s/o If you just watched or rewatched The Sopranos, let's talk about the ending

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

Don't nitpick because you're upset no one agrees with your pitiful theory some hit man also killed Carmela and AJ in defiance of all evidence to the contrary.

Fade out, black out, both applies. I'm going to vote for a brain aneurysm. Tony was having health problems and panic attacks and his erratic behavior in the last season could be explained by growing cognitive issues related to stresses in the brain. Undetected brain tumor because he never saw a proper doctor.

Bam, falls face down on his plate. A natural ending for an unnatural man.

Fact of the matter is that the restaurant is a *terrible* place for a hit job. Witnesses everywhere. Highly public venue. Unpredictable people movement. See all those kids over in the corner? And why risk killing in front of wife and family? There could be security cameras, nearby businesses would certainly have them. There's no shortages of other places to get to Tony alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

Don't nitpick because you're upset no one agrees with your pitiful theory some hit man also killed Carmela and AJ in defiance of all evidence to the contrary.

Fade out, black out, both applies. I'm going to vote for a brain aneurysm. Tony was having health problems and panic attacks and his erratic behavior in the last season could be explained by growing cognitive issues related to stresses in the brain. Undetected brain tumor because he never saw a proper doctor.

Bam, falls face down on his plate. A natural ending for an unnatural man.

Fact of the matter is that the restaurant is a *terrible* place for a hit job. Witnesses everywhere. Highly public venue. Unpredictable people movement. See all those kids over in the corner? And why risk killing in front of wife and family? There could be security cameras, nearby businesses would certainly have them. There's no shortages of other places to get to Tony alone.

It's not nitpicking to state a fact. You clearly want to be right despite several posters telling you otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

Don't nitpick because you're upset no one agrees with your pitiful theory some hit man also killed Carmela and AJ in defiance of all evidence to the contrary.

Fade out, black out, both applies. I'm going to vote for a brain aneurysm. Tony was having health problems and panic attacks and his erratic behavior in the last season could be explained by growing cognitive issues related to stresses in the brain. Undetected brain tumor because he never saw a proper doctor.

Bam, falls face down on his plate. A natural ending for an unnatural man.

Fact of the matter is that the restaurant is a *terrible* place for a hit job. Witnesses everywhere. Highly public venue. Unpredictable people movement. See all those kids over in the corner? And why risk killing in front of wife and family? There could be security cameras, nearby businesses would certainly have them. There's no shortages of other places to get to Tony alone.

It's a great place if you want to catch them by surprise. Tony had escaped multiple attempts on his life in other locations.

[Anonymous]

There is no "right" or "wrong" here, it was never fully defined at the time, so you can interpret the ending as it suits you and leave others to do the same (or do the same but differently).

It's like having a room of 1st graders, squabbling. Jesus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought it was brilliant. Interesting theory that the son & wife died, never thought about that! But I think it was limited to Tony.

It wouldn’t have been wife and kids. Code wouldn’t let someone kill them, just Tony.

Agree. Have you *ever* heard of a mob wife being killed along with the husband? It's not how it happens. They do have their "code" because it's what separates them from your regular drug gang, for whatever it's worth. Carmela and AJ are innocents and not involved in the mob activity. They were not killed. It's not some drug lord film where everyone is brutally killed.

Here's a wife that was killed and it was acknowledged that there is no longer a code: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6845655

Wives rarely targeted in Mafia attacks, says policing expert. That's from the link you posted, which admitted it's highly unusual. It also happened in 2023 and the Sopranos ended in 2007. Very confident the show's writers had absolutely no concept of having Carmela and AJ gunned down. You've been watching too many movies about drug lords.

Where does this confidence come from? Are you David Chase?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is no "right" or "wrong" here, it was never fully defined at the time, so you can interpret the ending as it suits you and leave others to do the same (or do the same but differently).

It's like having a room of 1st graders, squabbling. Jesus.

You new to DCUM?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just rewatched in February. I knew the ending was coming so the experience was different as it was not a surprise. I noticed this time there was a lot of foreshadowing of his death towards the end of the series (the episodes where he gets shot and then dreams/has out of body experience of hell) so I thought it was the logical end to a mobster's life and it had been suggested that it was coming soon. I still didn't really like it as the end to the series because it.m ended all the other story lines abruptly without conclusions, but I liked it better than the first time.

Exactly, Tony's death was foreshadowed. Carmela and AJ's deaths are the shocker.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some posters are being too superficial. I highly recommend this in-depth analysis of what happened by Mike Cole http://mikecole.org/the-sopranos-ending-made-in-america/

To summarize the ending:

"However, The Sopranos is first and foremost a work of fiction. And as such, it is likely subject to all the plot development devices commonly employed by authors of fiction including: dramatic irony, symbolism, and meaningful scene sequencing. Using an understanding of these techniques to glean clues from the final two episodes, we can clearly conclude the following:

Tony was indeed "whacked"
Carmela and AJ also were killed
Meadow lived
Patsy Parisi betrayed Tony
AJ inadvertently facilitated the murders
Rhiannon was an unwitting accomplice for the murders"

Definitely worth your time if you are a Sopranos fan!

It’s fiction but it lives in Tony’s world. It is not fantasy. A dragon did not come and burn them. A hit on a mafia boss requires the unanimous approval of the Commission in advance. If not everyone involved will be killed. Story does not lay the groundwork for that. Also never would the hit include family. If Tony was to be hit, a close friend would have picked him up somewhere to do something and killed him. One of his own people.

Fiction but you are still stuck in the world you live in. If you don’t do that then the show is crap, not realistic and foolishness.

Did you read the analysis?

I don't know who Mike Cole and a quick glance at the links shows someone who is not a show creator or writer. Just a random person.

The PP is correct. The writers were operating by the plausible behaviors of the organized mafia families. The one thing that is absent throughout the entire Sopranos series is Tony worrying about the safety of his wife and children. He's aware that he himself is a hit target sooner or later. But he never worries about Carmela or the kids. Because he knows the rules of the mafia world he moves in. He's more worried about making sure they have enough money should he be hit. As the linked article to the Canadian hit made clear, mafia spouses and children are really not targets. That the killer of the woman in Montreal was quickly found by the police tells you it wasn't your ordered mafia hit but something else, even if the killer was part of organized crime.

Ask yourself very carefully: why would another family take out Carmela and AJ? Why would they risk violating a sacred rule? Assume you're a mafia don of another family and you want to take out Tony. You know if you tell the hitman to also take out the rest of the Soprano family, you'd just substantially increased the odds that the same will happen to your own wife and children sooner or later. And you'd have a struggle on your hands with your own people because *you just don't take out the wife and kids* and there will be no respect for you from the underlings. The other families, watching what'd happened, would be more likely to take you out just to make sure you don't do the same to their own families. Because they know they can't do business with you anymore.

This is what happened: hitman walks quickly in and shoots Tony and walks right out. All in seconds. Carmela is hysterical, AJ is stunned. But when it comes to the police, all they'll remember is a blur, someone in black. Then, one way or another, word will get to Carmela that as long as she can't remember anything else about the face, she'll be ok and there will always be money. And that's it. She will teach herself to forget anything she saw, bury Tony and get on with life.

So you didn't read it. Typical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some posters are being too superficial. I highly recommend this in-depth analysis of what happened by Mike Cole http://mikecole.org/the-sopranos-ending-made-in-america/

To summarize the ending:

"However, The Sopranos is first and foremost a work of fiction. And as such, it is likely subject to all the plot development devices commonly employed by authors of fiction including: dramatic irony, symbolism, and meaningful scene sequencing. Using an understanding of these techniques to glean clues from the final two episodes, we can clearly conclude the following:

Tony was indeed "whacked"
Carmela and AJ also were killed
Meadow lived
Patsy Parisi betrayed Tony
AJ inadvertently facilitated the murders
Rhiannon was an unwitting accomplice for the murders"

Definitely worth your time if you are a Sopranos fan!

It’s fiction but it lives in Tony’s world. It is not fantasy. A dragon did not come and burn them. A hit on a mafia boss requires the unanimous approval of the Commission in advance. If not everyone involved will be killed. Story does not lay the groundwork for that. Also never would the hit include family. If Tony was to be hit, a close friend would have picked him up somewhere to do something and killed him. One of his own people.

Fiction but you are still stuck in the world you live in. If you don’t do that then the show is crap, not realistic and foolishness.

Did you read the analysis?

yup. All points to Tony was not killed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

Don't nitpick because you're upset no one agrees with your pitiful theory some hit man also killed Carmela and AJ in defiance of all evidence to the contrary.

Fade out, black out, both applies. I'm going to vote for a brain aneurysm. Tony was having health problems and panic attacks and his erratic behavior in the last season could be explained by growing cognitive issues related to stresses in the brain. Undetected brain tumor because he never saw a proper doctor.

Bam, falls face down on his plate. A natural ending for an unnatural man.

Fact of the matter is that the restaurant is a *terrible* place for a hit job. Witnesses everywhere. Highly public venue. Unpredictable people movement. See all those kids over in the corner? And why risk killing in front of wife and family? There could be security cameras, nearby businesses would certainly have them. There's no shortages of other places to get to Tony alone.

It's not nitpicking to state a fact. You clearly want to be right despite several posters telling you otherwise.

+1 NP here but the cut to black was so sudden that people called their cable companies at the time to see if something went awry. It’s just completely wrong to call it a fade.

[Anonymous]

Look as I said above -- if Tony is killed then this is fantasy -- you might as well have had a dragon or a wizrd come in and kill him. That was not the show. It was set in a real place with real rules.

It would be as if in Band of Brothers a private said I am in charge now and leads the attack. Can't happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look as I said above -- if Tony is killed then this is fantasy -- you might as well have had a dragon or a wizrd come in and kill him. That was not the show. It was set in a real place with real rules.

It would be as if in Band of Brothers a private said I am in charge now and leads the attack. Can't happen.

It's fiction. Watch a mob documentary if you want reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look as I said above -- if Tony is killed then this is fantasy -- you might as well have had a dragon or a wizrd come in and kill him. That was not the show. It was set in a real place with real rules.

It would be as if in Band of Brothers a private said I am in charge now and leads the attack. Can't happen.

Band of Brothers is based on real people and real events, Easy Company in WW2. The Sopranos are a fictitious mob family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just watched the ending on Youtube.

Tony is looking up just as it fades out, strongly suggesting he's seeing Meadow walking into the restaurant. Timing is right for this if you count the seconds from her dashing from the car to the restaurant.

If that's Meadow walking into the restaurant, the hit must be from behind Tony, which could be someone coming from the bathroom.

However, I will say, there's plenty of diners in the restaurant plus the restaurant staff. Seems like a terrible place for a hit. Too many witnesses. Unless, of course, the hitman took out everyone in the restaurant, eh?

Maybe he does die but from a brain aneurysm or heart attack?

No way a hit man takes out Tony and Carmela and AJ and coolly walks out with every eyes watching him.

It doesn't fade out; it is black immediately.

Don't nitpick because you're upset no one agrees with your pitiful theory some hit man also killed Carmela and AJ in defiance of all evidence to the contrary.

Fade out, black out, both applies. I'm going to vote for a brain aneurysm. Tony was having health problems and panic attacks and his erratic behavior in the last season could be explained by growing cognitive issues related to stresses in the brain. Undetected brain tumor because he never saw a proper doctor.

Bam, falls face down on his plate. A natural ending for an unnatural man.

Fact of the matter is that the restaurant is a *terrible* place for a hit job. Witnesses everywhere. Highly public venue. Unpredictable people movement. See all those kids over in the corner? And why risk killing in front of wife and family? There could be security cameras, nearby businesses would certainly have them. There's no shortages of other places to get to Tony alone.

It's not nitpicking to state a fact. You clearly want to be right despite several posters telling you otherwise.

"Several posters"? Sure, kiddo. There's only one poster on here who thinks the family was killed, and with nothing credible to back it up. Fade out and black out are still the the same thing.

I did go down the google rabbit hole search and there's no shortages of theories but I was intrigued by the interview with David Chase when he talked about his original plan for having Tony killed while driving, which would be an appropriate ending for a show that always started with Tony driving. But Chase became disturbed by so many of the Soprano fans eagerly looking forward to watching Tony get killed, and it bothered him. So he decided not to give us an ending where we'd see Tony killed.

I do think Tony dies but not necessarily killed.