Teens steal a car and run over biker for fun

[Anonymous]

I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

If teen offenders can’t be expected to behave like a human being until they’re 40 and low IQ offenders can’t be expected to behave like an human being at all ever (per your comment) then they should be locked up until 40 or forever, respectively, to keep the rest of society safe after they commit one violent crime.

Your heart is bleeding for the wrong people. Start caring about the innocent victims! That’s who we need to protect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

Agree. And we need consistency across the country. It should not be up to local DAs whether to prosecute crimes. Previous posters have claimed that jail time doesn’t deter crime, but that’s because all of these criminals have friends who did not go to prison for their crimes, so they’re willing to take the risk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

If teen offenders can’t be expected to behave like a human being until they’re 40 and low IQ offenders can’t be expected to behave like an human being at all ever (per your comment) then they should be locked up until 40 or forever, respectively, to keep the rest of society safe after they commit one violent crime.

Your heart is bleeding for the wrong people. Start caring about the innocent victims! That’s who we need to protect.

I *DO* care for victims as well as offenders. Unlike most of the self righteous ninnies posting comments to this thread, I have actually spent decades working in the criminal justice system as a victim advocate, defense attorney, prosecutor and dependency/neglect attorney on child neglect/abuse cases. I have doubtless far more education and training on the issues pertinent to this subject than any of you, most of you have merely got opinions that apparently come out of your anuses. I have seen firsthand both the agony AND capacity for forgiveness exhibited by victims and their families. Life is not black and white, it is a million permutations of grey. Again, you think your children are incapable of violent crime. NO CHILD is incapable of violent crime. No adult is incapable of violent crime.

Grow the F up, seriously. Some of you should be deeply ashamed of your infantile thinking.

[Anonymous]

This view has been long accepted in societies and cultures around the world, and the anti-death penalty crusade is just a liberal political project whose time will come and go.

Any facts to back up this extreme prediction of yours?

Fewer than 30% of the world's countries have the death penalty, and many of those don't currently use it. Even Russia has not actually executed anyone for years. Japan, a country of over 100 million people, executed 1 person last year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

If teen offenders can’t be expected to behave like a human being until they’re 40 and low IQ offenders can’t be expected to behave like an human being at all ever (per your comment) then they should be locked up until 40 or forever, respectively, to keep the rest of society safe after they commit one violent crime.

Your heart is bleeding for the wrong people. Start caring about the innocent victims! That’s who we need to protect.

I *DO* care for victims as well as offenders. Unlike most of the self righteous ninnies posting comments to this thread, I have actually spent decades working in the criminal justice system as a victim advocate, defense attorney, prosecutor and dependency/neglect attorney on child neglect/abuse cases. I have doubtless far more education and training on the issues pertinent to this subject than any of you, most of you have merely got opinions that apparently come out of your anuses. I have seen firsthand both the agony AND capacity for forgiveness exhibited by victims and their families. Life is not black and white, it is a million permutations of grey. Again, you think your children are incapable of violent crime. NO CHILD is incapable of violent crime. No adult is incapable of violent crime.

Grow the F up, seriously. Some of you should be deeply ashamed of your infantile thinking.

You’ll be singing a different tune when it’s your own child killed by one of these monsters. It’s easy to say all these flowery things when you have no personal consequences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

If teen offenders can’t be expected to behave like a human being until they’re 40 and low IQ offenders can’t be expected to behave like an human being at all ever (per your comment) then they should be locked up until 40 or forever, respectively, to keep the rest of society safe after they commit one violent crime.

Your heart is bleeding for the wrong people. Start caring about the innocent victims! That’s who we need to protect.

I *DO* care for victims as well as offenders. Unlike most of the self righteous ninnies posting comments to this thread, I have actually spent decades working in the criminal justice system as a victim advocate, defense attorney, prosecutor and dependency/neglect attorney on child neglect/abuse cases. I have doubtless far more education and training on the issues pertinent to this subject than any of you, most of you have merely got opinions that apparently come out of your anuses. I have seen firsthand both the agony AND capacity for forgiveness exhibited by victims and their families. Life is not black and white, it is a million permutations of grey. Again, you think your children are incapable of violent crime. NO CHILD is incapable of violent crime. No adult is incapable of violent crime.

Grow the F up, seriously. Some of you should be deeply ashamed of your infantile thinking.

I feel pretty confident that I would not steal a car, run over a bicylist on purpose, joke about, leave his body on the side of the road, then post it on social media.

This is a deeply, deeply disturbing sequence of events, and you’re completely delusional for trying to pretend it’s just some kind of youthful mistake.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

You really don't know how the brains of minors, especially neglected ones, operate.

You should not be chiming in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

Agree. And we need consistency across the country. It should not be up to local DAs whether to prosecute crimes. Previous posters have claimed that jail time doesn’t deter crime, but that’s because all of these criminals have friends who did not go to prison for their crimes, so they’re willing to take the risk.

Explain how this would work then. All crimes would be under the purview of the Department of Justice? Unelected individuals in Washington DC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

You really don't know how the brains of minors, especially neglected ones, operate.

You should not be chiming in.

if their brains are so erratic then they need to be isolated from society.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

That is closed to my view that no one is justifying the gravity of their actions but that the death penalty is not the answer.



Of course they should be punished in realistic ways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

That is closed to my view that no one is justifying the gravity of their actions but that the death penalty is not the answer.



Of course they should be punished in realistic ways.

Yes, like being permanently separated from decent folks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

If teen offenders can’t be expected to behave like a human being until they’re 40 and low IQ offenders can’t be expected to behave like an human being at all ever (per your comment) then they should be locked up until 40 or forever, respectively, to keep the rest of society safe after they commit one violent crime.

Your heart is bleeding for the wrong people. Start caring about the innocent victims! That’s who we need to protect.

I *DO* care for victims as well as offenders. Unlike most of the self righteous ninnies posting comments to this thread, I have actually spent decades working in the criminal justice system as a victim advocate, defense attorney, prosecutor and dependency/neglect attorney on child neglect/abuse cases. I have doubtless far more education and training on the issues pertinent to this subject than any of you, most of you have merely got opinions that apparently come out of your anuses. I have seen firsthand both the agony AND capacity for forgiveness exhibited by victims and their families. Life is not black and white, it is a million permutations of grey. Again, you think your children are incapable of violent crime. NO CHILD is incapable of violent crime. No adult is incapable of violent crime.

Grow the F up, seriously. Some of you should be deeply ashamed of your infantile thinking.

Fail. If your credentials are true, your views and way of expressing yourself embody the moral bankruptcy of the system. Public safety is an important societal goal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No person should be judged and condemned forever on the worst act of their lives when they act was committed when they were very young and thus their frontal lobe not fully developed. We know from neuroscience that the brains of teenagers are fundamentally different than the brains of adults. It is far more reprehensible for an fully functioning normal IQ adult to commit a murder than for a teenager to commit a murder.

Throwing people away at 15, 16, 17 just doesn't make sense. Of course there should be accountability, but teenagers have a far greater capacity for rehabilitation than do adult offenders, and we should give them the opportunity. Very few teenage offenders are psychopaths or sociopaths - and we can assess for those that are. The black and white thinking displayed in many of the comments on this board is chilling. You think you know that your teenager is incapable of heinous acts, but you don't in fact know this. Plenty of the teenagers in the juvenile justice system were raised by good parents who instilled good morals. But the human brain is what it is, and in young humans it is highly volatile, impulsive and lacks capacity to appreciate long term consequences. Add to that intoxicating substances and the recipe far too often leads to disaster.

Here is just one story of the capacity for rehabilitation; there are thousands more out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/20/us/philadelphia-larry-miller-edward-white/index.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/01/21/nike-executive-larry-miller-thankful-family-of-man-he-killed-forgives-him.html

These people are the exception not the rule. How many people are hurt and killed because we wanted to give someone another chance? At some point the well being of the group has to be more important than the well being of any individual. This weird Christian belief that everyone can and should be saved is foolish and damaging to all of us. This wasn’t a kid who suddenly got angry and killed someone in a fight, he deliberately and slowly did this. He didn’t even need to be egged on. Is the brain fully formed at 17? No but 99.9% of teenagers don’t maim and kill people. They don’t even hurt anyone at all. Let’s stop acting like they don’t have agency. Heck in less than a year they’ll give him a gun a let him be in the army.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I disagree with everyone on this thread. IMO these kids should be charged as adults and punished for committing murder. But the point isn't revenge or justice for the killed biker. The point is to protect other potential victims, either further of victims of these boys or of copy-cat violent boys.

So, yes, these boys brains aren't fully developed, but clemency can't be offered because it will embolden at-risk minors to commit more violent crimes, harming themselves as well as their victims. Think of the violent boys living in your neighborhood, and believe me, they are there. We have a duty to deter them from violence until their brains fully develop too.

You really don't know how the brains of minors, especially neglected ones, operate.

You should not be chiming in.

I care about their ACTIONS and how they harm others.