How Good is A Score of 31 on the ACT?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Not sure where you got blah grades from my comment that DD is a very strong student at a competitive school. Reading comprehension is lacking apparently so you wouldn't get a very high score on the ACT sadly.

LSAT, actually. BOOM! Choice of HYS, Chicago, UVA and Michigan law

[Anonymous]

Many do not like UVA, even instate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many do not like UVA, even instate.

Very good point. I will just go to Harvard instead!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many do not like UVA, even instate.

+1 Not good enough for TJ kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

This is how (from Harvard's FA website):

The Basics
•Close to 60% of our undergraduates receive Harvard Scholarship.
•20% of our parents have total incomes less than $65,000 and are not expected to contribute.
•Families with incomes between $65,000 and $150,000 will contribute from 0-10% of their income, and those with incomes above $150,000 will be asked to pay proportionately more than 10%, based on their individual circumstances. Families at all income levels who have significant assets will continue to pay more than those in less fortunate circumstances.
•Two-thirds of students work during the academic year.

So the family making $170k actually contributes something like $20k, meaning the scholarship dollar you reference (it is actually a grant) is more like $50k and not $43k. So, the facts support the previous poster, despite your incredulity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

With the sliding scale tuition, families up to $180,000 will pay 10% of their income. So, at 170K, all in all we paid $17K/year at Harvard. Cheaper than UVA! And how can you say that he WON'T receive a $43,000 scholarship? He DID, actually. More than $43K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

This is how (from Harvard's FA website):

The Basics
•Close to 60% of our undergraduates receive Harvard Scholarship.
•20% of our parents have total incomes less than $65,000 and are not expected to contribute.
•Families with incomes between $65,000 and $150,000 will contribute from 0-10% of their income, and those with incomes above $150,000 will be asked to pay proportionately more than 10%, based on their individual circumstances. Families at all income levels who have significant assets will continue to pay more than those in less fortunate circumstances.
•Two-thirds of students work during the academic year.

So the family making $170k actually contributes something like $20k, meaning the scholarship dollar you reference (it is actually a grant) is more like $50k and not $43k. So, the facts support the previous poster, despite your incredulity.

+1 Harvard/Ivies have FANTASTIC aid. For people making under $200K year, which is the vast majority of people in this country, the cost is quite reasonable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

With the sliding scale tuition, families up to $180,000 will pay 10% of their income. So, at 170K, all in all we paid $17K/year at Harvard. Cheaper than UVA! And how can you say that he WON'T receive a $43,000 scholarship? He DID, actually. More than $43K.

technically speaking, it's not a scholarship. it's a FA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

With the sliding scale tuition, families up to $180,000 will pay 10% of their income. So, at 170K, all in all we paid $17K/year at Harvard. Cheaper than UVA! And how can you say that he WON'T receive a $43,000 scholarship? He DID, actually. More than $43K.

technically speaking, it's not a scholarship. it's a FA.

True. The incredulous PP used the word scholarship, so I did as well. But yeah, Ivies don't technically give scholarships.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

The thing to remember is that if your EFC is say, $20,000, it will be $20,000 whether you're at a school that costs $20,000 or a school that costs $70,000. For schools that meet 100% of need, that means you will pay $20K even if the list price is $60K.

Our HHI is $150K (which I do not consider middle class), and our EFC came back at $26,000. Now, we don't know if our child will be accepted to the private colleges he applied to. However, because we did our research and he only applied to private colleges that meet 100% of demonstrated need, this means that we will not pay more than $26K at any of these schools. At some schools, like Harvard, you are only expected to contribute 0-10% of your income up to a certain point, so we'd only be paying in the $15K range for Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Dah....you have to get INTO the Ivies first. The PP on this thread make it clear that 31 on the ACT is a no go for the Ivies. Likely so but to those posters who think that 31 can't get a DC into an otherwise top college are really not looking at this realistically.




Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

This is how (from Harvard's FA website):

The Basics
•Close to 60% of our undergraduates receive Harvard Scholarship.
•20% of our parents have total incomes less than $65,000 and are not expected to contribute.
•Families with incomes between $65,000 and $150,000 will contribute from 0-10% of their income, and those with incomes above $150,000 will be asked to pay proportionately more than 10%, based on their individual circumstances. Families at all income levels who have significant assets will continue to pay more than those in less fortunate circumstances.
•Two-thirds of students work during the academic year.

So the family making $170k actually contributes something like $20k, meaning the scholarship dollar you reference (it is actually a grant) is more like $50k and not $43k. So, the facts support the previous poster, despite your incredulity.

+1 Harvard/Ivies have FANTASTIC aid. For people making under $200K year, which is the vast majority of people in this country, the cost is quite reasonable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

This is how (from Harvard's FA website):

The Basics
•Close to 60% of our undergraduates receive Harvard Scholarship.
•20% of our parents have total incomes less than $65,000 and are not expected to contribute.
•Families with incomes between $65,000 and $150,000 will contribute from 0-10% of their income, and those with incomes above $150,000 will be asked to pay proportionately more than 10%, based on their individual circumstances. Families at all income levels who have significant assets will continue to pay more than those in less fortunate circumstances.
•Two-thirds of students work during the academic year.

So the family making $170k actually contributes something like $20k, meaning the scholarship dollar you reference (it is actually a grant) is more like $50k and not $43k. So, the facts support the previous poster, despite your incredulity.



Seriously, how many families on this thread make between $65K and $150K?

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous]Many do not like UVA, even instate.



BWAHHAHAHAHA. Says the mother whose kid didn't get in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As others have said, it depends on the school. Not much merit $$ for a 31. More importantly, did your child prep for this test? If not, lots of prep and practice definitely can increase scores.

This is absolute bull. My child, with a 29, got merit at every single private school she applied to and one of the publics- Marquette, AU, Drexel, Loyola in Chicago, Belmont, and Miami of Ohio.

If you are fixated on the top 50 schools or whatever there's not much merit, but it is so so so so false that there is not much merit for a 31 on the ACT.

Thank you for posting this! I've heard that from many others too. People like to state things on this forum as though they are the absolute expert on the subject and they are often completely wrong. My DD has not gotten her scores back yet for the ACT and she will likely take it twice but I know that if she ends up with a 29 she will be competitive for merit money at good places. She is a very strong student at a competitive school and I know for a fact, based on common data set, that many schools "consider" test scores but say that rigor and essay (or other factors) are "very important". Not everyone is meant to take multiple choice tests, in fact for the rest of their lives they will be asked to contribute much more to their environments than filling out a bunch of bubbles on a sheet. Many great schools know that and can't wait to get these kids on their campus.

Oh, honey, i wish that were true, but you are in a seller's market. Admissions doesn't give a damn about your kid unless your child possesses something they want - an athelete, a URM statistic, a famous name, a super wealthy parent, a legacy that matters, extraordinary feats of strength, amazing musician, or already published in some field - your child is just a bunch of numbers to them. That's why there are no interviews for most schools. It's all about GPA/rigor/ACT score/SAT II subject matter test scores/and rank in class. That's why after the EA classes are announced you see schools bragging that the EA class, alone, like this: "The average ACT score of the admitted pool is 33. For SAT, the average score of those admitted is 1453 out of 1600 (2166 out of 2400). The admitted students have taken an average of more than 10 college-level courses and 96 percent have taken an Advanced Placement calculus course." Every school now does this because they are ALL fighting to climb a rank on the U.S. News & World Report rankings. And if you think your kid with middling scores will get in to a selective university, think again because there are now millions of extremely talented international students, mostly from China and India, who will kill to get a slot at an American college or University. Until it stops being a seller's market (and I don't see any end in sight - the system is broken but I can't tell you how to fix it unless the rankings stops), an American student with blah stats and grades is going to have to throw a lot of applications out there

Overly simplistic and cynical interpretation. The fact of the matter is that there are more white, middle class, public school kids at Harvard today than there were 20 years ago and far more than 50 years ago. Yes, at a school like Harvard the test scores skew very high, but there are plenty of extremely strong colleges with a 31 ACT as the midpoint of the range (UCLA Bucknell, Lehigh, Hamilton, Colgate, SUNY Binghamton, and the list goes on).

'


Not true. And I went to Harvard. Middle class can no longer afford it. There are no merit scholarships. So it's either the rich or the financial aid kids and they don't want white, they want diversity and international studients.

What?! We make $170K, which is hardly middle class, and Harvard was cheaper than state schools for us. For 90% of the country, Harvard, and most other top 20 schools, is cheaper than state schools.

+1, there is a lot of misinformation out there about these schools.

How is Harvard (@70,000) better than your instate school (UVA - 10-11,000 for tuition, tack room and board and books, etc. $28,000. Unless DC gets a annual $43,000 scholarship (which he won't) how can you say that?

The thing to remember is that if your EFC is say, $20,000, it will be $20,000 whether you're at a school that costs $20,000 or a school that costs $70,000. For schools that meet 100% of need, that means you will pay $20K even if the list price is $60K.

Our HHI is $150K (which I do not consider middle class), and our EFC came back at $26,000. Now, we don't know if our child will be accepted to the private colleges he applied to. However, because we did our research and he only applied to private colleges that meet 100% of demonstrated need, this means that we will not pay more than $26K at any of these schools. At some schools, like Harvard, you are only expected to contribute 0-10% of your income up to a certain point, s[b]o we'd only be paying in the $15K range for Harvard.




but the remainder still must be made up - and that is in the form of the package the college sends you. You the parent may be paying only $15K,but you never escape the $70K price tag. They will come back at you with a package of student loans (federal), and work study programs. You're not completely off the hook. And in the case of Princeton, they say debt free but they mean debt free to the school. The package will contain grants from the school, work-study, student loans from Princeton and student loans from the feds.