One Fairfax and Thoreau

[Anonymous]

Is FCPS looking at any new boundary adjustments in light of the One Fairfax initiative? Have they done any studies on the FARMS rate change at Jackson if they go through with this boundary adjustment?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is FCPS looking at any new boundary adjustments in light of the One Fairfax initiative? Have they done any studies on the FARMS rate change at Jackson if they go through with this boundary adjustment?

Moving Oakton and Mosby Woods to Thoreau, if done, would demonstrate One Fairfax is a complete farce and just a feel-good measure pushed by Democrats who talk out of both sides of their mouths.

An equity focus would move part of Jackson to Poe and keep Oakton and Mosby Woods at Jackson.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is FCPS looking at any new boundary adjustments in light of the One Fairfax initiative? Have they done any studies on the FARMS rate change at Jackson if they go through with this boundary adjustment?

Have you seen the rates at Poe (75%), Glasgow (64%), and Key (60%)? As far as Jackson (43%) is concerned, I'm sure FCPS thinks that is just fine. I wouldn't count on One Fairfax actually having any real impact. It is something they passed to make themselves feel good.

[Anonymous]

FWIW, both Mosby Woods and Marshall Road (a subset of which goes to Jackson now) have FARMs rates of about 25%.

That is probably artificially low b/c Mosby Woods' AAP section (which feeds to about 5 different MSs -- not just Jackson) likely has less than 25% farms --- meaning the gen. ed part (which is the part feeding into Jackson now) would be higher than 25% FARMS. Those schools will be "contributing" to added diversity at Thoreau. Taking those kids out of Jackson isn't the same as taking 100% economically wealthy/not poor out of Jackson. There are Farms/ESOL kids who would be shifted from Jackson to Thoreau.

As for the suggestion (PP above) that Jackson's lower performing students should be shifted to Poe -- that wouldn't do anything to put kids INTO Thoreau -- which has the additional capacity (brand new capacity).

I think One Fairfax is a farce too... but if you want to use it as a weapon in this zoning decision, then we might as well rezone all of FCPS to equalize economic and racial stats. I think One Fairfax is meant to be a general consideration, not THE deciding factor. I knew it would be used as a weapon when it passed. If you want to make it THE deciding factor, then rezone ALL schools across the county and start bussing kids to equalize all educational experiences... some will go up in status, some will go down... that is the point of equalization.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, both Mosby Woods and Marshall Road (a subset of which goes to Jackson now) have FARMs rates of about 25%.

That is probably artificially low b/c Mosby Woods' AAP section (which feeds to about 5 different MSs -- not just Jackson) likely has less than 25% farms --- meaning the gen. ed part (which is the part feeding into Jackson now) would be higher than 25% FARMS. Those schools will be "contributing" to added diversity at Thoreau. Taking those kids out of Jackson isn't the same as taking 100% economically wealthy/not poor out of Jackson. There are Farms/ESOL kids who would be shifted from Jackson to Thoreau.

As for the suggestion (PP above) that Jackson's lower performing students should be shifted to Poe -- that wouldn't do anything to put kids INTO Thoreau -- which has the additional capacity (brand new capacity).

I think One Fairfax is a farce too... but if you want to use it as a weapon in this zoning decision, then we might as well rezone all of FCPS to equalize economic and racial stats. I think One Fairfax is meant to be a general consideration, not THE deciding factor. I knew it would be used as a weapon when it passed. If you want to make it THE deciding factor, then rezone ALL schools across the county and start bussing kids to equalize all educational experiences... some will go up in status, some will go down... that is the point of equalization.

With or without the AAP students at Mosby Woods, Oakton, Mosby Woods and the part of Marshall Road zoned for Jackson is wealthier than the rest of Jackson. Taking it out of Jackson will drive up the ESOL/FARMS rates there.

Conversely, moving some other parts of Jackson to Poe would reduce the ESOL/FARMS rates at Poe, which now has the highest poverty rate of any middle school in the county.

FCPS can increase enrollment at Thoreau by making Thoreau an AAP center (similar to what it did at Cooper) and stop allowing Thoreau AAP students to transfer to Jackson and Kilmer. If appropriate, part of Kilmer can be moved to Thoreau as well.

If the wealthier families want to move to Thoreau because it's a wealthier school, they can lobby for that, but it's obviously inconsistent with both One Fairfax, and FCPS's stated decision to eliminate split feeders (since it would turn Thoreau into a three-way split feeder to Oakton, Madison and Marshall).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, both Mosby Woods and Marshall Road (a subset of which goes to Jackson now) have FARMs rates of about 25%.

That is probably artificially low b/c Mosby Woods' AAP section (which feeds to about 5 different MSs -- not just Jackson) likely has less than 25% farms --- meaning the gen. ed part (which is the part feeding into Jackson now) would be higher than 25% FARMS. Those schools will be "contributing" to added diversity at Thoreau. Taking those kids out of Jackson isn't the same as taking 100% economically wealthy/not poor out of Jackson. There are Farms/ESOL kids who would be shifted from Jackson to Thoreau.

As for the suggestion (PP above) that Jackson's lower performing students should be shifted to Poe -- that wouldn't do anything to put kids INTO Thoreau -- which has the additional capacity (brand new capacity).

I think One Fairfax is a farce too... but if you want to use it as a weapon in this zoning decision, then we might as well rezone all of FCPS to equalize economic and racial stats. I think One Fairfax is meant to be a general consideration, not THE deciding factor. I knew it would be used as a weapon when it passed. If you want to make it THE deciding factor, then rezone ALL schools across the county and start bussing kids to equalize all educational experiences... some will go up in status, some will go down... that is the point of equalization.

With or without the AAP students at Mosby Woods, Oakton, Mosby Woods and the part of Marshall Road zoned for Jackson is wealthier than the rest of Jackson. Taking it out of Jackson will drive up the ESOL/FARMS rates there.

Conversely, moving some other parts of Jackson to Poe would reduce the ESOL/FARMS rates at Poe, which now has the highest poverty rate of any middle school in the county.

FCPS can increase enrollment at Thoreau by making Thoreau an AAP center (similar to what it did at Cooper) and stop allowing Thoreau AAP students to transfer to Jackson and Kilmer. If appropriate, part of Kilmer can be moved to Thoreau as well.

If the wealthier families want to move to Thoreau because it's a wealthier school, they can lobby for that, but it's obviously inconsistent with both One Fairfax, and FCPS's stated decision to eliminate split feeders (since it would turn Thoreau into a three-way split feeder to Oakton, Madison and Marshall).

Re: bolded part... why/how would one "lobby to move to Thoreau b/c it's a wealthier school"??? Doesn't make sense.

Making Thoreau an AAP center would not increase enrollment enough, and it would actually hurt Jackson b/c the AAP kids who leave Thoreau (about 50 per grade) are INCREASING the non-farms at Jackson and INCREASING the SOL pass rates. Jackson is happy to take those kids (at least the administrators are. I wouldn't be so happy about it if my kids were attending Jackson and it was being made more crowded by in-transferring AAP kids). There is no plan to do this... although it would be fine by me if they did. It isn't happening before the rezoning or in the near future. You might as well let that argument go. It's not happening.

As for split feeders. We currently have two split feeders involved in this discussion -- both Thoreau and Jackson. If the rezoning occurs as I expect, then we will have one school that is a split feeder (Thoreau) and one school that is NOT a split feeder (Jackson). That is actually a REDUCTION in split feeders 2--->1. Logic fail on that argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, both Mosby Woods and Marshall Road (a subset of which goes to Jackson now) have FARMs rates of about 25%.

That is probably artificially low b/c Mosby Woods' AAP section (which feeds to about 5 different MSs -- not just Jackson) likely has less than 25% farms --- meaning the gen. ed part (which is the part feeding into Jackson now) would be higher than 25% FARMS. Those schools will be "contributing" to added diversity at Thoreau. Taking those kids out of Jackson isn't the same as taking 100% economically wealthy/not poor out of Jackson. There are Farms/ESOL kids who would be shifted from Jackson to Thoreau.

As for the suggestion (PP above) that Jackson's lower performing students should be shifted to Poe -- that wouldn't do anything to put kids INTO Thoreau -- which has the additional capacity (brand new capacity).

I think One Fairfax is a farce too... but if you want to use it as a weapon in this zoning decision, then we might as well rezone all of FCPS to equalize economic and racial stats. I think One Fairfax is meant to be a general consideration, not THE deciding factor. I knew it would be used as a weapon when it passed. If you want to make it THE deciding factor, then rezone ALL schools across the county and start bussing kids to equalize all educational experiences... some will go up in status, some will go down... that is the point of equalization.

With or without the AAP students at Mosby Woods, Oakton, Mosby Woods and the part of Marshall Road zoned for Jackson is wealthier than the rest of Jackson. Taking it out of Jackson will drive up the ESOL/FARMS rates there.

Conversely, moving some other parts of Jackson to Poe would reduce the ESOL/FARMS rates at Poe, which now has the highest poverty rate of any middle school in the county.

FCPS can increase enrollment at Thoreau by making Thoreau an AAP center (similar to what it did at Cooper) and stop allowing Thoreau AAP students to transfer to Jackson and Kilmer. If appropriate, part of Kilmer can be moved to Thoreau as well.

If the wealthier families want to move to Thoreau because it's a wealthier school, they can lobby for that, but it's obviously inconsistent with both One Fairfax, and FCPS's stated decision to eliminate split feeders (since it would turn Thoreau into a three-way split feeder to Oakton, Madison and Marshall).

Re: bolded part... why/how would one "lobby to move to Thoreau b/c it's a wealthier school"??? Doesn't make sense.

Making Thoreau an AAP center would not increase enrollment enough, and it would actually hurt Jackson b/c the AAP kids who leave Thoreau (about 50 per grade) are INCREASING the non-farms at Jackson and INCREASING the SOL pass rates. Jackson is happy to take those kids (at least the administrators are. I wouldn't be so happy about it if my kids were attending Jackson and it was being made more crowded by in-transferring AAP kids). There is no plan to do this... although it would be fine by me if they did. It isn't happening before the rezoning or in the near future. You might as well let that argument go. It's not happening.

As for split feeders. We currently have two split feeders involved in this discussion -- both Thoreau and Jackson. If the rezoning occurs as I expect, then we will have one school that is a split feeder (Thoreau) and one school that is NOT a split feeder (Jackson). That is actually a REDUCTION in split feeders 2--->1. Logic fail on that argument.

It's obvious that some of the people zoned for Jackson are lobbying to move to Thoreau because they think Jackson is beneath them.

Making Thoreau an AAP center and moving part of Kilmer to Thoreau would increase enrollment at Thoreau. Keeping Thoreau AAP kids at Thoreau rather than Jackson would increase ESOL/FARMS at Jackson, but not as much as moving the relevant Oakton, Mosby Woods and Marshall Roads neighborhoods to Thoreau. Keep in mind that many AAP-eligible students at Thoreau already stay there.

As for split feeders, it's better to have two split feeders that split into two schools than make a school that already splits into two high schools a three-way split feeder.

You want to benefit Thoreau at Jackson's expense, and that will hurt both Jackson and then Falls Church HS as well. Just look at the impact on Annandale HS after FCPS moved so many single-family areas out of Poe MS. Poe ended up the poorest middle school in the county, and the flight of higher SES families out of the Annandale pyramid has intensified.

The School Board needs to reconsider its options with respect to Jackson and Thoreau, at least not if it meant a single word when it adopted One Fairfax.

[Anonymous]

No. I don't want to benefit Thoreau at Jackson's expense. I don't care what SES comes to TMS, and I think it's reprehensible that LJmS has been left overcrowded for these two years. I just see logical flaws in your arguments. I don't think the school board needs to twist zoning into knots to satisfy social engineering as the main reason for decisions. You want social engineering first and foremost. I disagree with your criteria. And, fwiw, your plan isn't happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't want to benefit Thoreau at Jackson's expense. I don't care what SES comes to TMS, and I think it's reprehensible that LJmS has been left overcrowded for these two years. I just see logical flaws in your arguments. I don't think the school board needs to twist zoning into knots to satisfy social engineering as the main reason for decisions. You want social engineering first and foremost. I disagree with your criteria. And, fwiw, your plan isn't happening.

Sure you do and your logic is no more convincing. The only issue is whether the School Board acts to keep another pyramid from declining because it was expedient to please some wealthier people. If they don't scrap the Jackson-to-Thoreau plan, they are a bunch of hypocrites and One Fairfax means nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anyone knows the options of the boundary changes? Without options on the table, you can’t debate if option 1 is more One Fairfax oriented than option 2 or something.

[Anonymous]

Interesting.

SB always plays winners and losers on this.

South Lakes redistricting was a great example. SL PTSA was the winner. They picked their new neighborhoods and the SB let them.

NO matter that some neighborhoods had repeatedly been moved. No matter who lived closest. No matter that they created more split feeders.

[Anonymous]

That is what is so frustrating about the Thoreau boundary discussion. There seems to be no analysis of Jackson or Falls Church and no meetings scheduled in these neighborhoods either. It's as if only the people who might move to Thoreau matter and many of the would still have the benefit of Jackson as an AAP center or a better general ed middle school. I don't need to interview any of those families. Very few would argue about the change except perhaps the general ed kids going to Oakton. It's the people left at Jackson and Falls Church who likely will be hurt the most.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting.

SB always plays winners and losers on this.

South Lakes redistricting was a great example. SL PTSA was the winner. They picked their new neighborhoods and the SB let them.

NO matter that some neighborhoods had repeatedly been moved. No matter who lived closest. No matter that they created more split feeders.

Same thing happened at Haycock about 5 years ago. The PTA orchestrated having about 90 kids from less desirable neighborhoods reassigned out of their AAP center with zero warning. The principal served as their sock puppet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That is what is so frustrating about the Thoreau boundary discussion. There seems to be no analysis of Jackson or Falls Church and no meetings scheduled in these neighborhoods either. It's as if only the people who might move to Thoreau matter and many of the would still have the benefit of Jackson as an AAP center or a better general ed middle school. I don't need to interview any of those families. Very few would argue about the change except perhaps the general ed kids going to Oakton. It's the people left at Jackson and Falls Church who likely will be hurt the most.

Those meetings were scheduled and took place before the One Fairfax resolution was adopted. They now clearly need to take another look at their options in light of the One Fairfax principles. As you suggest, it's inconsistent with those principles to exclude the other Jackson and Falls Church families from the discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. I don't want to benefit Thoreau at Jackson's expense. I don't care what SES comes to TMS, and I think it's reprehensible that LJmS has been left overcrowded for these two years. I just see logical flaws in your arguments. I don't think the school board needs to twist zoning into knots to satisfy social engineering as the main reason for decisions. You want social engineering first and foremost. I disagree with your criteria. And, fwiw, your plan isn't happening.

Sure you do and your logic is no more convincing. The only issue is whether the School Board acts to keep another pyramid from declining because it was expedient to please some wealthier people. If they don't scrap the Jackson-to-Thoreau plan, they are a bunch of hypocrites and One Fairfax means nothing.

If Thoreau has space and Jackson does not it makes sense to move students to Thoreau. One Fairfax or not One Fairfax is irrelevant since you have blocks of students who can attend school at an undercapacity site. Do what is most cost effective unless of course you care to pay for it.

Proximity to schools is the important criteria so residing west of Jackson-off to Thoreau. Removing the fed ded for local taxes makes one more keenly aware of where their money is going.