No more safeties since they now focus on yield protection?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This has all gotten out of control. The class of 2022 should boycott this process and go to community college for a year. Force these schools to stop gaming the system and making these kids jump through a thousand hoops.

Something is going to have to give.

My son is only a junior this year but there are a few seniors in his friend group who had terrible outcomes this year. They're all kids with excellent grades, scores, and extracurriculars.

I know one who has much better stats than my older kid who is a senior at UVA. It's crazy to think that in 3.5 years it has changed so much that my kid probably wouldn't make it in if she applied today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is good.
Students need to stop applying to 20+ schools. It’s a waste of everyone’s time and energy. Find a couple true safeties you actually would be happy at, visit them, and apply to them. Stop tossing out random apps to see who bites.

(Note, if the acceptance rate is less than 75%, it’s not a safety, no matter what your stats are)

How many colleges have a greater than 75% acceptance rate?

None you would want to attend with a 1400+ SAT.

THIS. It’s true that the answer to yield protection is not about applying to 20 schools. Equally though is not about applying to schools which are not a peer group fit for the child just because s/he has a near 100 percent chance of getting in.

Oh, please. Your kid isn’t that special. There are plenty of your child’s “peer group” at every large state university, many of which have very high admissions rates. Kids with high stats go to these colleges for many reasons — Mom and Dad are alums, it’s close to home — and most importantly — it’s cheap. Many go there because these schools have very generous merit aid for high stats kids. They almost all have “honors colleges” if you just can’t bear the thought of your precious snowflake associating with the riff riff.

And if a kid isn’t smart enough to figure out that applying to 10 schools with 5% acceptance rates does not give him/her a 50% chance of getting accepted, then they aren’t really that bright.

You miss my point. Every kid IS special. State u is the answer for some kids, for others it’s another of the 3000 colleges in the US. My point is they need to find the right one(s) for them.

No your point was that your kid was too smart to fit into State U. And PP correctly said get over yourself. My kid (who is not academically gifted) is at a lower ranked state school thriving in all ways. But she has plenty of friends there from all over the country that are brilliant. Some already doing scientific research. Another with perfect SATs and 36 AP credits from (gasp) Louisiana. There is no university where your kid cannot find his/her academic peer group. Some just have more non focused students than others.

Your kidding right. EVERY university has large groups of that caliber of kid? Really? Your kidding yourself. My kid is in and done at her top choice, and I didn’t post specifically about her. But it IS about high stats focused kids and what they are looking for in a college. I’m sorry your kid ain’t one of them. But a high achieving focused child aiming for HYP ain’t ever gonna find a satisfactory group of peers at Monmouth University. Your N of a few proves absolutely nothing and your assertion is delusional.

Who’s delusional?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rise in international undergrads wanting to attend in the U.S. is also fueling these admissions games.

20 years ago, this cohort was very small and very rich. But now? Huge numbers, especially as the upper middle class grows in places like China and India.

Actually, the new destination of students from China and India - Canada, Australia, New Zealand and for some strange reason - Germany

USA is seen as an unstable, lawless and racist country by most of the world now. The reputation is in the gutter after Trump, insurrection and all the mass shootings.

USA response to COVID was a joke. A poorly governed and triggered nation.

I don’t disagree, but the US vaccine response has been much better than many other countries. Ahem, looking at you Germany. I think college will be largely back to normal in the fall.

Totally agree with the other things you said.

The “Europe is handling covid soooo much better than the US” thing has not aged well. And not just with re: to vaccines. International students may be coming here just to vaccinated and get out of lockdown, if nothing else.

[Anonymous]

I'll tell you what's insane: the parents. You all. Insisting that colleges are out to get your students and screw them over. It just isn't true. If your kids aren't getting into their safeties it isn't because the safeties are protecting yield and rejecting your over-qualified student. It's because you're picking the wrong school as a safety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is good.
Students need to stop applying to 20+ schools. It’s a waste of everyone’s time and energy. Find a couple true safeties you actually would be happy at, visit them, and apply to them. Stop tossing out random apps to see who bites.

(Note, if the acceptance rate is less than 75%, it’s not a safety, no matter what your stats are)

How many colleges have a greater than 75% acceptance rate?

The majority of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'll tell you what's insane: the parents. You all. Insisting that colleges are out to get your students and screw them over. It just isn't true. If your kids aren't getting into their safeties it isn't because the safeties are protecting yield and rejecting your over-qualified student. It's because you're picking the wrong school as a safety.

No, the schools that were safeties have changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is good.
Students need to stop applying to 20+ schools. It’s a waste of everyone’s time and energy. Find a couple true safeties you actually would be happy at, visit them, and apply to them. Stop tossing out random apps to see who bites.

(Note, if the acceptance rate is less than 75%, it’s not a safety, no matter what your stats are)

How many colleges have a greater than 75% acceptance rate?

Congratulations, you win the award for most tone deaf question of the year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is good.
Students need to stop applying to 20+ schools. It’s a waste of everyone’s time and energy. Find a couple true safeties you actually would be happy at, visit them, and apply to them. Stop tossing out random apps to see who bites.

(Note, if the acceptance rate is less than 75%, it’s not a safety, no matter what your stats are)

How many colleges have a greater than 75% acceptance rate?

None you would want to attend with a 1400+ SAT.

THIS. It’s true that the answer to yield protection is not about applying to 20 schools. Equally though is not about applying to schools which are not a peer group fit for the child just because s/he has a near 100 percent chance of getting in.

Oh, please. Your kid isn’t that special. There are plenty of your child’s “peer group” at every large state university, many of which have very high admissions rates. Kids with high stats go to these colleges for many reasons — Mom and Dad are alums, it’s close to home — and most importantly — it’s cheap. Many go there because these schools have very generous merit aid for high stats kids. They almost all have “honors colleges” if you just can’t bear the thought of your precious snowflake associating with the riff riff.

And if a kid isn’t smart enough to figure out that applying to 10 schools with 5% acceptance rates does not give him/her a 50% chance of getting accepted, then they aren’t really that bright.

You miss my point. Every kid IS special. State u is the answer for some kids, for others it’s another of the 3000 colleges in the US. My point is they need to find the right one(s) for them.

No your point was that your kid was too smart to fit into State U. And PP correctly said get over yourself. My kid (who is not academically gifted) is at a lower ranked state school thriving in all ways. But she has plenty of friends there from all over the country that are brilliant. Some already doing scientific research. Another with perfect SATs and 36 AP credits from (gasp) Louisiana. There is no university where your kid cannot find his/her academic peer group. Some just have more non focused students than others.

Your kidding right. EVERY university has large groups of that caliber of kid? Really? Your kidding yourself. My kid is in and done at her top choice, and I didn’t post specifically about her. But it IS about high stats focused kids and what they are looking for in a college. I’m sorry your kid ain’t one of them. But a high achieving focused child aiming for HYP ain’t ever gonna find a satisfactory group of peers at Monmouth University. Your N of a few proves absolutely nothing and your assertion is delusional.

Who’s delusional?

Way to come back PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Turning this into a waitlist game of chicken will at sone point backfire on these schools.

This - 100%!

Something has to give. When you have top students (yes, top grades, SAT, extracurriculars, research, internships, etc.) get shut out of all matches and reaches and sit on 5-7 waitlists, it is going to backfire on these schools.

The reality is that all of us have - to some degree - bought into the racket that is the college process. We've encouraged our kids to work their asses off for years, do all the right things, be leaders, excellent in sports, in the classroom and in their communities (all great things by the way). We've encouraged ourselves to save ridiculous amounts of money to fund their educations. The expectation was clear: do these things and you will have qualified for admission to an elite institution (and you'll have the opportunity to pay 80k/year for the experience). This year, that expectation was blown up.

If the schools want to upend that process and set new expectations, fine, but they should be prepared for it to backfire. Maybe upper middle class families who have saved for decades to pay for the dream of elite schools decide it isn't worth 80k /year to be jerked around like this. Maybe more will decide that the state school is just fine for undergrad.(It's one thing to pay the 80k for a top school, quite another for a safety.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This has all gotten out of control. The class of 2022 should boycott this process and go to community college for a year. Force these schools to stop gaming the system and making these kids jump through a thousand hoops.

Something is going to have to give.

My son is only a junior this year but there are a few seniors in his friend group who had terrible outcomes this year. They're all kids with excellent grades, scores, and extracurriculars.

I know one who has much better stats than my older kid who is a senior at UVA. It's crazy to think that in 3.5 years it has changed so much that my kid probably wouldn't make it in if she applied today.

What needs to give is the perception than only a small handful of schools are "good". Or that going to a school that isn't on the top 10 list is a "terrible" outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Turning this into a waitlist game of chicken will at sone point backfire on these schools.

This - 100%!

Something has to give. When you have top students (yes, top grades, SAT, extracurriculars, research, internships, etc.) get shut out of all matches and reaches and sit on 5-7 waitlists, it is going to backfire on these schools.

The reality is that all of us have - to some degree - bought into the racket that is the college process. We've encouraged our kids to work their asses off for years, do all the right things, be leaders, excellent in sports, in the classroom and in their communities (all great things by the way). We've encouraged ourselves to save ridiculous amounts of money to fund their educations. The expectation was clear: do these things and you will have qualified for admission to an elite institution (and you'll have the opportunity to pay 80k/year for the experience). This year, that expectation was blown up.

If the schools want to upend that process and set new expectations, fine, but they should be prepared for it to backfire. Maybe upper middle class families who have saved for decades to pay for the dream of elite schools decide it isn't worth 80k /year to be jerked around like this. Maybe more will decide that the state school is just fine for undergrad.(It's one thing to pay the 80k for a top school, quite another for a safety.)

NP. Funny thing is, the closer we get to May 1, the more I feel this way on price. Kid is deciding between cheap school and expensive school and is on a waitlist for a top school (that is also expensive). I think to myself, meh, school X isn't really worth that extra 20-30/k per year. The waitlist, and the way this entire admission season feels really dragged out, the less enthusiasm for schools where kid was deferred and waitlisted. The excitement has waned considerably.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Turning this into a waitlist game of chicken will at sone point backfire on these schools.

This - 100%!

Something has to give. When you have top students (yes, top grades, SAT, extracurriculars, research, internships, etc.) get shut out of all matches and reaches and sit on 5-7 waitlists, it is going to backfire on these schools.

The reality is that all of us have - to some degree - bought into the racket that is the college process. We've encouraged our kids to work their asses off for years, do all the right things, be leaders, excellent in sports, in the classroom and in their communities (all great things by the way). We've encouraged ourselves to save ridiculous amounts of money to fund their educations. The expectation was clear: do these things and you will have qualified for admission to an elite institution (and you'll have the opportunity to pay 80k/year for the experience). This year, that expectation was blown up.

If the schools want to upend that process and set new expectations, fine, but they should be prepared for it to backfire. Maybe upper middle class families who have saved for decades to pay for the dream of elite schools decide it isn't worth 80k /year to be jerked around like this. Maybe more will decide that the state school is just fine for undergrad.(It's one thing to pay the 80k for a top school, quite another for a safety.)

Not if you go to UVA 😉

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This has all gotten out of control. The class of 2022 should boycott this process and go to community college for a year. Force these schools to stop gaming the system and making these kids jump through a thousand hoops.

Something is going to have to give.

My son is only a junior this year but there are a few seniors in his friend group who had terrible outcomes this year. They're all kids with excellent grades, scores, and extracurriculars.

I know one who has much better stats than my older kid who is a senior at UVA. It's crazy to think that in 3.5 years it has changed so much that my kid probably wouldn't make it in if she applied today.

+1

The community college idea is actually a great one. I wonder if the state schools are communicating (which they aren't supposed to, but who knows - there was an issue re: ivies doing this is I believe the 80's, if I recall correctly - and they were in big trouble for having done so) about which students to take. DP here.

I know many, many, many students who are grossly disappointed this year, rightfully so. No one wants their kid to be at a school that is a total mismatch, in the name of yield protection.

Last year was completely opposite, due to so many deferrals, and I think some parents were hopeful, maybe overly so. Students are going to be at a loss for the next few years, as a result.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This has all gotten out of control. The class of 2022 should boycott this process and go to community college for a year. Force these schools to stop gaming the system and making these kids jump through a thousand hoops.

Something is going to have to give.

My son is only a junior this year but there are a few seniors in his friend group who had terrible outcomes this year. They're all kids with excellent grades, scores, and extracurriculars.

I know one who has much better stats than my older kid who is a senior at UVA. It's crazy to think that in 3.5 years it has changed so much that my kid probably wouldn't make it in if she applied today.

What needs to give is the perception than only a small handful of schools are "good". Or that going to a school that isn't on the top 10 list is a "terrible" outcome.

Are all of these parents talking about ivies?? That would be bad and terribly unrealistic. If the kid has the stats, with no "in", then the parents could rightfully be disappointed.

The real issue is, too many parents think they can game the system. As the recent debacles (including the change in TJ HS to lottery) has taught us - gaming the system is something the colleges are trying to avoid. Parents really need to let their kids be who they are, not who the parents want them to be, in the name of bragging rights.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Turning this into a waitlist game of chicken will at sone point backfire on these schools.

This - 100%!

Something has to give. When you have top students (yes, top grades, SAT, extracurriculars, research, internships, etc.) get shut out of all matches and reaches and sit on 5-7 waitlists, it is going to backfire on these schools.

The reality is that all of us have - to some degree - bought into the racket that is the college process. We've encouraged our kids to work their asses off for years, do all the right things, be leaders, excellent in sports, in the classroom and in their communities (all great things by the way). We've encouraged ourselves to save ridiculous amounts of money to fund their educations. The expectation was clear: do these things and you will have qualified for admission to an elite institution (and you'll have the opportunity to pay 80k/year for the experience). This year, that expectation was blown up.

If the schools want to upend that process and set new expectations, fine, but they should be prepared for it to backfire. Maybe upper middle class families who have saved for decades to pay for the dream of elite schools decide it isn't worth 80k /year to be jerked around like this. Maybe more will decide that the state school is just fine for undergrad.(It's one thing to pay the 80k for a top school, quite another for a safety.)

There are only so many spots at the ivies, and that will never change.