weren't at the meeting in November and haven't talked to parents of current JMHS students.

Is it the block scheduling? Who isn't prepared, the AAP kids, non-AAP kids, or all kids? Also, we can talk/argue past each other all day but remember that those of us with a decision to make appreciate the specific, thoughtful, and helpful responses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is just 4 classes. One is math, which is pretty standard no matter where you go.

So can someone explain to me just how different the experience will be when it boils down to 3 classes a year? Is there more to consider besides just the classes?

Also, does the teaching matter that much? If they're in a class of all AAP kids, is t that the main thing? Are the teacher at one school really head and shoulders above another to make a difference?

Not trying to be argumentative, really would appreciate it if someone could explain it.

Honestly, my concern has nothing to do with the 3/4 classes and everything to do with the fact that Thoreau students are consistently considered not prepared for high school, whereas LJ students are. The TMS principal even admitted this at the meeting in November, though he did give a list of ways in which they're trying to address this.

It has come up in this forum before, but it is all the kids from Thoreau, including the AAP kids. I might speculate even especially them and the honors

I think you are exaggerating here. How is it possible that Madison HS is one of the top HS in FCPS and the entire state if in fact, the students coming from TMS (who make up 85% of the Madison HS classes) are "not prepared for high school?"

How is it that the kids at Thoreau are passing their SOLs at such a high rate? You can make the argument that the AAP program at LJMS has X, Y, and Z; but when you start saying that TMS kids are "not prepared for high school" -- I cannot take you seriously.

Well, I guess you weren't at the meeting in November and haven't talked to parents of current JMHS students.

Is it the block scheduling? Who isn't prepared, the AAP kids, non-AAP kids, or all kids? Also, we can talk/argue past each other all day but remember that those of us with a decision to make appreciate the specific, thoughtful, and helpful responses.

It's all the kids, including AAP and possibly especially honors. It's an acknowledged problem at JMHS, though I hope it will improve now that Thoreau and JMHS have swapped administrators. Many of the kids have trouble with the 9th grade workload. The AAP workload at LJMS is intense so those kids are used to it. Also, a lot of the problem has been related to open enrollment honors at JMHS, just as AAP ends. That means that in freshman year, school goes from three levels of instruction (regular, honors, and AAP) down to two (regular and honors). Thoreau called everything "honors" so the incoming freshmen from Thoreau tended to overestimate their ability to handle HS honors classes. It has been frustrating for them, the advanced kids who can't take anything higher than honors, and the teachers who have to try to teach to a very wide range.

[Anonymous]

Oh - and I would not look at SOL pass rates as a quality indicator of any school's advanced program. Those are very low standards. Any AAP or upper middle class student is going to pass them handily. If any school has lower pass rates than another's, it is almost certainly due to socioeconomic variability in its catchment area. Town of Vienna kids will always do well on SOLs just by virtue of their birth.

[Anonymous]

Jackson is divided into teams- a great idea for such a large school, so kids can have classes together and get to know each other, and teachers can hopefully collaborate on scheduling and support for students. AAP kids are spread out through a few teams- there is not a designated AAP team. It's fine to mix everyone up, but it does come with some challenges. Just wanted to be clear for those who are speculating - there are not AAP specific teachers, like there were in elementary school. aAp teachers teach gen ed and honors as well. Our experience was that the differentiation was minimal- a more difficult project here or there, but not enough to make a huge difference and not to the level of what we expected based on the slideshow presentation the school gave.

[Anonymous]

PP, were your kids at LJMS both years? Mine was. Her BFF went to TMS instead of LJMS for the center. Her friend said TMS was an easy A and did not prepare her for JMHS. Our DD was extremely prepared for OHS and managed all As in all honors at OHS.

Our DD had a lot more than a project here or there st LJMS, btw.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jackson is divided into teams- a great idea for such a large school, so kids can have classes together and get to know each other, and teachers can hopefully collaborate on scheduling and support for students. AAP kids are spread out through a few teams- there is not a designated AAP team. It's fine to mix everyone up, but it does come with some challenges. Just wanted to be clear for those who are speculating - there are not AAP specific teachers, like there were in elementary school. aAp teachers teach gen ed and honors as well. Our experience was that the differentiation was minimal- a more difficult project here or there, but not enough to make a huge difference and not to the level of what we expected based on the slideshow presentation the school gave.

You have kids in GE and AAP at LJ?