Gifted testing for dyslexic child?

[Anonymous]

I previously posted about my daughter who was exhibiting signs of dyslexia asking iif I should have her tested. I got some great feedback and we decided to have her get a private reading eval. We didn't do a full work up because of the expense and what appears to be issues in just a few areas. Based on the testing she had they said her scores were consistent with a diagnosis of dyslexia. As a result we have now moved to start her with private tutoring because shE doesn't qualify for an IEP. When the tutor, who specializes in dyslexia reviewed her test scores she asked if I had given the score to her school to also get her into the TAG program because her listening comprehension was in the 92 percentile. I explained that I had but when the school gave her a logic test she only scored in the 37 percentile so she was rejected from the program. The tutor felt so that we should take our daughter to a private center who works with twice exceptional kids because the test the school gave her wasn't necessarily accurate and she felt her score on the private test was unlikely to be a "false positive".

Of course the private testing is going to be expensive and I'm wondering if it is really important to do. I'm struggling with how useful it really would be for her to be identified as gifted and how that might help her. I also mentioned to the tutor that the school has started to indicate that they think she might have ADHD, which has never been indicated before and honestly doesn't really ring true to me or my husband. At that point the tutor pulled out a sheet of paper that compared signs of gifted to signs of ADHD and said often kids who are gifted are misidentified as having ADHD. In my gut, I have no idea if our daughter is gifted or not. The tutor asked about family history and I mentioned that our son, her little brother (1st grader) was put into TAG based on his math skills (and my husband's cousin-in-law who is a math teacher also said he felt our son was gifted in math before he entered Kindergarten) but that he hadn't had any formal testing other than that logic test. My brother has a very high IQ (our parents never told him the score but it was definitely on the outlier high side). I'm average and my husband is as well. Anyway- long story short the tutor felt that the real issue is that our daughter is likely twice exceptional but the school isn't seeing it.

Does it really make a difference to be identified as gifted? If we don't test her and she is gifted will that create problems for her later on (she's in 3rd grade right now)? FWIW the tutor doesn't do the testing- she gave me names of 3 places to go. Does it make sense to do a more comprehensive work up to also have her tested for ADHD, which I have read is also frequently found in dyslexic kids? I feel like this testing thing can be a slippery slope but I also don't want to fail my child in advocating for her.

Sorry for the long post - but I'd appreciate thoughts from BTDT parents.

[Anonymous]

Kids with one neurological issue often have another (dyslexia, ADHD, anxiety, dysgraphia, etc). And yes, they can be gifted too.

I would do the full testing if you can afford it, in order to get an accurate picture of your child's strengths and challenges. Less about a different school placement.

[Anonymous]

OP - it also quite possible your child is gifted, has ADHD and is dyslexic. IMO it would be most important to figure out the ADHD. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

I'm of the opinion that more information can't hurt. My son (ADHD) had an IQ test- it provided a lot of useful data on strengths and challenges. I understand my DS better and why some things come easily and others are a struggle.

[Anonymous]

Ask the public school to test.

[Anonymous]

My dyslexic kid has an IQ of about 120, so a smart kid. But the subtests tell the story - the kid is either in the 95th percentile for a skill or the 5th percentile, nothing in between. He has needed and continues to need remediation to keep him near grade level because there always seems to be something that trips him up. It used to be simply reading, but now he's a pretty good reader but his working memory deficit (goes along with dyslexia) is causing problems in math. Even though he is 2E, he could never function in a gifted program. What we do is make sure he has every opportunity to shine in things he loves - science fair, cardboard challenge, chess, art. So yes, I'd get a full nueropsych - the full testing helped us help our dyslexic kid.

[Anonymous]

I think it makes sense for everyone (parents, teachers, child) to have a solid understanding of strengths and deficits. Certainly, the better the understanding the better you can work with your cold. That said, I think it is very challenging to get it just right with 2E kids... You are stock going t get some teachers/therapists who focus on the one E and others who primarily see another E. This approach may be better than dealing with your child as simply needing remedial help but it not only may be very frustrating, it may lead to other problems. My child has adhd, dyslexia, dysgraphia, and high iq. He needs a ton of support in every aspect of writing. But He is very advanced in math, and even more advanced in reading. He is passionate about history and science but he cannot take notes, make an outline, write an essay, etc, without support. It's very frustrating and hard to know where to place him "appropriately."

[Anonymous]

I think that most kids with suspected learning disabilities should get comprehensive testing at some point, which will include looking for learning disabilities, ADHD, and an overall IQ score. I'm not sure what kind of testing a "private reading eval" includes, but if it wasn't done by a psychologist, and didn't include an IQ test, then it can't generate a dyslexia diagnosis or ignore other diagnoses. It also won't serve as a baseline for evaluating change. I wonder if it was given by someone who stands to benefit financially from the testing results, such as a reading "center" that offers tutoring, in which case it's validity may be called into question down the road. For all those reasons, it's probably worth it to get comprehensive testing, if you can afford it. The school may provide it if her performance at school indicates possible eligibility under IDEA, but it sounds as though you may have already looked into that, and they may have decided that testing isn't warranted. If so, it may be worth getting it done now. Waiting to get it done until she's had a lot of intervention can mask any learning disabilities, making it harder to down the road to get accommodations.

Finally, 92nd percentile is pretty far from the gifted range. The way that standardized testing is distributed, scores become increasingly rare as they get higher, and a 98th %ile (a score that indicates giftedness) is more than half a standard deviation away from a 92, which is a significant difference. In addition, listening comprehension is a skill that's very responsive to things like home language, and quality of experiences. If she's coming from a highly literate English dominant home, and had high quality early childhood education experiences, a 92nd percentile in listening comprehension isn't going to be uncommon for a child whose other scores are closer to average. I'm not saying that is or isn't the case for your daughter, just saying that a 92 in listening comprehension isn't a sign of giftedness, although it is definitely possible for a child to be gifted, or gifted in some areas, with a relative weakness in listening comprehension.

[Anonymous]

Part of the testing for dyslexia involves IQ testing too. So, it would part of the dyslexia testing. My DC has dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADHD- rather profound on all three based on the testing- he also hits the ceiling of the WISC on the subtests relating to critical thinking, math, background knowledge and vocabulary- is close to the floor on other subtests. It takes a skilled tester to tease it out and know what follow on tests to do. He is counted as 2E in the FCPS stats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Part of the testing for dyslexia involves IQ testing too. So, it would part of the dyslexia testing. My DC has dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADHD- rather profound on all three based on the testing- he also hits the ceiling of the WISC on the subtests relating to critical thinking, math, background knowledge and vocabulary- is close to the floor on other subtests. It takes a skilled tester to tease it out and know what follow on tests to do. He is counted as 2E in the FCPS stats.

Not the OP, but if I may, a Q for the above poster (20:17) -- did you find a neuropsychologist who you felt was particularly good at this? Our DS is GTLD w/ diagnosed dyslexia and dysgraphia per a WPPSI and subsets of academic testing (99% FSIQ; 5% on various pre-academic measures). They suspected ADHD, but told us to wait until age 6 for a full neuropsych and ADHD evaluation. He is now 6 and we are preparing to schedule full testing. Would appreciate your (or any) recommendations for testers who are good at teasing out these issues in kids with this profile. TIA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Part of the testing for dyslexia involves IQ testing too. So, it would part of the dyslexia testing. My DC has dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADHD- rather profound on all three based on the testing- he also hits the ceiling of the WISC on the subtests relating to critical thinking, math, background knowledge and vocabulary- is close to the floor on other subtests. It takes a skilled tester to tease it out and know what follow on tests to do. He is counted as 2E in the FCPS stats.

Not the OP, but if I may, a Q for the above poster (20:17) -- did you find a neuropsychologist who you felt was particularly good at this? Our DS is GTLD w/ diagnosed dyslexia and dysgraphia per a WPPSI and subsets of academic testing (99% FSIQ; 5% on various pre-academic measures). They suspected ADHD, but told us to wait until age 6 for a full neuropsych and ADHD evaluation. He is now 6 and we are preparing to schedule full testing. Would appreciate your (or any) recommendations for testers who are good at teasing out these issues in kids with this profile. TIA.

Not 20:17, but I really like the work of Daisy Pascualvaca at Pascualvaca and Associates.

I also think that neuropsych results are more stable at 7, so I'd wait one more year.

[Anonymous]

OP - Will KKI take your insurance? Seems like it would make sense to get a full neuropsych eval, and that it probably the most cost effective option.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP - Will KKI take your insurance? Seems like it would make sense to get a full neuropsych eval, and that it probably the most cost effective option.

KKI does great work with super complex kids, but run of the mill ADHD is not their specialty. The neuropsych's I've seen from there have not been well done.

[Anonymous]

A 92%ile in reading comprehension is not gifted. What was her IQ score?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I previously posted about my daughter who was exhibiting signs of dyslexia asking iif I should have her tested. I got some great feedback and we decided to have her get a private reading eval. We didn't do a full work up because of the expense and what appears to be issues in just a few areas. Based on the testing she had they said her scores were consistent with a diagnosis of dyslexia. As a result we have now moved to start her with private tutoring because shE doesn't qualify for an IEP. When the tutor, who specializes in dyslexia reviewed her test scores she asked if I had given the score to her school to also get her into the TAG program because her listening comprehension was in the 92 percentile. I explained that I had but when the school gave her a logic test she only scored in the 37 percentile so she was rejected from the program. The tutor felt so that we should take our daughter to a private center who works with twice exceptional kids because the test the school gave her wasn't necessarily accurate and she felt her score on the private test was unlikely to be a "false positive".

Of course the private testing is going to be expensive and I'm wondering if it is really important to do. I'm struggling with how useful it really would be for her to be identified as gifted and how that might help her. I also mentioned to the tutor that the school has started to indicate that they think she might have ADHD, which has never been indicated before and honestly doesn't really ring true to me or my husband. At that point the tutor pulled out a sheet of paper that compared signs of gifted to signs of ADHD and said often kids who are gifted are misidentified as having ADHD. In my gut, I have no idea if our daughter is gifted or not. The tutor asked about family history and I mentioned that our son, her little brother (1st grader) was put into TAG based on his math skills (and my husband's cousin-in-law who is a math teacher also said he felt our son was gifted in math before he entered Kindergarten) but that he hadn't had any formal testing other than that logic test. My brother has a very high IQ (our parents never told him the score but it was definitely on the outlier high side). I'm average and my husband is as well. Anyway- long story short the tutor felt that the real issue is that our daughter is likely twice exceptional but the school isn't seeing it.

Does it really make a difference to be identified as gifted? If we don't test her and she is gifted will that create problems for her later on (she's in 3rd grade right now)? FWIW the tutor doesn't do the testing- she gave me names of 3 places to go. Does it make sense to do a more comprehensive work up to also have her tested for ADHD, which I have read is also frequently found in dyslexic kids? I feel like this testing thing can be a slippery slope but I also don't want to fail my child in advocating for her.

Sorry for the long post - but I'd appreciate thoughts from BTDT parents.

What private center? Depending on the names you were given, we can give you more feedback. Your DD may or may not be gifted, but if she's struggling in more than one area, a comprehensive evaluation is a good idea. The most important thing is to have it done with a reputable evaluator.