Is USA soccer in trouble now that we didn't qualify ?!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ His parents did everything to SHIELD him from the idiot American soccer coaches. He did not play in multiple tournaments or for multiple teams. They guarded his development. So unlike the teams around here traveling out of town for some 'elite' tournament every other weekend and wasting so many nights a week---up to 4---in training that is doing NOTHING for their individual development. They could use more time on their own.

Can't wait to see how the 2005,2006,2007 DA boys grow up, they were were the first ones to be eligible for the U12 DA and could potentially have similar hours of training at 17-18 years of age as their counterparts in European academies. I think then we will be able to see at U20 how many players destined for high-level of college and professional teams continue and then how many of those do break in to the USMNT in their mid-twenties. This experiment will take a while, but if the DA doesn't seem to be bearing fruit by 2030 WC, then it would be safe to say it didn't work. I know, 2030, but what most people don't realize(including myself) is development takes a long time and only flowers for a few years. A great footballer can look at an average of 8-10 years of playing time with 2-3 years in their late twenties as their prime. This excludes the legends of Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Henry, Mbappe, Dembele, Pulisic who could potentially have a 15-20 year career, which would mean you would have to start in your late teens as a professional.

Looking at the Club coaches that are doing the training for those DA boys, I wouldn't get my hopes up. It is the same regular old Club travel coaches. Nothing special is going on.

That bolded makes me laugh. It only matters what type and style of training it is (more of what we saw last Tuesday night). The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Those 9-12 year olds (05-07) would be much better served using a lot of that time on their own.

Loudoun and Arlington DA are playing the same tired way that keeps us getting our a** kicked on the International stage.

LOL no. The reason why the US loses is because they do not have world class athletes. There is a lot of hype with the USMNT. Pulisic is a good player, but he would not make a Bundesliga all star team or play on the the German National team. The rest of the national team are basically minor league players.

The major soccer leagues/national soccer powers all start with great athlete who are great soccer players and cutting from there. The US will continue to underperform because the US does not have world class athletes playing soccer. The best athletes in the US choose other sports. Why would you pick soccer? The clubs here do not promise a path to the premier league but maybe just maybe a college scholarship..LOL! (And you have to pay the club). So you have to leave the country at 13 to play soccer or you can play basketball, football, hockey, track, etc and stay at home. Oh and everyone will know you...because you are a star athlete/big shot in high school( and they pay you or your family).

Everything about your post is wrong.
Pulisic is a world class athlete, and would be playing, or at least getting serious consideration, from any team in the world.
And guess what? With his physique, he wouldn't have a chance in any other major sport, which is why the "US doesn't get their best athletes to play soccer" argument is so stupid.
Great basketball players wouldn't necessarily make great soccer or football players, or vice versa.
Every single player on the USMNT is a world class athlete. We've always had the reputation of having athletic teams, we've just been lacking the technical skill and tactics to be better.
We have 350 million people. Iceland made the world cup with 300,000. We have more than enough world class athletes to go around in every major sport. We probably have more pure world class athletes playing soccer than any other country.

agreed. Does that clueless idiot not know that Pulisic is one of the only players to score as many goals as MESSI at his age in International play.

Pulisic is being heavily considered for a Spanish/La Liga team and would be the only American ever to play in that league.

Pulisic is a MAJOR player for Dortmund (one of the best teams in the World) at only 19.

Btw, they only reason he won't play on the German National team is because he is not a German citizen---nothing to do with talent.

Good lord---and we wonder why Americans don't get anywhere. The knowledge of the sport is incredibly piss-poor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ His parents did everything to SHIELD him from the idiot American soccer coaches. He did not play in multiple tournaments or for multiple teams. They guarded his development. So unlike the teams around here traveling out of town for some 'elite' tournament every other weekend and wasting so many nights a week---up to 4---in training that is doing NOTHING for their individual development. They could use more time on their own.

Can't wait to see how the 2005,2006,2007 DA boys grow up, they were were the first ones to be eligible for the U12 DA and could potentially have similar hours of training at 17-18 years of age as their counterparts in European academies. I think then we will be able to see at U20 how many players destined for high-level of college and professional teams continue and then how many of those do break in to the USMNT in their mid-twenties. This experiment will take a while, but if the DA doesn't seem to be bearing fruit by 2030 WC, then it would be safe to say it didn't work. I know, 2030, but what most people don't realize(including myself) is development takes a long time and only flowers for a few years. A great footballer can look at an average of 8-10 years of playing time with 2-3 years in their late twenties as their prime. This excludes the legends of Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Henry, Mbappe, Dembele, Pulisic who could potentially have a 15-20 year career, which would mean you would have to start in your late teens as a professional.

Looking at the Club coaches that are doing the training for those DA boys, I wouldn't get my hopes up. It is the same regular old Club travel coaches. Nothing special is going on.

That bolded makes me laugh. It only matters what type and style of training it is (more of what we saw last Tuesday night). The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Those 9-12 year olds (05-07) would be much better served using a lot of that time on their own.

Loudoun and Arlington DA are playing the same tired way that keeps us getting our a** kicked on the International stage.

LOL no. The reason why the US loses is because they do not have world class athletes. There is a lot of hype with the USMNT. Pulisic is a good player, but he would not make a Bundesliga all star team or play on the the German National team. The rest of the national team are basically minor league players.

The major soccer leagues/national soccer powers all start with great athlete who are great soccer players and cutting from there. The US will continue to underperform because the US does not have world class athletes playing soccer. The best athletes in the US choose other sports. Why would you pick soccer? The clubs here do not promise a path to the premier league but maybe just maybe a college scholarship..LOL! (And you have to pay the club). So you have to leave the country at 13 to play soccer or you can play basketball, football, hockey, track, etc and stay at home. Oh and everyone will know you...because you are a star athlete/big shot in high school( and they pay you or your family).

Everything about your post is wrong.
Pulisic is a world class athlete, and would be playing, or at least getting serious consideration, from any team in the world.
And guess what? With his physique, he wouldn't have a chance in any other major sport, which is why the "US doesn't get their best athletes to play soccer" argument is so stupid.
Great basketball players wouldn't necessarily make great soccer or football players, or vice versa.
Every single player on the USMNT is a world class athlete. We've always had the reputation of having athletic teams, we've just been lacking the technical skill and tactics to be better.
We have 350 million people. Iceland made the world cup with 300,000. We have more than enough world class athletes to go around in every major sport. We probably have more pure world class athletes playing soccer than any other country.

There are no All-Star games in the leagues, I know what you meant was overall performance, but the fact that you mentioned it means your perspective is solely from an American sports POV. Similarly, not being eligble for the German Nat'l Team means he's not German, that's it, nothing to do with ability. Regardless, Pulisic as a player, is one of the most dynamic athletes with a vision and work rate, and high attacking IQ that is similar to the other international players that are being labeled as future stars such as Dembele, Rashford, Mbappe, Martial, Ceballos, Ascencio, and Sane. These players are the ones in 2 years will be the ones being talked about their greatness similar to how Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar are being talked about now. He's on the right path, and it is telling that you don't see that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:...Iceland couldn't afford to do that, so they developed everyone. Look where they are in relation to us on the World stage....

is there anything unique/special about Iceland's model/program than rest of Europe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:...Iceland couldn't afford to do that, so they developed everyone. Look where they are in relation to us on the World stage....

is there anything unique/special about Iceland's model/program than rest of Europe?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jun/08/iceland-stunning-rise-euro-2016-gylfi-sigurdsson-lars-lagerback

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ His parents did everything to SHIELD him from the idiot American soccer coaches. He did not play in multiple tournaments or for multiple teams. They guarded his development. So unlike the teams around here traveling out of town for some 'elite' tournament every other weekend and wasting so many nights a week---up to 4---in training that is doing NOTHING for their individual development. They could use more time on their own.

Can't wait to see how the 2005,2006,2007 DA boys grow up, they were were the first ones to be eligible for the U12 DA and could potentially have similar hours of training at 17-18 years of age as their counterparts in European academies. I think then we will be able to see at U20 how many players destined for high-level of college and professional teams continue and then how many of those do break in to the USMNT in their mid-twenties. This experiment will take a while, but if the DA doesn't seem to be bearing fruit by 2030 WC, then it would be safe to say it didn't work. I know, 2030, but what most people don't realize(including myself) is development takes a long time and only flowers for a few years. A great footballer can look at an average of 8-10 years of playing time with 2-3 years in their late twenties as their prime. This excludes the legends of Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Henry, Mbappe, Dembele, Pulisic who could potentially have a 15-20 year career, which would mean you would have to start in your late teens as a professional.

Looking at the Club coaches that are doing the training for those DA boys, I wouldn't get my hopes up. It is the same regular old Club travel coaches. Nothing special is going on.

That bolded makes me laugh. It only matters what type and style of training it is (more of what we saw last Tuesday night). The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Those 9-12 year olds (05-07) would be much better served using a lot of that time on their own.

Loudoun and Arlington DA are playing the same tired way that keeps us getting our a** kicked on the International stage.

LOL no. The reason why the US loses is because they do not have world class athletes. There is a lot of hype with the USMNT. Pulisic is a good player, but he would not make a Bundesliga all star team or play on the the German National team. The rest of the national team are basically minor league players.

The major soccer leagues/national soccer powers all start with great athlete who are great soccer players and cutting from there. The US will continue to underperform because the US does not have world class athletes playing soccer. The best athletes in the US choose other sports. Why would you pick soccer? The clubs here do not promise a path to the premier league but maybe just maybe a college scholarship..LOL! (And you have to pay the club). So you have to leave the country at 13 to play soccer or you can play basketball, football, hockey, track, etc and stay at home. Oh and everyone will know you...because you are a star athlete/big shot in high school( and they pay you or your family).

Everything about your post is wrong.
Pulisic is a world class athlete, and would be playing, or at least getting serious consideration, from any team in the world.
And guess what? With his physique, he wouldn't have a chance in any other major sport, which is why the "US doesn't get their best athletes to play soccer" argument is so stupid.
Great basketball players wouldn't necessarily make great soccer or football players, or vice versa.
Every single player on the USMNT is a world class athlete. We've always had the reputation of having athletic teams, we've just been lacking the technical skill and tactics to be better.
We have 350 million people. Iceland made the world cup with 300,000. We have more than enough world class athletes to go around in every major sport. We probably have more pure world class athletes playing soccer than any other country.

There are no All-Star games in the leagues, I know what you meant was overall performance, but the fact that you mentioned it means your perspective is solely from an American sports POV. Similarly, not being eligble for the German Nat'l Team means he's not German, that's it, nothing to do with ability. Regardless, Pulisic as a player, is one of the most dynamic athletes with a vision and work rate, and high attacking IQ that is similar to the other international players that are being labeled as future stars such as Dembele, Rashford, Mbappe, Martial, Ceballos, Ascencio, and Sane. These players are the ones in 2 years will be the ones being talked about their greatness similar to how Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar are being talked about now. He's on the right path, and it is telling that you don't see that.

Unlike you I do not think he is the best player in the Bundesliga. You feel the only reason he is not on the German national team because of his Croatian/USA citizenship/eligibility. So if you had to put him on the German national team. You obviously thinks he belongs on it. Who would you cut?

Over all you missed the point. Great athlete can be developed into great soccer players but the wash out rate is as in all sports is extremely high. You need a large pool. How many great athletes will choice to play soccer if they have to leave their family and friends to go play in Europe to develop properly? Let alone have the family support(your dad gets a job with the team), get the work visa eligibility, speak the langue, etc.

[Anonymous]

Yet our society worships football, baseball and basketball, so our best young male athletes gravitate to those sports. There's a better shot at attracting the best female athletes.

[Anonymous]

Football, baseball and basketball are american sports, that's why. It's pretty simple.

Soccer in the US is generally a sport full of rich kids traveling around the country to play each other's club team. The rest of the world it is the opposite - the poorest. They have grinders playing and we don't. I don't consider myself a soccer fan at all but you can see this dynamic from miles away.

ESPN can cram soccer highlights down our throat every day, but it isn't convincing a young Kobe Bryant to become a soccer player.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ His parents did everything to SHIELD him from the idiot American soccer coaches. He did not play in multiple tournaments or for multiple teams. They guarded his development. So unlike the teams around here traveling out of town for some 'elite' tournament every other weekend and wasting so many nights a week---up to 4---in training that is doing NOTHING for their individual development. They could use more time on their own.

Can't wait to see how the 2005,2006,2007 DA boys grow up, they were were the first ones to be eligible for the U12 DA and could potentially have similar hours of training at 17-18 years of age as their counterparts in European academies. I think then we will be able to see at U20 how many players destined for high-level of college and professional teams continue and then how many of those do break in to the USMNT in their mid-twenties. This experiment will take a while, but if the DA doesn't seem to be bearing fruit by 2030 WC, then it would be safe to say it didn't work. I know, 2030, but what most people don't realize(including myself) is development takes a long time and only flowers for a few years. A great footballer can look at an average of 8-10 years of playing time with 2-3 years in their late twenties as their prime. This excludes the legends of Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Henry, Mbappe, Dembele, Pulisic who could potentially have a 15-20 year career, which would mean you would have to start in your late teens as a professional.

Looking at the Club coaches that are doing the training for those DA boys, I wouldn't get my hopes up. It is the same regular old Club travel coaches. Nothing special is going on.

That bolded makes me laugh. It only matters what type and style of training it is (more of what we saw last Tuesday night). The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

Those 9-12 year olds (05-07) would be much better served using a lot of that time on their own.

Loudoun and Arlington DA are playing the same tired way that keeps us getting our a** kicked on the International stage.

LOL no. The reason why the US loses is because they do not have world class athletes. There is a lot of hype with the USMNT. Pulisic is a good player, but he would not make a Bundesliga all star team or play on the the German National team. The rest of the national team are basically minor league players.

The major soccer leagues/national soccer powers all start with great athlete who are great soccer players and cutting from there. The US will continue to underperform because the US does not have world class athletes playing soccer. The best athletes in the US choose other sports. Why would you pick soccer? The clubs here do not promise a path to the premier league but maybe just maybe a college scholarship..LOL! (And you have to pay the club). So you have to leave the country at 13 to play soccer or you can play basketball, football, hockey, track, etc and stay at home. Oh and everyone will know you...because you are a star athlete/big shot in high school( and they pay you or your family).

Everything about your post is wrong.
Pulisic is a world class athlete, and would be playing, or at least getting serious consideration, from any team in the world.
And guess what? With his physique, he wouldn't have a chance in any other major sport, which is why the "US doesn't get their best athletes to play soccer" argument is so stupid.
Great basketball players wouldn't necessarily make great soccer or football players, or vice versa.
Every single player on the USMNT is a world class athlete. We've always had the reputation of having athletic teams, we've just been lacking the technical skill and tactics to be better.
We have 350 million people. Iceland made the world cup with 300,000. We have more than enough world class athletes to go around in every major sport. We probably have more pure world class athletes playing soccer than any other country.

There are no All-Star games in the leagues, I know what you meant was overall performance, but the fact that you mentioned it means your perspective is solely from an American sports POV. Similarly, not being eligble for the German Nat'l Team means he's not German, that's it, nothing to do with ability. Regardless, Pulisic as a player, is one of the most dynamic athletes with a vision and work rate, and high attacking IQ that is similar to the other international players that are being labeled as future stars such as Dembele, Rashford, Mbappe, Martial, Ceballos, Ascencio, and Sane. These players are the ones in 2 years will be the ones being talked about their greatness similar to how Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar are being talked about now. He's on the right path, and it is telling that you don't see that.

Unlike you I do not think he is the best player in the Bundesliga. You feel the only reason he is not on the German national team because of his Croatian/USA citizenship/eligibility. So if you had to put him on the German national team. You obviously thinks he belongs on it. Who would you cut?

Over all you missed the point. Great athlete can be developed into great soccer players but the wash out rate is as in all sports is extremely high. You need a large pool. How many great athletes will choice to play soccer if they have to leave their family and friends to go play in Europe to develop properly? Let alone have the family support(your dad gets a job with the team), get the work visa eligibility, speak the langue, etc.

You can be a great athlete, AND then choose your sport? Huh? The love of the sport is what drives a lot of individuals, the thirst to win. No amount of payday will be greater driver since its not omnipresent and will be fleeting if ever attained. Messi, Manning, Curry, aren't inspired by the next paycheck.

Once we find those individuals willing to play for their love of soccer, well be able to win matches that matter. No one can argue Bradley, Morris, Altidore had their hearts in the TT match. They would have embarrassed us in Russia.

Regarding development, there are plenty of South American players that develop in South America, play in their nations top flight league, and then are bought by European clubs. Not every world class player is developed in a European club's academy at 13 years old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:...Iceland couldn't afford to do that, so they developed everyone. Look where they are in relation to us on the World stage....

is there anything unique/special about Iceland's model/program than rest of Europe?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jun/08/iceland-stunning-rise-euro-2016-gylfi-sigurdsson-lars-lagerback

thx, a great read. what struck me most was their ranking jumped 100 places in 4 years.

wish there's a tv story too. or a movie soon .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:...Iceland couldn't afford to do that, so they developed everyone. Look where they are in relation to us on the World stage....

is there anything unique/special about Iceland's model/program than rest of Europe?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jun/08/iceland-stunning-rise-euro-2016-gylfi-sigurdsson-lars-lagerback

thx, a great read. what struck me most was their ranking jumped 100 places in 4 years.

wish there's a tv story too. or a movie soon .

Good TV story...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1M5_WBOCKXs

[Anonymous]

Anyone else following the U17 World Cup? The US defeated Paraguay 5-0 yesterday to make it to the quarterfinals. I enjoying reading the completely obsessive posters over on the BigSoccer forums:

http://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/match-thread-u-s-u17s-vs-paraguay-10-16-17-10-30-a-m-et.2073839/

Pulisic, great as he is, is by no means the only young talent we have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

You can be a great athlete, AND then choose your sport? Huh? The love of the sport is what drives a lot of individuals, the thirst to win. No amount of payday will be greater driver since its not omnipresent and will be fleeting if ever attained. Messi, Manning, Curry, aren't inspired by the next paycheck.

Once we find those individuals willing to play for their love of soccer, well be able to win matches that matter. No one can argue Bradley, Morris, Altidore had their hearts in the TT match. They would have embarrassed us in Russia.

Regarding development, there are plenty of South American players that develop in South America, play in their nations top flight league, and then are bought by European clubs. Not every world class player is developed in a European club's academy at 13 years old.

FYI, Morris didn't play in the TT match. He was home injured so he wasn't on the roster. Agree he is not good enough for international football though. He made the right decision to stay home and play in MLS. He would not have made it in the Bundesliga.

Also agree that not every world class player is developed in a European club's academy. South American clubs have very good academies too. Yes, kids play all the time on their own, but they also get extremely good coaching in extremely competitive youth teams as they grow up. Some SA examples include Messi - Newell's Old Boys from 8-12; Aguero - Independiente, Neymar - Santos, Suarez - Nacional, Ronaldiinho - Gremio, ....

You'd be hard pressed to find a world class player who didn't grow up with all three of these elements as part of his development: 1) lots of free play, 2) lots of time working on their own, and 3) high quality coaching in a professionally run youth academy.

There are lots of kids in the US who have the passion and commitment to get #s 1 & 2. The problem is too many are still shut out of #3 (to the extent it even exists here), because of pay-to-play.

[Anonymous]

what about Bobby Wood? he's homegrown too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You can be a great athlete, AND then choose your sport? Huh? The love of the sport is what drives a lot of individuals, the thirst to win. No amount of payday will be greater driver since its not omnipresent and will be fleeting if ever attained. Messi, Manning, Curry, aren't inspired by the next paycheck.

Once we find those individuals willing to play for their love of soccer, well be able to win matches that matter. No one can argue Bradley, Morris, Altidore had their hearts in the TT match. They would have embarrassed us in Russia.

Regarding development, there are plenty of South American players that develop in South America, play in their nations top flight league, and then are bought by European clubs. Not every world class player is developed in a European club's academy at 13 years old.

FYI, Morris didn't play in the TT match. He was home injured so he wasn't on the roster. Agree he is not good enough for international football though. He made the right decision to stay home and play in MLS. He would not have made it in the Bundesliga.

Also agree that not every world class player is developed in a European club's academy. South American clubs have very good academies too. Yes, kids play all the time on their own, but they also get extremely good coaching in extremely competitive youth teams as they grow up. Some SA examples include Messi - Newell's Old Boys from 8-12; Aguero - Independiente, Neymar - Santos, Suarez - Nacional, Ronaldiinho - Gremio, ....

You'd be hard pressed to find a world class player who didn't grow up with all three of these elements as part of his development: 1) lots of free play, 2) lots of time working on their own, and 3) high quality coaching in a professionally run youth academy.

There are lots of kids in the US who have the passion and commitment to get #s 1 & 2. The problem is too many are still shut out of #3 (to the extent it even exists here), because of pay-to-play.

BTW when I made the statement about Morris, Jermaine Jones' statement hadn't come out. It is even more convincing now, since Jermaine a USMNT player said it, that if a US player can play in Europe, he should. Mind you not every player will have the success of Pulisic or even be guaranteed to play for a great club, but then again you look at teams that go deep consistently in the WC and their players are always scattered throughout Europe.

Look at some of the countries' 2016 Europe squad, not all of their players are starters for Bayern/Barcelona/Madrid/Juventus/PSG/Man City/Chelsea; there is a wide mix. Now you may say if you're in Europe, stay in Europe but the same is true strong teams in Copa America although more of those players do play in their countries top-flight league. HOWEVER, MLS is NOT a top-flight league so it wouldn't be the same to say if Mexico players stay in Liga MX, why can't US players stay in MLS. It's just not the same type of competition.

Germany - http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro-finals/season=2016/teams/team=47/squad/index.html

Italy - http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro-finals/season=2016/teams/team=66/squad/index.html

France(Gignac plays in Liga MX) - http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro-finals/season=2016/teams/team=43/squad/index.html

Portugal - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portugal_national_football_team#Current_squad

Spain - http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro-finals/season=2016/teams/team=122/squad/index.html

2016 Copa America

Argentina - https://www.mlssoccer.com/copa-america/argentina/roster

Chile - https://www.mlssoccer.com/copa-america/chile/roster

Brazil(Neymar in Olympics) - https://www.mlssoccer.com/copa-america/brazil/roster

Mexico(mainly Mexican league players) - https://www.mlssoccer.com/copa-america/mexico/roster

Uruguay - https://www.mlssoccer.com/copa-america/uruguay/roster

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:what about Bobby Wood? he's homegrown too?

It took him while to break into a top-German squad. He started in 2010 under a 3rd flight German team and essentially went unused for 4 years before he broke into one team, and now plays for Hamburg. The players we can find that are willing to do that for THEMSELVES! Not their country, will bring back a lot of grit, experience, hunger, and soccer IQ that a MLS player quite frankly can't replicate.