Typical American Career path - esp after 50

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH got laid off at 44, he has Masters in Computer Science from UC Berkeley for reference. He started his own consulting, grosses between 600-800k annually.

Full disclosure, he is extremely driven, knowledgeable and disciplined. There’s no way I could ever work that much. He is 54 now and still going strong, the biggest thing is he doesn’t have to worry about layoffs etc. He knows others in tech who went into lucrative contracting roles after layoffs.

He got in at the ground floor for tech boom and has loads of experience, probably worked at a dozen companies or a FAANG right? But what about the Cisco engineer who worked on their router firmware for 20 years and was laid off?

why would you work at teh same company/job for 20 years!! my partner moved in house from a litigation practice and in 5 years has switched roles i think 4 maybe 5 times? its not my job so i dont remember the details but i know some of the roles took away from litigation and more towards business support but point is- you shouldnt stay in one role/at one company for that long. C-suite and GC dont want to pay the same person 15-20% more for a different VP role eventhough t might come with. more work/headaces for you. Workers are just an expense, to be mitigated by exploitation, they exploit you- dont be afraid to exploit your managers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH got laid off at 44, he has Masters in Computer Science from UC Berkeley for reference. He started his own consulting, grosses between 600-800k annually.

Full disclosure, he is extremely driven, knowledgeable and disciplined. There’s no way I could ever work that much. He is 54 now and still going strong, the biggest thing is he doesn’t have to worry about layoffs etc. He knows others in tech who went into lucrative contracting roles after layoffs.

He got in at the ground floor for tech boom and has loads of experience, probably worked at a dozen companies or a FAANG right? But what about the Cisco engineer who worked on their router firmware for 20 years and was laid off?

why would you work at teh same company/job for 20 years!! my partner moved in house from a litigation practice and in 5 years has switched roles i think 4 maybe 5 times? its not my job so i dont remember the details but i know some of the roles took away from litigation and more towards business support but point is- you shouldnt stay in one role/at one company for that long. C-suite and GC dont want to pay the same person 15-20% more for a different VP role eventhough t might come with. more work/headaces for you. Workers are just an expense, to be mitigated by exploitation, they exploit you- dont be afraid to exploit your managers.

And this is the key. No one cares as much about you than YOU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH got laid off at 44, he has Masters in Computer Science from UC Berkeley for reference. He started his own consulting, grosses between 600-800k annually.

Full disclosure, he is extremely driven, knowledgeable and disciplined. There’s no way I could ever work that much. He is 54 now and still going strong, the biggest thing is he doesn’t have to worry about layoffs etc. He knows others in tech who went into lucrative contracting roles after layoffs.

He got in at the ground floor for tech boom and has loads of experience, probably worked at a dozen companies or a FAANG right? But what about the Cisco engineer who worked on their router firmware for 20 years and was laid off?

why would you work at teh same company/job for 20 years!! my partner moved in house from a litigation practice and in 5 years has switched roles i think 4 maybe 5 times? its not my job so i dont remember the details but i know some of the roles took away from litigation and more towards business support but point is- you shouldnt stay in one role/at one company for that long. C-suite and GC dont want to pay the same person 15-20% more for a different VP role eventhough t might come with. more work/headaces for you. Workers are just an expense, to be mitigated by exploitation, they exploit you- dont be afraid to exploit your managers.

And this is the key. No one cares as much about you than YOU.

To add to my comment. You can have a certain amount of loyalty, but commensurate with the loyalty the company shows you.

You should always know your worth in the marketplace and get another offer BEFORE asking your boss for more money, stock, etc...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am nearing sixty and I have clearly plateaued: I cost more than my colleagues now and I worry about being laid off: I always believed all that “we are a family” BS and now I am wondering what it was all for

Do most American aim to retire at 67? I can’t imagine a company keeping a 60 year working along side 30 year olds… it happened in the Office though?

What? This happens all the time.

[Anonymous]

No matter how much you save it won’t in most cases ever replace your income.

I was laid off a 360k job with a 24k 401k match with great health benefits at 58 with two kids in college.

I did not have a big mortgage, my cars were paid off and already had college funds. It still was a huge hit. Not only did I lose 30k a month income, I lost my medical plan and given I was putting 30k into 401k with a 24k match I lost a ton of future 401k money.

I eventually landed a new role but if that was end of road retirement would have been a bust. Now that I am working I am prepaying last of mortgage, maxing out 401k, buying CDs while rates high and investing in stock mutual funds.

I am also doing a lot of overdue work on house to get everything in tip top shape so if laid off again I don’t have home improvements popping up.

But the dream of 5 million saved, home no mortgage, little beach condo no mortgage, kids colleges paid for, two new cars in driveway when you retire at 65 is just a dream if laid off at 57 and you never work again

[Anonymous]

I guess I don’t understand where this endless supply of young workers is coming from. The generations are getting smaller. The boomers were a massive generation but went on to have significantly fewer kids. And millennials are having even fewer. And college got more expensive so fewer are going.

I have no doubt my company would love to not pay my perimenopausal ass my $250K salary and instead pay a 28 year old $80K. But it’s not happening cause they haven’t found that unicorn.

I absolutely agree ageism exists, but I think just saying all companies want to magically hire and have a company full of young people is not totally realistic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No matter how much you save it won’t in most cases ever replace your income.

I was laid off a 360k job with a 24k 401k match with great health benefits at 58 with two kids in college.

I did not have a big mortgage, my cars were paid off and already had college funds. It still was a huge hit. Not only did I lose 30k a month income, I lost my medical plan and given I was putting 30k into 401k with a 24k match I lost a ton of future 401k money.

I eventually landed a new role but if that was end of road retirement would have been a bust. Now that I am working I am prepaying last of mortgage, maxing out 401k, buying CDs while rates high and investing in stock mutual funds.

I am also doing a lot of overdue work on house to get everything in tip top shape so if laid off again I don’t have home improvements popping up.

But the dream of 5 million saved, home no mortgage, little beach condo no mortgage, kids colleges paid for, two new cars in driveway when you retire at 65 is just a dream if laid off at 57 and you never work again

That would be retiring wealthy, not just comfortable. It's out of reach for everyone except the 1%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess I don’t understand where this endless supply of young workers is coming from. The generations are getting smaller. The boomers were a massive generation but went on to have significantly fewer kids. And millennials are having even fewer. And college got more expensive so fewer are going.

I have no doubt my company would love to not pay my perimenopausal ass my $250K salary and instead pay a 28 year old $80K. But it’s not happening cause they haven’t found that unicorn.

I absolutely agree ageism exists, but I think just saying all companies want to magically hire and have a company full of young people is not totally realistic.

Immigrants. At work countries like Africa and India pump out grads for basic jobs that can be hired cheap. Also B students from mid tier colleges.

A students from good US colleges at work we don’t even recruit for entry level jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess I don’t understand where this endless supply of young workers is coming from. The generations are getting smaller. The boomers were a massive generation but went on to have significantly fewer kids. And millennials are having even fewer. And college got more expensive so fewer are going.

I have no doubt my company would love to not pay my perimenopausal ass my $250K salary and instead pay a 28 year old $80K. But it’s not happening cause they haven’t found that unicorn.

I absolutely agree ageism exists, but I think just saying all companies want to magically hire and have a company full of young people is not totally realistic.

Brilliant 28 years olds move on rather quickly. So building team of 28 year olds isn’t a practical way to do business.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No matter how much you save it won’t in most cases ever replace your income.

I was laid off a 360k job with a 24k 401k match with great health benefits at 58 with two kids in college.

I did not have a big mortgage, my cars were paid off and already had college funds. It still was a huge hit. Not only did I lose 30k a month income, I lost my medical plan and given I was putting 30k into 401k with a 24k match I lost a ton of future 401k money.

I eventually landed a new role but if that was end of road retirement would have been a bust. Now that I am working I am prepaying last of mortgage, maxing out 401k, buying CDs while rates high and investing in stock mutual funds.

I am also doing a lot of overdue work on house to get everything in tip top shape so if laid off again I don’t have home improvements popping up.

But the dream of 5 million saved, home no mortgage, little beach condo no mortgage, kids colleges paid for, two new cars in driveway when you retire at 65 is just a dream if laid off at 57 and you never work again

That would be retiring wealthy, not just comfortable. It's out of reach for everyone except the 1%.

Honestly if people had job security and health to 67 nearly everyone could do it as long as they have the skills and education.

The classic story man gets great job hires well educated wife great job. Buy a big trade up house suburbs in late 30s, with 2-3 kids and high cost child care and long commute wife quits to stay home and husband just made VP. They travel get new cars, go to dinner life good.

Then a 9/11, 2008 Financial Crisis, Covid happens and mass layoffs and the mid 50s men tossed out the door. Good lucky over paid 56 year old man job hunting in a recession.

If we had proper affordable child care and job security none of this would happen.

My relative who is 68 last worked a big job in 2004. Laid off 48 never fully recovered. String of lower paid jobs till SS at 65

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I started to worry about ageism at 40 and saved 50% or more of my salary over many years.

40 isn’t that terrible. I am not actively looking but hiring managers and recruiters are still pinging me regularly. Don’t go to an industry with a lot of young people like tech or gaming/leisure.

No one was talking about ageism when I started working at 25, and my family was all govt workers so it was a foreign concept to me.

How old are you?

I am 51, started working in 1995. The writing on the wall was already there in huge letters. I posted a link in DCUM a few months ago - there was an article in NYTimes around 2001 about middle aged tech executives who never found another comparable job after a layoff. It was called “Commute to nowhere”.

Okay? I am your age but NYT wasn’t something I read until my 30s, after which I had been working a decade. We grew up reading the small town gazette; I never lived in NY so why would I read their local paper. I’m guessing your parents had a subscription?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH got laid off at 44, he has Masters in Computer Science from UC Berkeley for reference. He started his own consulting, grosses between 600-800k annually.

Full disclosure, he is extremely driven, knowledgeable and disciplined. There’s no way I could ever work that much. He is 54 now and still going strong, the biggest thing is he doesn’t have to worry about layoffs etc. He knows others in tech who went into lucrative contracting roles after layoffs.

He got in at the ground floor for tech boom and has loads of experience, probably worked at a dozen companies or a FAANG right? But what about the Cisco engineer who worked on their router firmware for 20 years and was laid off?

why would you work at teh same company/job for 20 years!! my partner moved in house from a litigation practice and in 5 years has switched roles i think 4 maybe 5 times? its not my job so i dont remember the details but i know some of the roles took away from litigation and more towards business support but point is- you shouldnt stay in one role/at one company for that long. C-suite and GC dont want to pay the same person 15-20% more for a different VP role eventhough t might come with. more work/headaces for you. Workers are just an expense, to be mitigated by exploitation, they exploit you- dont be afraid to exploit your managers.

I entered my career because I liked the work and found it interesting; it was great to be paid a decent wage and have a more comfortable life than my teacher parents. Why would I job hop if I felt taken care of? My parents had the same job for 30 years. Your whole “look out for myself and follow the money” isn’t always everyone’s motivation. That’s how you end up 20 years working on your comfortable niche, and not knowing you are the boiling frog ready to be stewed at age 50. No one was telling me leave and I had no need for more money, and I don’t even know if other roles would pay more — companies like Cisco are pretty big in their fields.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess I don’t understand where this endless supply of young workers is coming from. The generations are getting smaller. The boomers were a massive generation but went on to have significantly fewer kids. And millennials are having even fewer. And college got more expensive so fewer are going.

I have no doubt my company would love to not pay my perimenopausal ass my $250K salary and instead pay a 28 year old $80K. But it’s not happening cause they haven’t found that unicorn.

I absolutely agree ageism exists, but I think just saying all companies want to magically hire and have a company full of young people is not totally realistic.

There are more college graduates than ever, and we are hiring illegal immigrants for the jobs high school grads used to fill, and paying them way way less to boot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No matter how much you save it won’t in most cases ever replace your income.

I was laid off a 360k job with a 24k 401k match with great health benefits at 58 with two kids in college.

I did not have a big mortgage, my cars were paid off and already had college funds. It still was a huge hit. Not only did I lose 30k a month income, I lost my medical plan and given I was putting 30k into 401k with a 24k match I lost a ton of future 401k money.

I eventually landed a new role but if that was end of road retirement would have been a bust. Now that I am working I am prepaying last of mortgage, maxing out 401k, buying CDs while rates high and investing in stock mutual funds.

I am also doing a lot of overdue work on house to get everything in tip top shape so if laid off again I don’t have home improvements popping up.

But the dream of 5 million saved, home no mortgage, little beach condo no mortgage, kids colleges paid for, two new cars in driveway when you retire at 65 is just a dream if laid off at 57 and you never work again

So now you are saving. The point is not to replace your income unless you need the entire income to live. You don’t need $360k/year to live.

You saved 30k a year? We saved more than that and earned far less than you did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I started to worry about ageism at 40 and saved 50% or more of my salary over many years.

40 isn’t that terrible. I am not actively looking but hiring managers and recruiters are still pinging me regularly. Don’t go to an industry with a lot of young people like tech or gaming/leisure.

No one was talking about ageism when I started working at 25, and my family was all govt workers so it was a foreign concept to me.

I just knew ageism would be an issue from reading articles about the topic. I knew I’d be old one day and considered too old, possibly, to work.

Things slow down after 45 unless you look very young.