MoCo Question B would be a disaster

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just a friendly reminder for those who aren't reading the full thread that if approved, Question B will put the county's AAA bond rating at risk.

We already have a revenue cap in Montgomery County. The Charter requires a unanimous vote of the County Council to exceed it. Question B would make the cap permanent. Meaning if an unexpected cost occurs (like the state shifting pension costs to the county, as it did a few years ago, and it's not an insignificant cost), or if the state changes the education funding formula so MoCo gets less state aid for schools, the Council will have no choice but to reduce services and/cancel or postpone capital projects like school renovations. And it means as property values go up, county revenues can't keep up to pay workers enough to live in the county. It's a terrible idea.

Really? Look up Peter Bang, 20 year employee who stole almost $7 million over the last 6 years.
Look up Andrew Kkeine who resigned after violating county ethics policy and continued to remain on the payroll for 6 weeks. He was making $280kat the time.
Look at the lawsuit against montgomery county for providing cash assistance to illegal residents. This is for $5 million although I am actually ok with this program. The program that provides legal aid to illegals, i am not ok with. this was almost $400k that was actually rejected because too many rlexceptions were applied, meaning those with criminal background wouldn't qualify but the county is working on loosening these restrictions.
How long have we been trying to close the achievement gap at schools? we keep throwing money at the problem, but at the end of the day, it comes down to parenting, which we cant fix.
And what about the recent racial equity act program? what is that all about? seriously. this county embraces diversity like no other, so much so that people are getting tired about it. How much more awareness do we need? How do you measure results?
How about the redistricting project. the consultants cost $500k......there's more, I just dont have time to do all your research.


They can cut all those ridiculous social justice programs. They.can stop giving themselves raises. they can manage and audit their employees before they run off with a shitload of $$$. they can stop giving severance payments to employees that are fired. they can cut bloated pension benefits for highly compensated employees, they can stop wasting money on programs that just dont work. I can go on and on...

The already cut pensions for non public safety employees. They are not going to stop the "ridiculous social justice programs" and if they did, they are a drop in the bucket. I can think of exactly one case of an employee stealing money in the last decade - that was less than a drop in the bucket. Which programs just don't work? How much do they cost?

And don't be silly. MoCo employees don't get fired. Question B is definitely not going to change that.

[Anonymous]

And people wonder why those with means are fleeing the titanic that is Moco...

[Anonymous]

I have scrolled through this thread, then something suddenly occurred to me.

There are just over 35% of residents who are renters in Montgomery County. They all get to vote on these ballot questions with no direct cost risk to their personal household income, but they could stand to gain on services that benefit them. On top of that, renters have been increasing since 1990 (32%-35%) and property ownership has slightly declined (67%-64%).

If these trends continue, it will be pulling revenue from a dwindling source and become onerous.

Perhaps it is time to think about obtaining revenue for County services from sources outside of property taxes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have scrolled through this thread, then something suddenly occurred to me.

There are just over 35% of residents who are renters in Montgomery County. They all get to vote on these ballot questions with no direct cost risk to their personal household income, but they could stand to gain on services that benefit them. On top of that, renters have been increasing since 1990 (32%-35%) and property ownership has slightly declined (67%-64%).

If these trends continue, it will be pulling revenue from a dwindling source and become onerous.

Perhaps it is time to think about obtaining revenue for County services from sources outside of property taxes?

I'm not sure renters see it that way.

And if they do think "oh this will only affect property owners", they should know their rents will go up as landlords have increased property taxes and pass it on to rent costs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have scrolled through this thread, then something suddenly occurred to me.

There are just over 35% of residents who are renters in Montgomery County. They all get to vote on these ballot questions with no direct cost risk to their personal household income, but they could stand to gain on services that benefit them. On top of that, renters have been increasing since 1990 (32%-35%) and property ownership has slightly declined (67%-64%).

If these trends continue, it will be pulling revenue from a dwindling source and become onerous.

Perhaps it is time to think about obtaining revenue for County services from sources outside of property taxes?

I'm not sure renters see it that way.

And if they do think "oh this will only affect property owners", they should know their rents will go up as landlords have increased property taxes and pass it on to rent costs.

+1 rent hikes will result in property tax hikes. The renters will pay unless it becomes a buyers market for rentals which could be happening, who knows? If that occurs, property owners will stop renting properties and sell them off which will result in a natural re-balancing. It could take a few years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved to Howard County 6 years ago, but still have a rental property in Kensington.

When Andrew Friedson (who I like btw!) is considered the conservative/moderate on the CC that tells you all you need to know. It is lefter than left. Spend, spend, tax, tax.

Duncan, and Ike Leggett could maintain some minor sense of pro business moderation, but Elrich caters to the council. It's awful.

Moco is on a fast train to fiscal insolvency, and continuing to further soak the taxpayers to pay for years of non negotiation with unions, blatant pandering to illegals (note, yes I said "illegals", and not terms like "undocumented" that imply some sort of clerical error), have sent the county down a tough path.

"B" is just the smallest steps to putting the brakes on that.

Dont let the fact it is Robin Ficker, dissaude you from decent legislation.

You don't live in MoCo so you should mind your own business. All these people using the word "soak" seem like the same person.

Excuse me. I still own property in Moco, which I pay property tax on. I lived there for over 30 years. I have tons of family and friends there.

So don't tell me to "mind my own business". It is very much MY business. Thanks for your concern though!

You still don't live there, so you don't have a vote on the matter. What you say is irrelevant.

+1
This guy that thinks they're "soaking" the wealthy isn't even a resident of the county. She should just sell her rental property and buy one where she lives so she won't be "soaked".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have scrolled through this thread, then something suddenly occurred to me.

There are just over 35% of residents who are renters in Montgomery County. They all get to vote on these ballot questions with no direct cost risk to their personal household income, but they could stand to gain on services that benefit them. On top of that, renters have been increasing since 1990 (32%-35%) and property ownership has slightly declined (67%-64%).

If these trends continue, it will be pulling revenue from a dwindling source and become onerous.

Perhaps it is time to think about obtaining revenue for County services from sources outside of property taxes?

I'm not sure renters see it that way.

And if they do think "oh this will only affect property owners", they should know their rents will go up as landlords have increased property taxes and pass it on to rent costs.

+1 yes this is basic knowledge

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Really? Look up Peter Bang, 20 year employee who stole almost $7 million over the last 6 years.
Look up Andrew Kkeine who resigned after violating county ethics policy and continued to remain on the payroll for 6 weeks. He was making $280kat the time.

So, a little over $1 million per year from Peter Bang? That is a lot of money, but it is a drop in the bucket in terms of the county's budget. Andrew Kleine was even less. These are the only cases you can think of because theft and corruption by employees in Montgomery County is extraordinarily rare. You're not going to find much savings.

And no, you can't say "We can save so much money from all these programs that don't work" and then say "I don't want to do your research" when I ask you what those programs are.

[Anonymous]

This was an easy vote. Elrich sent out how he wanted us to vote and I vote the exact opposite.

[Anonymous]

Unless you enjoy higher property taxes, vote NO on question A and YES on question B.

Question A is deceptively worded, naturally, but hopefully people will see through the ruse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Unless you enjoy higher property taxes, vote NO on question A and YES on question B.

Question A is deceptively worded, naturally, but hopefully people will see through the ruse.

I actually think Question B is much less clear. It makes it sound like it's establishing the limit. It's not. It's making the existing limit irreversible even by a unanimous vote.

[Anonymous]

The supposed disastrous impact of Question B is overstated. Question B would actually force the council to make wiser decisions to avoid the need for an emergency increase. Right now, they're just writing blank checks that they can't cash because well, we'll just vote unanimously to override the cap if we go over, NBD. They need to be accountable for their actions. If push comes to shove, then they can redirect money to prioritized services like fire, rescue, police. I seriously doubt they'd let essential services lapse. If anything, it would make them seriously consider what is really needed for the county. Vote against Question A, vote for Question B.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The supposed disastrous impact of Question B is overstated. Question B would actually force the council to make wiser decisions to avoid the need for an emergency increase. Right now, they're just writing blank checks that they can't cash because well, we'll just vote unanimously to override the cap if we go over, NBD. They need to be accountable for their actions. If push comes to shove, then they can redirect money to prioritized services like fire, rescue, police. I seriously doubt they'd let essential services lapse. If anything, it would make them seriously consider what is really needed for the county. Vote against Question A, vote for Question B.

I don't think you understand how county budgets work. They approve the budget and they have to approve a tax levy that will fund the budget at the same time.

It's really irresponsible to hamstring your elected representatives like this. If you don't think they are being responsible, vote them out, don't punish future generations for their mistakes. You don't know what's going to happen in the future. In the past decade the state shifted teacher pension costs to counties ( http://www.baltimoresun.com/ph-ll-cns-pension-0322-20120316-story.html ) and a SCOTUS decision lowered income tax revenue ( https://bethesdamagazine.com/bethesda-beat/news/us-supreme-court-decision-in-tax-case-could-cost-montgomery-county-millions/). Each of these amounted to tens of millions per year that can no longer be used for schools, or roads, or libraries.

You think the Council will just cut the things you don't care about if they don't have enough money? Nope. Those things are never as expensive or as useless as you think they are. It will be the bike lane you were counting on, or the HVAC renovation for your child's school, or the library hours you value. Not just because the county's tax revenues are lower, but because the county will have to pay more interest on its debt (https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/what-are-tax-and-expenditure-limits).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The supposed disastrous impact of Question B is overstated. Question B would actually force the council to make wiser decisions to avoid the need for an emergency increase. Right now, they're just writing blank checks that they can't cash because well, we'll just vote unanimously to override the cap if we go over, NBD. They need to be accountable for their actions. If push comes to shove, then they can redirect money to prioritized services like fire, rescue, police. I seriously doubt they'd let essential services lapse. If anything, it would make them seriously consider what is really needed for the county. Vote against Question A, vote for Question B.

I don't think you understand how county budgets work. They approve the budget and they have to approve a tax levy that will fund the budget at the same time.

It's really irresponsible to hamstring your elected representatives like this. If you don't think they are being responsible, vote them out, don't punish future generations for their mistakes. You don't know what's going to happen in the future. In the past decade the state shifted teacher pension costs to counties ( http://www.baltimoresun.com/ph-ll-cns-pension-0322-20120316-story.html ) and a SCOTUS decision lowered income tax revenue ( https://bethesdamagazine.com/bethesda-beat/news/us-supreme-court-decision-in-tax-case-could-cost-montgomery-county-millions/). Each of these amounted to tens of millions per year that can no longer be used for schools, or roads, or libraries.

You think the Council will just cut the things you don't care about if they don't have enough money? Nope. Those things are never as expensive or as useless as you think they are. It will be the bike lane you were counting on, or the HVAC renovation for your child's school, or the library hours you value. Not just because the county's tax revenues are lower, but because the county will have to pay more interest on its debt (https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/what-are-tax-and-expenditure-limits).

the problem is that before you can vote them out, they may have already voted to raise taxes and not be good stewards of the tax funds.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

the problem is that before you can vote them out, they may have already voted to raise taxes and not be good stewards of the tax funds.

No the problem is that Question B is permanent. A tax increase is not. They change the tax rate every year. You just don't like the will of the voters, and want to subvert it without caring how it will impact the county's finances or the critical services it provides