University of Chicago

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Isn’t Chicago’s ROI hurt because so many kids go into academia? So the salary one or even 10 years after graduation is going to be low.

The schools at the top of the ROI tables are usually state engineering schools. Georgia Tech, etc. Low tuition and grads make consistently good salaries straight out of undergrad. Doesn’t measure long-term earning potential or other measures of achievement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my opinion, I don't think one can over-estimate the impact of the Chicago Statement (2014?) and the national attention received in 2016 by the letter sent by the Dean of Students to the incoming freshman class of 2020 affirming the free speech principles in the Chicago Statement. UChicago's committment to free speech and exposing students to diverse and opposing viewpoints and ideas is a true distinctive among the elite schools. It has come under assault during the past year and fingers crossed it can hold now that Pres. Zimmer is leaving.

NP here with kid who was just accepted ED into Chicago a couple of days ago.
.
I'm a sometime poster on DCUM who started out at a junior college and ended up at Harvard Law, then after practicing a bit, I ended up consulting in negotiation/conflict resolution. In law school and in consulting, I very much came to believe that we cannot change one another's minds unless we establish an atmosphere that is safe enough for people to express their views without fear of a resulting ad hominem attack. A saying of my mentor was "you cannot change someone's mind until you know where their mind is." Which does not mean assuming you know where their mind is, but rather actually putting one's assumptions aside, listening, and being open to being persuaded yourself.

Anyways, while over time many things in our culture have gotten better, and some things worse, but for purposes of this post, I have been concerned about the de-emphasis on freedom of speech in our culture and schools. I saw that UChicago acceptance letter a few years back and discussed it with my kid. We ended up going to admissions talk given by Dean Nondorf--which did not emphasize this, but wow he is good at what he does--and my kid became set on UChicago. So many years ago now.

I'm concerned, though, that it's like getting accepted to Sparta. I believe she'll get an unparalleled education--assuming she survives it.

Congratulations to your daughter. It sounds like she will thrive at UChicago. It is a special place and she will receive an unparalleled education there while enjoying all Chicago has to offer.

Lots of things to love about UofC and more than a few to dislike, but my Class of 2020 kid’s experience suggests that norms regarding campus speech are no different there than at other elite universities. (Probably generational/social media driven). Not an unparalleled education, but can be an excellent one. Again, true elsewhere.

Agreed. UChicago is functionally no different from any other elite private university, but much of the right has latched onto this image. Not saying PPs are conservatives or right-wing or making any judgment call either way, just pointing that out. UChicago's posturing as a beacon of "free speech" et al is a marketing exercise.

The students at Chicago are as batsh*t crazy liberal as any of the other elite privates, even some of its faculty, specially in the English and History departments are annoyingly woke, but that still misses the point. The administration at Chicago is certainly in control and very moderate and prevents the woke gang from trying to cancel other ideas, while allowing them to still shout out their crazy nonsense from the roof tops. That doesn't happen in other schools where the woke gang has either taken over the administration or they are too scared to do anything about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my opinion, I don't think one can over-estimate the impact of the Chicago Statement (2014?) and the national attention received in 2016 by the letter sent by the Dean of Students to the incoming freshman class of 2020 affirming the free speech principles in the Chicago Statement. UChicago's committment to free speech and exposing students to diverse and opposing viewpoints and ideas is a true distinctive among the elite schools. It has come under assault during the past year and fingers crossed it can hold now that Pres. Zimmer is leaving.

NP here with kid who was just accepted ED into Chicago a couple of days ago.
.
I'm a sometime poster on DCUM who started out at a junior college and ended up at Harvard Law, then after practicing a bit, I ended up consulting in negotiation/conflict resolution. In law school and in consulting, I very much came to believe that we cannot change one another's minds unless we establish an atmosphere that is safe enough for people to express their views without fear of a resulting ad hominem attack. A saying of my mentor was "you cannot change someone's mind until you know where their mind is." Which does not mean assuming you know where their mind is, but rather actually putting one's assumptions aside, listening, and being open to being persuaded yourself.

Anyways, while over time many things in our culture have gotten better, and some things worse, but for purposes of this post, I have been concerned about the de-emphasis on freedom of speech in our culture and schools. I saw that UChicago acceptance letter a few years back and discussed it with my kid. We ended up going to admissions talk given by Dean Nondorf--which did not emphasize this, but wow he is good at what he does--and my kid became set on UChicago. So many years ago now.

I'm concerned, though, that it's like getting accepted to Sparta. I believe she'll get an unparalleled education--assuming she survives it.

Congratulations to your daughter. It sounds like she will thrive at UChicago. It is a special place and she will receive an unparalleled education there while enjoying all Chicago has to offer.

Lots of things to love about UofC and more than a few to dislike, but my Class of 2020 kid’s experience suggests that norms regarding campus speech are no different there than at other elite universities. (Probably generational/social media driven). Not an unparalleled education, but can be an excellent one. Again, true elsewhere.

Agreed. UChicago is functionally no different from any other elite private university, but much of the right has latched onto this image. Not saying PPs are conservatives or right-wing or making any judgment call either way, just pointing that out. UChicago's posturing as a beacon of "free speech" et al is a marketing exercise.

The students at Chicago are as batsh*t crazy liberal as any of the other elite privates, even some of its faculty, specially in the English and History departments are annoyingly woke, but that still misses the point. The administration at Chicago is certainly in control and very moderate and prevents the woke gang from trying to cancel other ideas, while allowing them to still shout out their crazy nonsense from the roof tops. That doesn't happen in other schools where the woke gang has either taken over the administration or they are too scared to do anything about it.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my opinion, I don't think one can over-estimate the impact of the Chicago Statement (2014?) and the national attention received in 2016 by the letter sent by the Dean of Students to the incoming freshman class of 2020 affirming the free speech principles in the Chicago Statement. UChicago's committment to free speech and exposing students to diverse and opposing viewpoints and ideas is a true distinctive among the elite schools. It has come under assault during the past year and fingers crossed it can hold now that Pres. Zimmer is leaving.

NP here with kid who was just accepted ED into Chicago a couple of days ago.
.
I'm a sometime poster on DCUM who started out at a junior college and ended up at Harvard Law, then after practicing a bit, I ended up consulting in negotiation/conflict resolution. In law school and in consulting, I very much came to believe that we cannot change one another's minds unless we establish an atmosphere that is safe enough for people to express their views without fear of a resulting ad hominem attack. A saying of my mentor was "you cannot change someone's mind until you know where their mind is." Which does not mean assuming you know where their mind is, but rather actually putting one's assumptions aside, listening, and being open to being persuaded yourself.

Anyways, while over time many things in our culture have gotten better, and some things worse, but for purposes of this post, I have been concerned about the de-emphasis on freedom of speech in our culture and schools. I saw that UChicago acceptance letter a few years back and discussed it with my kid. We ended up going to admissions talk given by Dean Nondorf--which did not emphasize this, but wow he is good at what he does--and my kid became set on UChicago. So many years ago now.

I'm concerned, though, that it's like getting accepted to Sparta. I believe she'll get an unparalleled education--assuming she survives it.

Congratulations to your daughter. It sounds like she will thrive at UChicago. It is a special place and she will receive an unparalleled education there while enjoying all Chicago has to offer.

Lots of things to love about UofC and more than a few to dislike, but my Class of 2020 kid’s experience suggests that norms regarding campus speech are no different there than at other elite universities. (Probably generational/social media driven). Not an unparalleled education, but can be an excellent one. Again, true elsewhere.

Agreed. UChicago is functionally no different from any other elite private university, but much of the right has latched onto this image. Not saying PPs are conservatives or right-wing or making any judgment call either way, just pointing that out. UChicago's posturing as a beacon of "free speech" et al is a marketing exercise.

The students at Chicago are as batsh*t crazy liberal as any of the other elite privates, even some of its faculty, specially in the English and History departments are annoyingly woke, but that still misses the point. The administration at Chicago is certainly in control and very moderate and prevents the woke gang from trying to cancel other ideas, while allowing them to still shout out their crazy nonsense from the roof tops. That doesn't happen in other schools where the woke gang has either taken over the administration or they are too scared to do anything about it.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

so I'm the second PP above, with the kid that was accepted. I recognize that the Statement might be what the university is peddling vs. what the reality is, but I like that they are peddling it. As it attracted my DD, it may attract other kids who are interested in listening, considering, debating, and convincing vs canceling. Left or right. And not just in politics, but in other areas as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my opinion, I don't think one can over-estimate the impact of the Chicago Statement (2014?) and the national attention received in 2016 by the letter sent by the Dean of Students to the incoming freshman class of 2020 affirming the free speech principles in the Chicago Statement. UChicago's committment to free speech and exposing students to diverse and opposing viewpoints and ideas is a true distinctive among the elite schools. It has come under assault during the past year and fingers crossed it can hold now that Pres. Zimmer is leaving.

NP here with kid who was just accepted ED into Chicago a couple of days ago.
.
I'm a sometime poster on DCUM who started out at a junior college and ended up at Harvard Law, then after practicing a bit, I ended up consulting in negotiation/conflict resolution. In law school and in consulting, I very much came to believe that we cannot change one another's minds unless we establish an atmosphere that is safe enough for people to express their views without fear of a resulting ad hominem attack. A saying of my mentor was "you cannot change someone's mind until you know where their mind is." Which does not mean assuming you know where their mind is, but rather actually putting one's assumptions aside, listening, and being open to being persuaded yourself.

Anyways, while over time many things in our culture have gotten better, and some things worse, but for purposes of this post, I have been concerned about the de-emphasis on freedom of speech in our culture and schools. I saw that UChicago acceptance letter a few years back and discussed it with my kid. We ended up going to admissions talk given by Dean Nondorf--which did not emphasize this, but wow he is good at what he does--and my kid became set on UChicago. So many years ago now.

I'm concerned, though, that it's like getting accepted to Sparta. I believe she'll get an unparalleled education--assuming she survives it.

Congratulations to your daughter. It sounds like she will thrive at UChicago. It is a special place and she will receive an unparalleled education there while enjoying all Chicago has to offer.

Lots of things to love about UofC and more than a few to dislike, but my Class of 2020 kid’s experience suggests that norms regarding campus speech are no different there than at other elite universities. (Probably generational/social media driven). Not an unparalleled education, but can be an excellent one. Again, true elsewhere.

Agreed. UChicago is functionally no different from any other elite private university, but much of the right has latched onto this image. Not saying PPs are conservatives or right-wing or making any judgment call either way, just pointing that out. UChicago's posturing as a beacon of "free speech" et al is a marketing exercise.

The students at Chicago are as batsh*t crazy liberal as any of the other elite privates, even some of its faculty, specially in the English and History departments are annoyingly woke, but that still misses the point. The administration at Chicago is certainly in control and very moderate and prevents the woke gang from trying to cancel other ideas, while allowing them to still shout out their crazy nonsense from the roof tops. That doesn't happen in other schools where the woke gang has either taken over the administration or they are too scared to do anything about it.

You realize that Fox News’ legal defense of tucker Carlson is that he is an entertainer and none of his viewers confuse what he says on his show with actual facts, right?

[Anonymous]

They send out a lot of marketing material. DS gets about 1 piece of mail or an email from them every week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They send out a lot of marketing material. DS gets about 1 piece of mail or an email from them every week.

Seriously. It reeks of desperation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my opinion, I don't think one can over-estimate the impact of the Chicago Statement (2014?) and the national attention received in 2016 by the letter sent by the Dean of Students to the incoming freshman class of 2020 affirming the free speech principles in the Chicago Statement. UChicago's committment to free speech and exposing students to diverse and opposing viewpoints and ideas is a true distinctive among the elite schools. It has come under assault during the past year and fingers crossed it can hold now that Pres. Zimmer is leaving.

NP here with kid who was just accepted ED into Chicago a couple of days ago.
.
I'm a sometime poster on DCUM who started out at a junior college and ended up at Harvard Law, then after practicing a bit, I ended up consulting in negotiation/conflict resolution. In law school and in consulting, I very much came to believe that we cannot change one another's minds unless we establish an atmosphere that is safe enough for people to express their views without fear of a resulting ad hominem attack. A saying of my mentor was "you cannot change someone's mind until you know where their mind is." Which does not mean assuming you know where their mind is, but rather actually putting one's assumptions aside, listening, and being open to being persuaded yourself.

Anyways, while over time many things in our culture have gotten better, and some things worse, but for purposes of this post, I have been concerned about the de-emphasis on freedom of speech in our culture and schools. I saw that UChicago acceptance letter a few years back and discussed it with my kid. We ended up going to admissions talk given by Dean Nondorf--which did not emphasize this, but wow he is good at what he does--and my kid became set on UChicago. So many years ago now.

I'm concerned, though, that it's like getting accepted to Sparta. I believe she'll get an unparalleled education--assuming she survives it.

Congratulations to your daughter. It sounds like she will thrive at UChicago. It is a special place and she will receive an unparalleled education there while enjoying all Chicago has to offer.

Lots of things to love about UofC and more than a few to dislike, but my Class of 2020 kid’s experience suggests that norms regarding campus speech are no different there than at other elite universities. (Probably generational/social media driven). Not an unparalleled education, but can be an excellent one. Again, true elsewhere.

Agreed. UChicago is functionally no different from any other elite private university, but much of the right has latched onto this image. Not saying PPs are conservatives or right-wing or making any judgment call either way, just pointing that out. UChicago's posturing as a beacon of "free speech" et al is a marketing exercise.

The students at Chicago are as batsh*t crazy liberal as any of the other elite privates, even some of its faculty, specially in the English and History departments are annoyingly woke, but that still misses the point. The administration at Chicago is certainly in control and very moderate and prevents the woke gang from trying to cancel other ideas, while allowing them to still shout out their crazy nonsense from the roof tops. That doesn't happen in other schools where the woke gang has either taken over the administration or they are too scared to do anything about it.

You realize that Fox News’ legal defense of tucker Carlson is that he is an entertainer and none of his viewers confuse what he says on his show with actual facts, right?

“confuses”

[Anonymous]

Enough with all this bragging about how intellectual U of C is. I know several adults who went there. They seem bright but no different from people I know from other top 20 schools. It’s just another university, nothing especially unique about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Enough with all this bragging about how intellectual U of C is. I know several adults who went there. They seem bright but no different from people I know from other top 20 schools. It’s just another university, nothing especially unique about it.

+1. The self-congratulatory intellectual elitism is a hallmark of UChicago. The pretense would make even a Harvard grad blush.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They send out a lot of marketing material. DS gets about 1 piece of mail or an email from them every week.

Seriously. It reeks of desperation.

Or posts like these:

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/uchicago-more-popular-than-harvard-stanford-ivys-at-beverly-hills-high-school/2798813/ "UChicago More Popular Than Harvard, Stanford, Ivys at Beverly Hills High School"

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/uchicago-is-tops-at-top-prep-schools/2795312/ "UChicago is Tops at Top Prep Schools"

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/admit-rates-standardized-test-averages-cross-admit-results/2046971 "Admit Rates, Standardized Test Averages, Cross Admit Results"

The comments made by some of the Chicago boosters on collegeconfidential crack me up every time I read them over.

[Anonymous]

I work with a guy who went to UChicago. Nice guy, hardworking and smart but no street smarts at all. His emotional IQ is very low. He doesn’t understand the office politics at all which is key in my office to getting your projects approved and getting ahead. I try to help him out but others think he is weird because he mostly keeps to himself. He referred to UChicago as the type of place where students debate Plato in their free time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I work with a guy who went to UChicago. Nice guy, hardworking and smart but no street smarts at all. His emotional IQ is very low. He doesn’t understand the office politics at all which is key in my office to getting your projects approved and getting ahead. I try to help him out but others think he is weird because he mostly keeps to himself. He referred to UChicago as the type of place where students debate Plato in their free time.

This is known as an anecdote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They send out a lot of marketing material. DS gets about 1 piece of mail or an email from them every week.

Seriously. It reeks of desperation.

Or posts like these:

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/uchicago-more-popular-than-harvard-stanford-ivys-at-beverly-hills-high-school/2798813/ "UChicago More Popular Than Harvard, Stanford, Ivys at Beverly Hills High School"

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/uchicago-is-tops-at-top-prep-schools/2795312/ "UChicago is Tops at Top Prep Schools"

https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/admit-rates-standardized-test-averages-cross-admit-results/2046971 "Admit Rates, Standardized Test Averages, Cross Admit Results"

The comments made by some of the Chicago boosters on collegeconfidential crack me up every time I read them over.

You’re weirdly invested in this, you know that, right? Try to let it go.

[Anonymous]

Earlier in the thread it was predicted the crazy anti U of C would show up.

Who hurt you so?