Benefits of being a high school graduate in DC

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I can only speak anecdotally, but it seems like DCPS kids (I only know JR and Walls) seem to punch above their weight in college admissions.

I hear horror stories from parents in VA about how their kid was rejected by VT or UVA and their kids have incredible grades, stats, etc...and then I look at the kids I know from JR and Walls getting accepted into those schools with scores, stats, etc. that are nothing incredible. I don't know what majors kids are applying for which could impact it or what...that is why it is all anecdotal.

We also know a number of parents with kids at SJC and JR and they will make the same comment...that kids that have been friends (or even siblings) and were similar at Deal and have similar classes at JR and SJC and similar test scores...the JR kids seem to get "better" college acceptances.

Perhaps DCPS schools are all considered challenged...I honestly don't know.

One final comment on DC TAG...if you look beyond the expensive state flagships (UVA very expensive OOS...Michigan and Cal schools also expensive OOS), then DC TAG can be meaningful. There are a number of state flagships like University of Nebraska, University of South Carolina and others that offer in-state tuition as merit inducement for OOS candidates. In that instance, you receive in-state tuition, plus DC TAG and can attend those schools for very little out-of-pocket $$$s on a net basis.




Going to a large DC public school creates a different type of student that one who attended SJC. I wouldn’t assume that they are a lesser choice or less qualified. They’ve had a very different experience and bring that with them.


A lot of universities don’t want to deal with students who are able to think critically and thus Catholic school students are often disfavored.


DCPS grads think critically? A solid half can't even read.

What a deeply stupid comment from one of the legion of ignoramus who know nothing about DCPS and schools like Walls, JR, McKinley, and Banneker and yet, like moths to a flame, can’t help coming to the DCPS forum to parade their ignorance.


PP is incorrect - 2/3 can't read. See Slide 12. https://osse.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/osse/page_content/attachments/Assessment%202023%20Deck_.08.24_0.pdf
And three of the four high schools you cite are application-based, which indicates that they're pulling from the top candidates. The majority of students in DC cannot perform at grade level in reading. It's not controversial. The data are right there and no amount of DCUM boosting will change that. Students in public schools deserve better, but putting down kids who attend parochial schools won't help. However, it does imply that if you're the kind of person who absolutely needs your kid to be valedictorian, DCPS could be a good place for you.



Not sure what you are referring to about parochial school students. My post didn’t mention parochial schools.

The slide you highlighted indicates that just over half of DCPS students met or approached expectations on PARCC exams — a terribly designed test with many issues that almost all states have dropped. Please point me to where the presentation said anything resembling “2/3 of DCPS students can’t read.”

While you’re at it, help my understand why it was so important to you yo take time out of your day to defend the obnoxious, juvenile snark of the previous poster - to the the point of looking up data about PARCC scores and then misrepresenting it in an attempt to double down on the obnoxious, juvenile snark? Why is that your priority?
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!


Are you claiming that this board is full of posters who have kids at DCPS high schools other than JR, Walls, or DESA? LOL. No, virtually zero Dunbar or Anacostia parents are on this board.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


You make some sweeping generalizations that are just wrong.

I don't think the college outcomes are that good, and I do care about a lot more than just college. I'm sure I'm not alone.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


DCPS isn't great, period, top, bottom or middle. By the time we made it to 5th grade at our well-regarded and seriously high SES EotP DCPS ES were were paying almost as much for tutors as we would have paid for a basic parochial school. We were hardly alone. We had enough and bailed for a private.

That's, um, the real story.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


DCPS isn't great, period, top, bottom or middle. By the time we made it to 5th grade at our well-regarded and seriously high SES EotP DCPS ES were were paying almost as much for tutors as we would have paid for a basic parochial school. We were hardly alone. We had enough and bailed for a private.

That's, um, the real story.


Well, then I don't suppose you're particularly well-qualified to speak to the quality of high schools, yet here you are.
Anonymous
NP. I teach AP and IBD high school humanities, have taught in DCPS, Fairfax and Arlington in the past 25 years.

I know of what I speak when I report that there are no great high schools or middle schools in DCPS or DCPCS. There are mediocre high schools and middle schools, bad ones and catastrophic ones. Banneker, Walls, J-R, BASIS, McKinley, Latin, all thoroughly mediocre as compared to top suburban programs.

Some DCPS and DCPCS graduates excel anyway, with a small number going on to IvyPlus colleges each year. If you can make DC public schools work for your family all the way up, more power to you. If you can't, you're a run of the mill high SES family in this Metro area, particularly if you're Asian.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:NP. I teach AP and IBD high school humanities, have taught in DCPS, Fairfax and Arlington in the past 25 years.

I know of what I speak when I report that there are no great high schools or middle schools in DCPS or DCPCS. There are mediocre high schools and middle schools, bad ones and catastrophic ones. Banneker, Walls, J-R, BASIS, McKinley, Latin, all thoroughly mediocre as compared to top suburban programs.

Some DCPS and DCPCS graduates excel anyway, with a small number going on to IvyPlus colleges each year. If you can make DC public schools work for your family all the way up, more power to you. If you can't, you're a run of the mill high SES family in this Metro area, particularly if you're Asian.


Don’t tell the Walls parents this. They think they’re already at an Ivy.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


You make some sweeping generalizations that are just wrong.

I don't think the college outcomes are that good, and I do care about a lot more than just college. I'm sure I'm not alone.


Oh, so you are one of the private school types that pays for school and says "it's not about the outcomes." If you don't care, there are a lot of options for you. The parents I know are more than satisfied with the choices their kids had. They are doing very well also. Hope mine have a similar outcome.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


DCPS isn't great, period, top, bottom or middle. By the time we made it to 5th grade at our well-regarded and seriously high SES EotP DCPS ES were were paying almost as much for tutors as we would have paid for a basic parochial school. We were hardly alone. We had enough and bailed for a private.

That's, um, the real story.


Umm, name well regarded ES you speak of....Nothing to do with HS but I'm curious...
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!


Many kids in the US are average too, as are many public schools. The vast majority of kids don’t go to Ivies—those are for the tippy top. In fact not even half of Americans go to college! Yet many of these people are nevertheless happy and successful. Classic DCUM thinking no school is good enough for their child because not enough grads go to Ivies. What a hilariously out of touch perspective.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!


Many kids in the US are average too, as are many public schools. The vast majority of kids don’t go to Ivies—those are for the tippy top. In fact not even half of Americans go to college! Yet many of these people are nevertheless happy and successful. Classic DCUM thinking no school is good enough for their child because not enough grads go to Ivies. What a hilariously out of touch perspective.


Out of touch, perhaps, but you surely know it's because we ourselves went to top schools and / or Ivies. We just want to position our children, who we know to be of similar intelligence to us, to have similar opportunities. Though, I personally, have a kid who doesn't seemed destined for that, I understand why others of my ilk would want it. And frankly, the District of Columbia attracts a lot of smarties. Educating their kids comes with the job of running a school district in the nation's capital of the most powerful nation in the world. My generation of parents (raised in the 70s, Free to Be You and Me generation) highly values sending our kids to public schools. We're sending our kids to public high schools here in higher numbers. Judge us if you will, but we see diversity and even being a minority as a white person as valuable, perhaps beyond even an elite education. The question is: Will the District will decide to properly educate our kids?
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!


Many kids in the US are average too, as are many public schools. The vast majority of kids don’t go to Ivies—those are for the tippy top. In fact not even half of Americans go to college! Yet many of these people are nevertheless happy and successful. Classic DCUM thinking no school is good enough for their child because not enough grads go to Ivies. What a hilariously out of touch perspective.


Out of touch, perhaps, but you surely know it's because we ourselves went to top schools and / or Ivies. We just want to position our children, who we know to be of similar intelligence to us, to have similar opportunities. Though, I personally, have a kid who doesn't seemed destined for that, I understand why others of my ilk would want it. And frankly, the District of Columbia attracts a lot of smarties. Educating their kids comes with the job of running a school district in the nation's capital of the most powerful nation in the world. My generation of parents (raised in the 70s, Free to Be You and Me generation) highly values sending our kids to public schools. We're sending our kids to public high schools here in higher numbers. Judge us if you will, but we see diversity and even being a minority as a white person as valuable, perhaps beyond even an elite education. The question is: Will the District will decide to properly educate our kids?


I'm going to print this out for the folder I keep for my spouse labeled "Reasons I would like to move out of the DMV as swiftly as possible." Thank you for your contribution!
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I used to think like PP above. Then I moved my kids from NW to MoCo for high school after a divorce. My ex lives in Chevy Chase MD and we share custody.

What I get in MoCo that I didn't get in JKLM or at Deal, and wouldn't have had at J-R, are systemic supports, capacity and competence that exceeds that in DCPS by a country mile.

I get better tech, better guidance counselors, better trained teachers overall, a more stable teaching force, better school discipline, a much larger high-performing peer group, much better ECs across the board, more transparency and a accountability (loads), more serious AP classes, IBD classes, more classes past the AP level, more foreign languages taught better, far more flexibility in what my kid can learn, superior school leadership, better facilities across the board and less crowding. I could go on.


Have you read any of the MoCo parent issues? They are on fire and say something totally different. Every school system is great at the top-parents make sure of that. It's the lower tier schools that tell the real story.


I take your point, but, really, who says DCPS is "great at the top"? Parents are battling against some strong, entrenched currents who think eliminiating the tops eliminates the existence of a lower tier.


A lot of Banneker, Walls, and JR parents don't care about those currents. It's all just noise. The kids have pretty good college outcomes and that's what matters.


Amen. This board is filled with commentators who don’t have kids at the DCPS schools you mention.

Many kids in DC are average and perform to their ability but the parents don’t want to admit their kid is average so they blame the school/curriculum/other students. Tracey Flick doesn’t have an average intelligence child!


Many kids in the US are average too, as are many public schools. The vast majority of kids don’t go to Ivies—those are for the tippy top. In fact not even half of Americans go to college! Yet many of these people are nevertheless happy and successful. Classic DCUM thinking no school is good enough for their child because not enough grads go to Ivies. What a hilariously out of touch perspective.


Out of touch, perhaps, but you surely know it's because we ourselves went to top schools and / or Ivies. We just want to position our children, who we know to be of similar intelligence to us, to have similar opportunities. Though, I personally, have a kid who doesn't seemed destined for that, I understand why others of my ilk would want it. And frankly, the District of Columbia attracts a lot of smarties. Educating their kids comes with the job of running a school district in the nation's capital of the most powerful nation in the world. My generation of parents (raised in the 70s, Free to Be You and Me generation) highly values sending our kids to public schools. We're sending our kids to public high schools here in higher numbers. Judge us if you will, but we see diversity and even being a minority as a white person as valuable, perhaps beyond even an elite education. The question is: Will the District will decide to properly educate our kids?


I'm going to print this out for the folder I keep for my spouse labeled "Reasons I would like to move out of the DMV as swiftly as possible." Thank you for your contribution!


Where's the lie though?
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