El Salvador

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Wow, a lot of diverse opinions! Our family has been to Costa Rica and Nicaragua and we liked both places. This time, I am taking my 70-year old mom along so I am a little more risk-averse. We are hoping for pretty beaches and also hiking. Not planning on going to restaurants or stores except for groceries. In any case, thanks to the PPs and welcome any other advice or suggestions!

OP - if you want to go you should go!! I've been twice and I'm so glad I did (granted it was 15 years ago). The first was with my in-laws (pre-kids). I had an advantage because they are both former Peace Core, had lived there and knew where to take us, knew people so they were our guides and had a great inside view of the country.

The second time I went back with my mom, who at the time, was a Spanish teacher and we went on her Spring Break. We had my in-laws good friends take us around. We stayed in the nicest hotel in San Salvadore which was (in 2006) was $120.00 American dollars. Everyone is so friendly

The things I recommend 1. Learn about the assassination of Archbishop Oscar Romero and the Jesuit Priests. Fascinating history and museum display

2. Suchitoto - interesting Colonial town. We said at a nice inn right on Lake Suchitoto

3. Go to the pupupa restaurant on top of a volcano overlooking San Salvadore (can't remember the name). To this day, my husband and I say they were the best
pupusas we've ever had and what a view.

4. Take a hike and see the coffee bean fields

5. Surfing (if you're into this)

Note: we did a lot of things off the beaten track like see the medical clinic in a tiny village where my MIL worked at or the school my FIL helped get up and running or driving around the city

Sorry. Having a Peace Corps volunteer show you around is apparently disqualifying.

PP here - ha! Ok, kinda true

I'm kidding. I'm referring to a response to one of my prior posts, where some obnoxious troll gave me grief for saying I got to know Honduras by visiting a relative in the Peace Corps there.

PP here. No one trolled you. Rather, I offered a counterpoint to your bizarre and obsessive need to depict El Salvador as difficult, unclean, and having unattractive beaches. It is none of those things. I really wish you would stop maligning the country, which happens to be the homeland for some of the kindest and hardest working people in the DC area. You said you were leaving the thread, but then you couldn’t help yourself and you came back for more. It’s very strange.

Anyway, as I said above, El Salvador is a wonderful and authentic destination, and very easily could meet OP’s stated desires for a family trip. In addition to broad, sandy beaches (of course be careful of rip tides, as anywhere in the Pacific), there are mountain hikes, waterfalls, colonial towns, and volcanic lakes to explore. There is also interesting history, including the Oscar Romero museum that another poster mentioned, as well as another dedicated to the country’s civil war and related violence that I found instructive. Please accept that not everyone needs or desires the calm Caribbean waters of Roatan, or needs the handholding of a Peace Corps volunteer to enjoy the authenticity of Central America. We understand that you do, and that’s fine, but please stop forcing your brand of travel on others and disparaging a hospitable country and people in the process.

Oh, stop trolling please. I'm not "maligning the country" and I didn't say a damned thing to malign the people. In fact, I said I loved our visit and we had a great time. You really have no idea who you are talking to AT ALL. You can try all you want to paint me as someone who doesn't know what they're talking about or to make it out as if you know so much more than me and have more "authentic" experience and knowledge of Central American than I do -- but you don't, trust me.

The only point that I've been trying to make is that if someone is looking for a beach vacation in Central America for spring break, which is how I interpreted OP's question, there are better options than El Salvador. OP has clarified that, yes, she wants to bring her 70-year-old mother for a beach and hiking trip. So, I challenge you, Oh Wise and Sanctimonious One, to identify the "broad, sandy beaches" of El Salvador where OP and her mother could enjoy an authentic Salvadoran experience surrounded by the locals. Because, see, you are talking to someone who is fluent in Spanish, has explored the entire friggin' region by chicken bus on trips lasting months as a time.

It's possible to love a country and love a people while at the same time be honest about what a landscape looks like and to think that a certain location probably isn't the best choice for a certain kind of trip.

In short, get the hell off of your high horse.

I already mentioned a nice beach near San Salvador: San Marcelino. Beautiful Pacific beach with plenty of nice seafood stalls. There are many others of course. Just ask the thousands of Canadians who flock annually to the Decameron on the coast near Santa Ana. And you claim to like the country and its people, but you just think the beaches suck and the country as a whole is dirty and not appropriate for most “North Americans”? Because those are kind of incompatible sentiments. Reading between the lines, it seems quite clear you have a superiority complex and think OP and her decrepit mother should stick to Puerto Rico or Punta Cana or whatever. We get it, you’ve said it a million times. So please let OP decide for herself at this point. Your chicken bus storiea are neither original nor exciting, thanks.

I've never been to either Punta Cana or Puerto Rico. San Marcelino is a decent beach, sure, but "beautiful" is a real exaggeration. Most beach lovers aren't fans of grey sand.

As for the Canadians -- HA! You can't swing a dead cat anywhere in a less expensive part of Central America without hitting a dozen of them. They'll go anywhere down there that's cheap where they won't bother trying to learn or speak the language, will stick entirely to themselves, exploit the locals, and leave lousy tips. If Decameron has "thousands of Canadians flocking" there, all that tells me is to look somewhere else.

I’m not suggesting that OP go to the Decameron — only pointing out that if ES is safe enough for thousands of sun seeking Canadians on charter flights, it’s safe enough for OP and her mother. In any event, it doesn’t sound like OP’s sole desire for the trip is the world’s most beautiful beach, so not sure why you’re so hung up on that.

You're confusing me with a poster who thinks El Salvador isn't safe enough for tourists. I never said that. In fact, I'm the poster who noted earlier that violent crime has dropped considerably since when the Peace Corps was pulled out.

"Sun seeking Canadians on charter flights" are the absolute worst, by the way. They don't go to the best places. They go to the cheap ones.

cough…Cuba…cough

[Anonymous]

Yea, Cuba would be cool. The Canadians got that one right.
I'll grant you that.

[Anonymous]

Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yea, Cuba would be cool. The Canadians got that one right.
I'll grant you that.

Wasn’t implying that the Canuckleheads got it “right”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

Sorry, but no -- you have been being nasty since your very first post. You immediately started hurling insults. You know the cliche: you can disagree without being disagreeable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yea, Cuba would be cool. The Canadians got that one right.
I'll grant you that.

Wasn’t implying that the Canuckleheads got it “right”

Not sure what you mean. I'd love to go to Cuba. Without the Canadians, of course!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

Yea, that happened to us every day while we were there -- except it was local Salvadorans who we spoke with, not "American Salvadorans" on vacation, and it was in Spanish, not English, and we didn't travel with drivers and guides.

Which one of us is pampered again?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

Yea, that happened to us every day while we were there -- except it was local Salvadorans who we spoke with, not "American Salvadorans" on vacation, and it was in Spanish, not English, and we didn't travel with drivers and guides.

Which one of us is pampered again?

You are really reaching now! Why do you think my conversation with the Salvadoran American wasn’t in Spanish. As my Salvadoran hiking guide was with me (an elderly-ish man from the village) who didn’t speak any English, of course we were conversing in Spanish!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

Yea, that happened to us every day while we were there -- except it was local Salvadorans who we spoke with, not "American Salvadorans" on vacation, and it was in Spanish, not English, and we didn't travel with drivers and guides.

Which one of us is pampered again?

You are really reaching now! Why do you think my conversation with the Salvadoran American wasn’t in Spanish. As my Salvadoran hiking guide was with me (an elderly-ish man from the village) who didn’t speak any English, of course we were conversing in Spanish!

Sorry, but you're not going to be able to out "authentic" me. When it comes to international travel and living, especially in Latin America, I can one up you every time!

[Anonymous]

I am fascinated by this thread. It is reminding me of my early 20s in DC when I'd bump into the global non-profit / Peace Corps crowd who just LOVED to humblebrag (although we hadn't invented that term then) about their travels, each competing with the other to tell stories of the "real" "authentic" travel they had done. Usually they were wearing some kind of Guatemalan textile while they did it. Dreads optional; makeup not allowed ever.

Anyway, these folks especially loved to point to tourist spots and say "that's not the REAL Mexico/South Africa/India." Woe betide you if you had gone somewhere touristy, even by accident! And then there were gradations of judgment in case you had been to the country they knew the most about. Did you stay in hostels? Ohhh, well THEY had lived with a family / camped in the jungle / squatted in an abandoned building / whatever. Do you speak Spanish? Ohhh, well THEY had gone and married a native speaker and now use all the street slang and innuendo that you will never master. You think you actually KNOW Guatemala! Ha! Not until you've spent a year living in the countryside with no running water can you even PRETEND you know ANYTHING about Guatemala! They, and only they, could be authorities on the country they'd been to.

Oddly, their advice often differed greatly from that of people from the actual country, who (gasp!) sometimes enjoy visiting their own tourist spots themselves, and (double gasp!) would sometimes complain about crime, politics, trash, and other problems.

And FYI I did some pretty adventurous travel myself back then, including riding many second class "chicken" buses in Latin America, but quickly realized that there was no competing with these people in the Authentic Travel Olympics (tm). And it's definitely not good to ask them for travel advice because they will sneer at anyone else who does not meet their exacting standards for Who is the Right Kind of Traveler.

Also, as someone who has worked with asylum-seekers, I find the comments about them upthread to be absolutely abhorrent. First of all, there is no neat divide between "economic migrants" and "refugees." Second, a lot of them are actually reluctant to even share the full details of the horrors they have escaped from. It's much more common for someone to say "I came to the US for a better life" and only later to reveal the fact that they were threatened, raped, had family members killed by gangs, etc. And the lawyers who advocate for these people are required to provide evidence of these threats in immigration court. So yeah, someone who claims to "know" these countries better than anyone else and then who also sneers at anyone who would consider going there for being the "wrong" kind of traveler is just really...special.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Often reading these threads that get nasty, I have a very clear image of who the nasty-poster is. I just came to this thread and am really befuddled by PP who is the El Salvador tourism department (and simultaneously bashing on Asylees). Do they work for the Salvadoran embassy maybe?

Also, there’s a whole subset of posters on this forum that act like if you go anywhere with a Marriott, you are a hopelessly basic person “and if that’s just who you are, that’s great for you, but I could never be that pathetically boring and inauthentic.”

Well, I’m the so-called pro-El Salvador poster, and I’m also a Marriott Gold member of Marriott. In fact, so I guess your image is wrong!

The point is that El Salvador has a lot more to offer than beaches. If that’s truly the only reason you’re visiting, then I agree you should pick another destination. But I heard OP say she was interested in other things, like nature hikes, etc, and El Salvador is a great destination for that. I did some great ones in the mountains with a local guide, and actually remember passing a Salvadoran American on the trail who said she was so happy I was there because Americans usually just write off her country.

There also are colonial towns, volcanic lakes (an informally organized boat ride on Coatapeque was really enjoyable), and museums to explore, as I said, and I would hope OP would do all of that if she goes. So there’s much more on offer than just the beach, although there are fine beaches to round out a trip.

And I do agree with the comment above that the reality for ordinary Salvadorans is far different than the visitor experience. I had numerous taxi drivers explain to me how the gangs force them yo pay “renta” (which happens in other countries too, by the way). But that’s a problem and reality for the locals that no tourist is going to face. Honestly, the gangs make plenty of money exploiting the locals, and would rather avoid the heat that kidnapping a US tourist would bring.

Yea, that happened to us every day while we were there -- except it was local Salvadorans who we spoke with, not "American Salvadorans" on vacation, and it was in Spanish, not English, and we didn't travel with drivers and guides.

Which one of us is pampered again?

You are really reaching now! Why do you think my conversation with the Salvadoran American wasn’t in Spanish. As my Salvadoran hiking guide was with me (an elderly-ish man from the village) who didn’t speak any English, of course we were conversing in Spanish!

Sorry, but you're not going to be able to out "authentic" me. When it comes to international travel and living, especially in Latin America, I can one up you every time!

LOLOL I am the PP who just wrote the long post about Authentic Travel Olympics and this is PERFECT. Chef's Kiss! Anyway, who are you kidding with your Spanish, lol, let's see you speak some Kiché or some Mam. Then we can talk! Gauntlet THROWN.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am fascinated by this thread. It is reminding me of my early 20s in DC when I'd bump into the global non-profit / Peace Corps crowd who just LOVED to humblebrag (although we hadn't invented that term then) about their travels, each competing with the other to tell stories of the "real" "authentic" travel they had done. Usually they were wearing some kind of Guatemalan textile while they did it. Dreads optional; makeup not allowed ever.

Anyway, these folks especially loved to point to tourist spots and say "that's not the REAL Mexico/South Africa/India." Woe betide you if you had gone somewhere touristy, even by accident! And then there were gradations of judgment in case you had been to the country they knew the most about. Did you stay in hostels? Ohhh, well THEY had lived with a family / camped in the jungle / squatted in an abandoned building / whatever. Do you speak Spanish? Ohhh, well THEY had gone and married a native speaker and now use all the street slang and innuendo that you will never master. You think you actually KNOW Guatemala! Ha! Not until you've spent a year living in the countryside with no running water can you even PRETEND you know ANYTHING about Guatemala! They, and only they, could be authorities on the country they'd been to.

Oddly, their advice often differed greatly from that of people from the actual country, who (gasp!) sometimes enjoy visiting their own tourist spots themselves, and (double gasp!) would sometimes complain about crime, politics, trash, and other problems.

And FYI I did some pretty adventurous travel myself back then, including riding many second class "chicken" buses in Latin America, but quickly realized that there was no competing with these people in the Authentic Travel Olympics (tm). And it's definitely not good to ask them for travel advice because they will sneer at anyone else who does not meet their exacting standards for Who is the Right Kind of Traveler.

Also, as someone who has worked with asylum-seekers, I find the comments about them upthread to be absolutely abhorrent. First of all, there is no neat divide between "economic migrants" and "refugees." Second, a lot of them are actually reluctant to even share the full details of the horrors they have escaped from. It's much more common for someone to say "I came to the US for a better life" and only later to reveal the fact that they were threatened, raped, had family members killed by gangs, etc. And the lawyers who advocate for these people are required to provide evidence of these threats in immigration court. So yeah, someone who claims to "know" these countries better than anyone else and then who also sneers at anyone who would consider going there for being the "wrong" kind of traveler is just really...special.

Hi. I'm the poster who started all of this by dissuading the OP from choosing El Salvador over Costa Rica or Puerto Rico over spring break. I actually agree with you one hundred percent on literally everything that you just said. One Hundred Percent.

I'm just having some fun with the Holier Than Though Marriott Gold Poster who had a nice trip to El Salvador, spoke a little Spanish, and on that basis has concluded that anyone who points out that a first-time visitor should know that, compared to Costa Rica and Puerto Rico, El Salvador is (a) poorer, (b) has an less developed tourism infrastructure and (c) has a major litter and environmental problem is a pampered Ugly American who can only be happy in Punta Cana. The self-righteousness is stunning, and having some time on my hands I just had to mess with her.

I'll try my best to stop it now.

[Anonymous]

OP, this is the last place you should ask for advice. Unless it is Europe, a US National Park, or Disney, go to a proper travel forum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, this is the last place you should ask for advice. Unless it is Europe, a US National Park, or Disney, go to a proper travel forum.

+1. Everything on DCUM turns into a pissing match.