Has anyone accepted a spot at a highly coveted DC Charter and then later been disappointed?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are at Yu Ying that does not have prek3. For prek4, 19:3. For k, 17:3. Very happy.

That is great, but obviously the exception. And you are all getting hung up on the issue of ratios and ignoring completely the real basis of my original arguments. I'm the only one concerned about these issues? I don't think so, based on some of the earlier posts about kids being labeled as "problems" or "G&T" that I was responding to. This stuff goes on all the time - just go peruse the SN board to see all the parents whose preschoolers have IEPs. Preschoolers develop at wildly different rates, and I don't think the system is set up to allow for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

Not ours. PS-3 was 19 kids with 3 adults. PK-4 is 18 with 2 adults.

Which school? 1:6 for PS3 is pretty good. Still would want to know what the structure and expectations are though, because again, we're talking a very long day for very small children. If others are having a better experience than we've had, I'm glad. But after seeing it from the inside, I'm still philosophically opposed to the public preschool model, though. If you have no other option for care or the child is coming from an impoverished background, I get it, though I still think ten hours of structure is too much.

Still waiting for you to name the school that has 25 kids in a classroom and 10 hr days...

Lots of schools offer before care starting at 7:30 and after care ending at 6. You do the math. In many areas preschool is 3-4 hours and not every day of the week. It's not intended to be daycare. I have a niece who qualifies for head start in my hometown (because of a developmental delay), and as a public program there it does not run all day. And no, I am not naming the school because I'm not an idiot and I'm not outing myself here. You are certainly free to disagree with me if you wish. But the fact remains the ratios you are all throwing out here are not THAT much better than the ones at my school.

If I'm reading your story right, the problem is that daycare is too expensive in DC? You don't want a full-day program and it's too expensive to keep sending your kid to daycare. Lord, I hear that. This is the downside to DC's competitive preschool for all system. The upside is that, if you are very, very lucky, your kid might be learning Spanish or Chinese or attending some other program that puts early education in most of the country to shame. My friends in other parts of the country can't believe that our kid is learning Mandarin at a free public school. It's not great for every kid, that is for sure.

Yes, you are right. But we're not all that lucky and I'm not willing to keep playing the system for something better. Especially since I'm not convinced that "better" here is even what I want for my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are at Yu Ying that does not have prek3. For prek4, 19:3. For k, 17:3. Very happy.

I should add that my DC has an IEP and is in an inclusive classroom. Most classrooms for preK and K are 18:2. For my SN kid, YY is awesome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you, and the schools, are off base if we are talking about very young children at the preschool level. Trying to diagnose things like ADHD, sensory issues, G&T or anything else at this age is nearly impossible, often wildly inaccurate, and IMO ultimately very damaging for many kids and their parents. These schools expect a room of 25 kids to act like automatons who always follow instructions, participate in every activity, etc etc, which I believe is utterly unrealistic for 3 and 4 year old children. This is why we are taking our child out of the system for PK4, and probably forever. I think we are kidding ourselves as parents and at a policy level when we insist that all-day PK is the right thing for every child. Instead of providing high-quality early childhood care (small class sizes, individual attention, play-based programs), we are forcing kids into factories that, by nature of the large size of the programs, have to insist on a level of structure and behavioral adherence that is beyond the capability of many preschool-aged children. Instead of acknowledging that fact, we are labeling kids with "syndromes" at ever earlier ages. I also firmly believe that many of these schools are insisting that kids get lockstep with the program early so that they will be conditioned to deal with the testing culture of the later grades. NCLB is ruining public education in this country, and since charters have to perform well on the DC-CAS too, it is my belief that no matter how "different" their programs and curricula may be, they are still incentivized to perform on tests, which defeats the purpose of those specialized programs entirely. It's basic cognitive dissonance, and I don't think anyone can objectively argue that this insane system we've developed is truly working well.

I totally agree with you, PP though there are only 18 kids in our Pk class. That's not the point. The point is that it is a lot of structure for a 4 yo, especially an active boy who might do better with more free play and running around time and less time with manipulatively and circle time. But if we stay in DC we don't have much choice because we are not giving up our spot at a highly coveted charter. I'm hoping and thinking that the older grades are better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

DCPS has a 16:2 and 20:2 for pre3 and prek. This is because of the prek for all.

[Anonymous]

Inspired Teaching PS3 has 22:3 so closer to 7 kids for every teacher. My DC's class is rarely all in attendance (as is common with 3s in their first school experience to catch every germ going around), so it's that or better.

As far as 10 hours of school, IT is closer to 6 hours for 3s and 4s, if you choose that. Arrive by 9 am, latest, pick up by 3, earliest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

DCPS has a 16:2 and 20:2 for pre3 and prek. This is because of the prek for all.

Yep, 1:8 or higher, just like our school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Inspired Teaching PS3 has 22:3 so closer to 7 kids for every teacher. My DC's class is rarely all in attendance (as is common with 3s in their first school experience to catch every germ going around), so it's that or better.

As far as 10 hours of school, IT is closer to 6 hours for 3s and 4s, if you choose that. Arrive by 9 am, latest, pick up by 3, earliest.

Right - if you choose that, which most don't, because they can't. We were fortunate that I could change my schedule so that my child is only there from are only 8-4:15, but that is still a long day for an active preschool boy. The whole thing has left me wondering how we can structure this better as a society, and how the hell our parents managed. In our case, my mother and MIL both stayed home while we were young. Not an option for us even if we wanted to, and certainly not with the COL here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are at Yu Ying that does not have prek3. For prek4, 19:3. For k, 17:3. Very happy.

That is great, but obviously the exception. And you are all getting hung up on the issue of ratios and ignoring completely the real basis of my original arguments. I'm the only one concerned about these issues? I don't think so, based on some of the earlier posts about kids being labeled as "problems" or "G&T" that I was responding to. This stuff goes on all the time - just go peruse the SN board to see all the parents whose preschoolers have IEPs. Preschoolers develop at wildly different rates, and I don't think the system is set up to allow for that.

If you stay around on the SN board, you'll find most people even in DC are pretty happy with Childfind and early intervention services. So much so that it all seems downhill from there once they have to rely on schools as the LEA. Preschoolers who have IEPs need them and free services and supports which an IEP provides are not given out willy-nilly or on a whim. IEPs are hard to get, costs the school system money and certainly the fact that "preschoolers develope at wildly different rates" are taken into account before an IEP is offered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

Not ours. PS-3 was 19 kids with 3 adults. PK-4 is 18 with 2 adults.

Which school? 1:6 for PS3 is pretty good. Still would want to know what the structure and expectations are though, because again, we're talking a very long day for very small children. If others are having a better experience than we've had, I'm glad. But after seeing it from the inside, I'm still philosophically opposed to the public preschool model, though. If you have no other option for care or the child is coming from an impoverished background, I get it, though I still think ten hours of structure is too much.

Well, good for you. Most of us don't have the option to keep our very small children home all day with a single caregiver or send them to a playgroup for a short time period. The system is also not structured so that you can opt out of PS and PK because you will be literally shut out of nearly everything by K. So you can talk a great game about unstructured time for preschoolers, but it's not feasible for the vast majority of parents on this board, who are trying to take advantage of public schools in DC. We try to keep our DC home from school one day a week to play with grandma and have a nice long nap, but that wouldn't work for most families, and it certainly won't work once we move to a more structured program.

Do you really keep your kid home once a week? You can't really think that is healthy, can you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

Not ours. PS-3 was 19 kids with 3 adults. PK-4 is 18 with 2 adults.

Which school? 1:6 for PS3 is pretty good. Still would want to know what the structure and expectations are though, because again, we're talking a very long day for very small children. If others are having a better experience than we've had, I'm glad. But after seeing it from the inside, I'm still philosophically opposed to the public preschool model, though. If you have no other option for care or the child is coming from an impoverished background, I get it, though I still think ten hours of structure is too much.

Well, good for you. Most of us don't have the option to keep our very small children home all day with a single caregiver or send them to a playgroup for a short time period. The system is also not structured so that you can opt out of PS and PK because you will be literally shut out of nearly everything by K. So you can talk a great game about unstructured time for preschoolers, but it's not feasible for the vast majority of parents on this board, who are trying to take advantage of public schools in DC. We try to keep our DC home from school one day a week to play with grandma and have a nice long nap, but that wouldn't work for most families, and it certainly won't work once we move to a more structured program.

Do you really keep your kid home once a week? You can't really think that is healthy, can you?

Of course I do. Why on earth wouldn't it be healthy? The school is fine with it, and my child has met or exceeded all of the standards, such as they are, for PS-3. What's the problem?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Of course I do. Why on earth wouldn't it be healthy? The school is fine with it, and my child has met or exceeded all of the standards, such as they are, for PS-3. What's the problem?

I'm surprised your school allows you to do this. Absenteeism rules are pretty clear for DCPS, and I don't see anywhere that there is any exception for PS3. Since PS3 is not guaranteed, your child should have been expelled by now if the school were following the rules.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are at Yu Ying that does not have prek3. For prek4, 19:3. For k, 17:3. Very happy.

That is great, but obviously the exception. And you are all getting hung up on the issue of ratios and ignoring completely the real basis of my original arguments. I'm the only one concerned about these issues? I don't think so, based on some of the earlier posts about kids being labeled as "problems" or "G&T" that I was responding to. This stuff goes on all the time - just go peruse the SN board to see all the parents whose preschoolers have IEPs. Preschoolers develop at wildly different rates, and I don't think the system is set up to allow for that.

If you stay around on the SN board, you'll find most people even in DC are pretty happy with Childfind and early intervention services. So much so that it all seems downhill from there once they have to rely on schools as the LEA. Preschoolers who have IEPs need them and free services and supports which an IEP provides are not given out willy-nilly or on a whim. IEPs are hard to get, costs the school system money and certainly the fact that "preschoolers develope at wildly different rates" are taken into account before an IEP is offered.

Well, in our case, I think the situation has been greatly overblown and that the school has been too inflexible in the classroom I.e. insisting on participation in every activity, free play that isn't free (the kids are assigned to centers in groups), etc. I used to work in a school and even at kindergarten, many kids have trouble staying on task, have off days where they don't want to participate and the like. I am of the opinion that none of this warrants "intervention.". It warrants teachers who can work with each child instead of enforcing rules, regulations, schedules, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^25 kids in a classroom for prek3/prek4 - never heard of a class that big. Which school was this?

Seriously? This is common in DCPS and charters.

Not ours. PS-3 was 19 kids with 3 adults. PK-4 is 18 with 2 adults.

Which school? 1:6 for PS3 is pretty good. Still would want to know what the structure and expectations are though, because again, we're talking a very long day for very small children. If others are having a better experience than we've had, I'm glad. But after seeing it from the inside, I'm still philosophically opposed to the public preschool model, though. If you have no other option for care or the child is coming from an impoverished background, I get it, though I still think ten hours of structure is too much.

Well, good for you. Most of us don't have the option to keep our very small children home all day with a single caregiver or send them to a playgroup for a short time period. The system is also not structured so that you can opt out of PS and PK because you will be literally shut out of nearly everything by K. So you can talk a great game about unstructured time for preschoolers, but it's not feasible for the vast majority of parents on this board, who are trying to take advantage of public schools in DC. We try to keep our DC home from school one day a week to play with grandma and have a nice long nap, but that wouldn't work for most families, and it certainly won't work once we move to a more structured program.

Do you really keep your kid home once a week? You can't really think that is healthy, can you?

I have a friend whose 3 yo only goes half days to a DCPS. More schools should be this flexible. I think it's a great example of serving the child instead of the system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Of course I do. Why on earth wouldn't it be healthy? The school is fine with it, and my child has met or exceeded all of the standards, such as they are, for PS-3. What's the problem?

I'm surprised your school allows you to do this. Absenteeism rules are pretty clear for DCPS, and I don't see anywhere that there is any exception for PS3. Since PS3 is not guaranteed, your child should have been expelled by now if the school were following the rules.

Aaaaand....attitudes like this are why the system doesn't serve kids. Shouldn't we all demand better options for our money? We are being taxed to death to pay for these programs. PS is not mandatory, and I see no reason why more flexibility at the service of the children should be an issue.