When take AP Calculus? (11th or 12th grade)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Look, families on here are not shooting for UDC like some kids in DC. They are educated and shooting for competitive colleges. So no it is not fine to compare to those kids.

You should be shooting for and taking rigorous and advanced courses because your kid hs the aptitude for it and because yes your kid will be competing against the kids in the burbs for the top 20 or 50 schools or whatever.

But my kid is already in at a top 20 school despite not taking calculus until senior year.

Then your kid must have had other impressive things to recommend them admission because it wasn’t the math that got them in.

Also is your kid a STEM major?

DP. OP didn't ask about stem majors. They asked when a student should aim to take calculus. People are very reasonably noting that 11th or 12th grade works, depending on the kid.

The idea that kids taking calc in 12th can't possibly be serious students with strong college prospects is detached from reality.

No one said above about serious kids but seeing Cal taken in 12th is not impressive at all when looking at courses when applying for top schools. That is what people are saying. It’s the floor and basic.

No OP did not ask about STEM majors but it is important to note that most STEM majors at top 20 schools have taken Cal earlier than 12th.

And they are wrong. For many kids—especially non-STEM kids, who do exist!—it’s the right level and will be more than sufficient to get into top schools.

And even for STEM kids! I know of a current Ivy student from DCPS majoring in math who took BC in 12th.

And AB in 11th!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

I'm looking at what I believe to be the most recent national data set that includes the percent of students taking calculus. It doesn't show that. Where are you getting your data?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

I'm looking at what I believe to be the most recent national data set that includes the percent of students taking calculus. It doesn't show that. Where are you getting your data?

(it's by school)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

I'm looking at what I believe to be the most recent national data set that includes the percent of students taking calculus. It doesn't show that. Where are you getting your data?

Lol.

National level!?! That’s in the toilet.

You should hear what international families here say about public school national averages and levels of math and literacy. It corresponds to a 5th grade skill set for 12th graders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

I'm looking at what I believe to be the most recent national data set that includes the percent of students taking calculus. It doesn't show that. Where are you getting your data?

Lol.

National level!?! That’s in the toilet.

You should hear what international families here say about public school national averages and levels of math and literacy. It corresponds to a 5th grade skill set for 12th graders.

It seems like you made up numbers.

[Anonymous]

The only numbers relevant here are what percentage of the student body of top high schools take AP calculus what grade year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:11 or 12, does not matter. Whatever works for your kid.

I gather maybe it matters in the suburbs, where everyone is desperately competing for limited seats at the same flagship at the same discounted in-state price. But in DC proper, kids apply to and attend a much wider range of colleges, so there’s a lot less pressure to conform. Just do what works for you.

Given the bull market the last 20 years everyone's 529s were fully funded for college by the time a kid was 12 yo. So no, that's not it. It's proving you can learn calculus and test well on it. Personally I'd want it done junior year and do more electives senior year. Plus don't kids want all the weighted 5.0 or 4.75 A-s they can get before Fall semester senior year clocks in for rank?

I would say those considerations go to “what works for you.” What I object to is the hysterical insistence that it’s the literal end of the world if your child does not take calc by junior year. It’s not.

No one has said that here except you. You seem fixated.

40% of high school grads in high SES areas take AP Calculus during or before 11th grade. 75% take it during or before 12th grade.

Do whatever you want with those facts.
Heck even call your HS guidance counselor and confirm it, and the AB / BC breakdowns if you really want some firepower.

I'm looking at what I believe to be the most recent national data set that includes the percent of students taking calculus. It doesn't show that. Where are you getting your data?

Hope you can squeeze in a statistics class some day. Weave it in with a facts vs opinion current events class too. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only numbers relevant here are what percentage of the student body of top high schools take AP calculus what grade year.

The claim was not "top high schools", it was about high SES areas. There are no comprehensive high schools in Montgomery or Fairfax with those numbers besides TJ (where it's much higher) in the most recent national data set, which is the only way anyone could make claims about high SES areas in general. You never saw any numbers on this. You made them up, and you are now changing the claim because you made it up.

[Anonymous]

Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

Respectfully, I don’t think parents have any obligation to harm their own children by stopping them from applying to top schools just because you think those students shouldn’t be able to get into those schools. Even if that would help to change the status quo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

Respectfully, I don’t think parents have any obligation to harm their own children by stopping them from applying to top schools just because you think those students shouldn’t be able to get into those schools. Even if that would help to change the status quo.

No one said kids in DCPS should not apply to top schools. But it is common knowledge that these kids from less rigorous curriculum struggle against peers who are bettered prepared because they had opportunities for more advanced classes. But the goal of education is not college admissions.

It is to gain knowledge, be challenged, and strive for kids to reach their full potential. Not giving kids the resources, tools, and classes for this is basically keeping them from that goal. You are basically trying to narrow the achievement gap by bringing the top down instead of bringing the bottom up. The kids do not have the same opportunities for knowledge acquisition and advancement. It is not their fault and it is not fair. Shouldn’t education meet the needs of all kids instead of focusing just on the bottom?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

Respectfully, I don’t think parents have any obligation to harm their own children by stopping them from applying to top schools just because you think those students shouldn’t be able to get into those schools. Even if that would help to change the status quo.

No one said kids in DCPS should not apply to top schools. But it is common knowledge that these kids from less rigorous curriculum struggle against peers who are bettered prepared because they had opportunities for more advanced classes. But the goal of education is not college admissions.

It is to gain knowledge, be challenged, and strive for kids to reach their full potential. Not giving kids the resources, tools, and classes for this is basically keeping them from that goal. You are basically trying to narrow the achievement gap by bringing the top down instead of bringing the bottom up. The kids do not have the same opportunities for knowledge acquisition and advancement. It is not their fault and it is not fair. Shouldn’t education meet the needs of all kids instead of focusing just on the bottom?

Where is this "common knowledge"? That term is one used by people who know they are making things up.

I graduated from one of the most elite private boarding HS in the country. I attended an elite university (very old, very crimson). I had an advantage in college...for perhaps one semester. Then every kid who didn't have the benefit of my privileged education or advanced tracking got to Cambridge and caught up.

Bolded is nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

I assume the person who boldly lied about the numbers cared about what the numbers were.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who cares what the numbers are, What parents care about is that there is sufficient and challenging teaching in math for their kids. The goal is not the floor but the ceiling - something for kids to strive and reach their full potential with math. It is not happening for so many kids in this town.

Yes OP, your kid should take AP Cal in 11th if your kid can handle it. Then take the next level math course. Heck, your kid should take it in 10th even if your kid can handle it. And it should be offered and there should be a track leading up to this.

Families shouldn’t have to play a lottery to get into a school just for adequate math instruction and challenge. It should be offered to all,

Families here trying to justify and give a pass for not taking Cal in high school or not taking it earlier for kids who can handle advanced work are not the solution but part of the problem and why we are left with crumbs in math offerrings that we have in DCPS. Everyone should be advocating for stronger and more advanced math programming, not justifying the poor status quo.

Respectfully, I don’t think parents have any obligation to harm their own children by stopping them from applying to top schools just because you think those students shouldn’t be able to get into those schools. Even if that would help to change the status quo.

No one said kids in DCPS should not apply to top schools. But it is common knowledge that these kids from less rigorous curriculum struggle against peers who are bettered prepared because they had opportunities for more advanced classes. But the goal of education is not college admissions.

It is to gain knowledge, be challenged, and strive for kids to reach their full potential. Not giving kids the resources, tools, and classes for this is basically keeping them from that goal. You are basically trying to narrow the achievement gap by bringing the top down instead of bringing the bottom up. The kids do not have the same opportunities for knowledge acquisition and advancement. It is not their fault and it is not fair. Shouldn’t education meet the needs of all kids instead of focusing just on the bottom?

Where is this "common knowledge"? That term is one used by people who know they are making things up.

I graduated from one of the most elite private boarding HS in the country. I attended an elite university (very old, very crimson). I had an advantage in college...for perhaps one semester. Then every kid who didn't have the benefit of my privileged education or advanced tracking got to Cambridge and caught up.

Bolded is nonsense.

Correct.

Research suggests that any academic advantage held by private school students generally narrows by the end of their freshman year and often disappears entirely by their junior and senior years.