DCPS (Upper NW) vs MCPS, where to go?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m one of the PPs.

I suspect that DCPS and MCPS are comparable at the ES level, with slight advantage to DCPS because of the immersion programs, the after school enrichments, and the ability of PTAs to fundraise for second teachers in classrooms and other support staff.

After that, it seems that aside from a few MS and a few HS in DC that are well known here, MCPS schools in Bethesda and Potomac are stronger.

I don’t think anyone here is arguing DC is better all the way through, unless (maybe) you do immersion all the way through or Walls/Banneker/Basis.

I am one the PPs that wrote about my experience with Key School, which is an elementary school. My point was that even at the elementary level at a highly regarded elementary school, the quality of DCPS resources and education is not as good.

Should have gone to Janney!

[Anonymous]

PP here. Thank you for this insights- this actually helps a lot. We have a much better idea where to go. Definitely not DCPS. Maybe MCPS, likely Fairfax too.

Anonymous wrote:I am surprised at all the posts saying DCPS is just as good as MCPS. We are also Asian and were at Key for a few years. Key is considered to be a very good DCPS elementary so we didn’t really question it. But as our kid got older, we started getting pretty unhappy with the quality of their work and teaching, and were not at all inspired by the principal so we moved to MCPS. No public school is perfect but the difference is night and day. The music teacher at Key was terrible. He basically gave the kids a coloring sheet with a musical instrument on it, refused to do singing with the lower elementary schools, and gave them recorders but didn’t teach them how to play it. In MCPS, they get real music instruction on instruments. My kids still talk about how no one except for him was allowed to touch the musical instruments. The art teacher was sweet but there was no art studio. She would hold lessons in their classrooms so the only supplies they had to work with were pencils and coloring pencils / crayons. In MCPS, they have so many different materials and real art instruction. The gym teacher at Key would put out sports equipment with no real instruction. Their current gym teacher puts so much thought into their lessons— there’s an actual gym curriculum. The kids love him. Looking back, Key was such a joke and I’m still upset about that level of incompetence from so many teachers. Some of the subject specific teachers were good but the class sizes started to get pretty big by the time we left. Also, the teacher communication is so much better now. At Key, we never knew when the kids were going to have a test and no study guides were sent home. The teacher even told me they didn’t want the kids to study at home. Now, we get study guides and more comprehensive updates so we better understand the work they’re doing.
My kids also now appreciate being around more Asian kids. I don’t think I (or they) realized how different they felt at Key and hadn’t accounted for the importance of this in their experience. We are overall much happier in MCPS but these things that I reference may not be as important to you. I just wanted to give you my perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP here. Thank you for this insights- this actually helps a lot. We have a much better idea where to go. Definitely not DCPS. Maybe MCPS, likely Fairfax too.

Anonymous wrote:I am surprised at all the posts saying DCPS is just as good as MCPS. We are also Asian and were at Key for a few years. Key is considered to be a very good DCPS elementary so we didn’t really question it. But as our kid got older, we started getting pretty unhappy with the quality of their work and teaching, and were not at all inspired by the principal so we moved to MCPS. No public school is perfect but the difference is night and day. The music teacher at Key was terrible. He basically gave the kids a coloring sheet with a musical instrument on it, refused to do singing with the lower elementary schools, and gave them recorders but didn’t teach them how to play it. In MCPS, they get real music instruction on instruments. My kids still talk about how no one except for him was allowed to touch the musical instruments. The art teacher was sweet but there was no art studio. She would hold lessons in their classrooms so the only supplies they had to work with were pencils and coloring pencils / crayons. In MCPS, they have so many different materials and real art instruction. The gym teacher at Key would put out sports equipment with no real instruction. Their current gym teacher puts so much thought into their lessons— there’s an actual gym curriculum. The kids love him. Looking back, Key was such a joke and I’m still upset about that level of incompetence from so many teachers. Some of the subject specific teachers were good but the class sizes started to get pretty big by the time we left. Also, the teacher communication is so much better now. At Key, we never knew when the kids were going to have a test and no study guides were sent home. The teacher even told me they didn’t want the kids to study at home. Now, we get study guides and more comprehensive updates so we better understand the work they’re doing.
My kids also now appreciate being around more Asian kids. I don’t think I (or they) realized how different they felt at Key and hadn’t accounted for the importance of this in their experience. We are overall much happier in MCPS but these things that I reference may not be as important to you. I just wanted to give you my perspective.

Glad it helped! We knew 2 families who felt similarly at Key. They moved to McLean and are very happy there if you want to consider there as well.

[Anonymous]

We are thinking of falls church zoned to McLean. McLean itself gets too expensive

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here. Thank you for this insights- this actually helps a lot. We have a much better idea where to go. Definitely not DCPS. Maybe MCPS, likely Fairfax too.

Anonymous wrote:I am surprised at all the posts saying DCPS is just as good as MCPS. We are also Asian and were at Key for a few years. Key is considered to be a very good DCPS elementary so we didn’t really question it. But as our kid got older, we started getting pretty unhappy with the quality of their work and teaching, and were not at all inspired by the principal so we moved to MCPS. No public school is perfect but the difference is night and day. The music teacher at Key was terrible. He basically gave the kids a coloring sheet with a musical instrument on it, refused to do singing with the lower elementary schools, and gave them recorders but didn’t teach them how to play it. In MCPS, they get real music instruction on instruments. My kids still talk about how no one except for him was allowed to touch the musical instruments. The art teacher was sweet but there was no art studio. She would hold lessons in their classrooms so the only supplies they had to work with were pencils and coloring pencils / crayons. In MCPS, they have so many different materials and real art instruction. The gym teacher at Key would put out sports equipment with no real instruction. Their current gym teacher puts so much thought into their lessons— there’s an actual gym curriculum. The kids love him. Looking back, Key was such a joke and I’m still upset about that level of incompetence from so many teachers. Some of the subject specific teachers were good but the class sizes started to get pretty big by the time we left. Also, the teacher communication is so much better now. At Key, we never knew when the kids were going to have a test and no study guides were sent home. The teacher even told me they didn’t want the kids to study at home. Now, we get study guides and more comprehensive updates so we better understand the work they’re doing.
My kids also now appreciate being around more Asian kids. I don’t think I (or they) realized how different they felt at Key and hadn’t accounted for the importance of this in their experience. We are overall much happier in MCPS but these things that I reference may not be as important to you. I just wanted to give you my perspective.

Glad it helped! We knew 2 families who felt similarly at Key. They moved to McLean and are very happy there if you want to consider there as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
We are thinking of falls church zoned to McLean. McLean itself gets too expensive

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here. Thank you for this insights- this actually helps a lot. We have a much better idea where to go. Definitely not DCPS. Maybe MCPS, likely Fairfax too.

Anonymous wrote:I am surprised at all the posts saying DCPS is just as good as MCPS. We are also Asian and were at Key for a few years. Key is considered to be a very good DCPS elementary so we didn’t really question it. But as our kid got older, we started getting pretty unhappy with the quality of their work and teaching, and were not at all inspired by the principal so we moved to MCPS. No public school is perfect but the difference is night and day. The music teacher at Key was terrible. He basically gave the kids a coloring sheet with a musical instrument on it, refused to do singing with the lower elementary schools, and gave them recorders but didn’t teach them how to play it. In MCPS, they get real music instruction on instruments. My kids still talk about how no one except for him was allowed to touch the musical instruments. The art teacher was sweet but there was no art studio. She would hold lessons in their classrooms so the only supplies they had to work with were pencils and coloring pencils / crayons. In MCPS, they have so many different materials and real art instruction. The gym teacher at Key would put out sports equipment with no real instruction. Their current gym teacher puts so much thought into their lessons— there’s an actual gym curriculum. The kids love him. Looking back, Key was such a joke and I’m still upset about that level of incompetence from so many teachers. Some of the subject specific teachers were good but the class sizes started to get pretty big by the time we left. Also, the teacher communication is so much better now. At Key, we never knew when the kids were going to have a test and no study guides were sent home. The teacher even told me they didn’t want the kids to study at home. Now, we get study guides and more comprehensive updates so we better understand the work they’re doing.
My kids also now appreciate being around more Asian kids. I don’t think I (or they) realized how different they felt at Key and hadn’t accounted for the importance of this in their experience. We are overall much happier in MCPS but these things that I reference may not be as important to you. I just wanted to give you my perspective.

Glad it helped! We knew 2 families who felt similarly at Key. They moved to McLean and are very happy there if you want to consider there as well.

I have friends in McLean whose kids went to Langely. Really good school, great offering and good cohort of high performing kids.

Both kids did great in college and well prepared. 3rd kid starting in fall.

VA also has some great in state schools and better selection and options IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard some about what MCPS doing (reginal programing ?)and not sure how to interpret it

Anonymous wrote:Both are pretty good! Are you spending time on the MCPS board? Looks like they are rolling back advanced math and ELA options. I don't know the details but worth looking into.

This thread is illuminating:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1324771.page

I'm also an Asian person and we have been really happy with DCPS elementary and then BASIS for middle and high

+1. If you want to stay in DC and don't want to pay for private, your best option is BASIS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard some about what MCPS doing (reginal programing ?)and not sure how to interpret it

Anonymous wrote:Both are pretty good! Are you spending time on the MCPS board? Looks like they are rolling back advanced math and ELA options. I don't know the details but worth looking into.

This thread is illuminating:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1324771.page

I'm also an Asian person and we have been really happy with DCPS elementary and then BASIS for middle and high

+1. If you want to stay in DC and don't want to pay for private, your best option is BASIS.

Asian mom here, we looked at Basis and IMO DCI was better option. Lots of tracking and able to met the needs of high performing kids, more expansive curriculum with more options, lots of electives, and best represent your typical suburban school in terms of good facilities and lots of sports, clubs.

Best chance if you are in a feeder but you can still get in if not.

And if it matters, a number of Asian and mixed Asian kids at the school. I would estimate 8-10%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The smaller NW DCPS elementaries feel like privates: small grade sizes, two teachers per class in K, beautiful facilities, and more varied after-school enrichment offerings than MCPS ES.

There is more latitude in DC for PTAs to fund extra staff than in MCPS, where there is no allowance for it. PTAs also seem more active in DC, by percentage of parents participating in them and funds raised per capita.

Some NW DCPS also teach a foreign language once a week during the core school day. (DC has many immersion schools, too, if you want to go that route).

Also, many MCPS don’t allow parent tours; it’s up to the principal. I was only able to tour two Bethesda publics, one Silver Spring, and one Chevy Chase public school. The MCPS schools I toured wouldn’t let us observe a class (with the exception of Somerset, whose parent guide let us pop into two classes for a few minutes) and wouldn’t allow us to come by during recess, when student—staff ratio is lowest / chaos level is highest.

DCPS, on the other hand, provides so much transparency. I visited nearly every NW school, some multiple times, and it made me feel more comfortable with DCPS as a whole. I was able to take pre-scheduled and one-off tours. Everyone was so friendly in administration! The front office staff just seem happier in DC.

I also like that DC schools are largely walkable. In MCPS, many students bus to school. I know many kids enjoy the bus, but we want to sort of “root” ourselves in a walkable school community.

Finally, I liked how diverse the parents on the tour were, by nationality and race in DC. In the Bethesda and Chevy Chase elementaries, it was almost universally white, American parents (many born in Maryland) on the tours — maybe 80-90% of the parents fit that description. We were looking for more international family community.

Your observations are bizarre and inaccurate. MCPS publishes data on the demographics of all of its elementary schools--Bethesda Elementary school is 60% non-white. Chevy Chase Elementary School is 50% non-white. There are several other elementary schools in the BCC cluster but none of them are "universally white. And there are walkable parts of Bethesda and Chevy Chase--you just need to do your research.

PP said on the tour not at the school!

Did she do the tour in Idaho?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was given tours at all the Bethesda elementary schools I was interested in during my house hunting last year .. so I’m not sure what OP is talking about.

Bethesda elementary schools may give tours because they are catering to parents also considering private school but most MCPS elementary schools won’t give tours. Either you live in-bounds and you can enroll and sign up for kindergarten orientation or you don’t and you can’t. At least that’s how it was back in 2014. I’m not aware of my kids’ Kensington area ES ever having given a tour. They don’t have to and they mostly choose not to. Bethesda is a bit of an exception. I think some Bethesda MS and HS may even allow “shadow days” for kids in private school which is another private school thing most MCPS schools don’t do. None of the kids going from their assigned MS to their assigned HS get a “shadow day.”

That’s not true. I did tours of ES in Potomac and Rockville at well. Just because you think something doesn’t occur in your single Kensington elementary school doesn’t make it so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We are thinking of falls church zoned to McLean. McLean itself gets too expensive

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here. Thank you for this insights- this actually helps a lot. We have a much better idea where to go. Definitely not DCPS. Maybe MCPS, likely Fairfax too.

Anonymous wrote:I am surprised at all the posts saying DCPS is just as good as MCPS. We are also Asian and were at Key for a few years. Key is considered to be a very good DCPS elementary so we didn’t really question it. But as our kid got older, we started getting pretty unhappy with the quality of their work and teaching, and were not at all inspired by the principal so we moved to MCPS. No public school is perfect but the difference is night and day. The music teacher at Key was terrible. He basically gave the kids a coloring sheet with a musical instrument on it, refused to do singing with the lower elementary schools, and gave them recorders but didn’t teach them how to play it. In MCPS, they get real music instruction on instruments. My kids still talk about how no one except for him was allowed to touch the musical instruments. The art teacher was sweet but there was no art studio. She would hold lessons in their classrooms so the only supplies they had to work with were pencils and coloring pencils / crayons. In MCPS, they have so many different materials and real art instruction. The gym teacher at Key would put out sports equipment with no real instruction. Their current gym teacher puts so much thought into their lessons— there’s an actual gym curriculum. The kids love him. Looking back, Key was such a joke and I’m still upset about that level of incompetence from so many teachers. Some of the subject specific teachers were good but the class sizes started to get pretty big by the time we left. Also, the teacher communication is so much better now. At Key, we never knew when the kids were going to have a test and no study guides were sent home. The teacher even told me they didn’t want the kids to study at home. Now, we get study guides and more comprehensive updates so we better understand the work they’re doing.
My kids also now appreciate being around more Asian kids. I don’t think I (or they) realized how different they felt at Key and hadn’t accounted for the importance of this in their experience. We are overall much happier in MCPS but these things that I reference may not be as important to you. I just wanted to give you my perspective.

Glad it helped! We knew 2 families who felt similarly at Key. They moved to McLean and are very happy there if you want to consider there as well.

I have friends in McLean whose kids went to Langely. Really good school, great offering and good cohort of high performing kids.

Both kids did great in college and well prepared. 3rd kid starting in fall.

VA also has some great in state schools and better selection and options IMO.

I am Asian and moved my kids from DCPS (for the reasons listed in earlier posts) to a part of McLean zoned to Langley, and we have been very happy. Families in Churchill and Great Falls elementary schools seem happy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard some about what MCPS doing (reginal programing ?)and not sure how to interpret it

Anonymous wrote:Both are pretty good! Are you spending time on the MCPS board? Looks like they are rolling back advanced math and ELA options. I don't know the details but worth looking into.

This thread is illuminating:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1324771.page

I'm also an Asian person and we have been really happy with DCPS elementary and then BASIS for middle and high

+1. If you want to stay in DC and don't want to pay for private, your best option is BASIS.

Asian mom here, we looked at Basis and IMO DCI was better option. Lots of tracking and able to met the needs of high performing kids, more expansive curriculum with more options, lots of electives, and best represent your typical suburban school in terms of good facilities and lots of sports, clubs.

Best chance if you are in a feeder but you can still get in if not.

And if it matters, a number of Asian and mixed Asian kids at the school. I would estimate 8-10%.

DCI is 3% Asian and 10% mixed. BASIS is 7% Asian and 15% mixed. Lots of South Asian and Asian families in the community. I'm also an Asian and haven't necessarily made school decisions based on race, but it's been kind of nice for my kids to have friends and peers who look like them.

https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/349

https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/138

You are right on the facilities being better, and the classes aren't as expansive because all the kids have to basically take the advanced track of every subject.

But BASIS hands down has a better science curriculum, with very in-depth biology, chemistry and physics starting in 6th grade. I also never considered DCI because of the screens, and would make my decision based on that alone. My BASIS student can do all his work at home and in school on paper, so there is never the pull to get distracted by screens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard some about what MCPS doing (reginal programing ?)and not sure how to interpret it

Anonymous wrote:Both are pretty good! Are you spending time on the MCPS board? Looks like they are rolling back advanced math and ELA options. I don't know the details but worth looking into.

This thread is illuminating:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1324771.page

I'm also an Asian person and we have been really happy with DCPS elementary and then BASIS for middle and high

+1. If you want to stay in DC and don't want to pay for private, your best option is BASIS.

Asian mom here, we looked at Basis and IMO DCI was better option. Lots of tracking and able to met the needs of high performing kids, more expansive curriculum with more options, lots of electives, and best represent your typical suburban school in terms of good facilities and lots of sports, clubs.

Best chance if you are in a feeder but you can still get in if not.

And if it matters, a number of Asian and mixed Asian kids at the school. I would estimate 8-10%.

DCI is 3% Asian and 10% mixed. BASIS is 7% Asian and 15% mixed. Lots of South Asian and Asian families in the community. I'm also an Asian and haven't necessarily made school decisions based on race, but it's been kind of nice for my kids to have friends and peers who look like them.

https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/349

https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/138

You are right on the facilities being better, and the classes aren't as expansive because all the kids have to basically take the advanced track of every subject.

But BASIS hands down has a better science curriculum, with very in-depth biology, chemistry and physics starting in 6th grade. I also never considered DCI because of the screens, and would make my decision based on that alone. My BASIS student can do all his work at home and in school on paper, so there is never the pull to get distracted by screens.

We felt the same about DCI vs Basis but unfortunately we lost the lottery for Basis or any other acceptable middle school. Exploring private and catholic schools for 6th for next year applications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The smaller NW DCPS elementaries feel like privates: small grade sizes, two teachers per class in K, beautiful facilities, and more varied after-school enrichment offerings than MCPS ES.

There is more latitude in DC for PTAs to fund extra staff than in MCPS, where there is no allowance for it. PTAs also seem more active in DC, by percentage of parents participating in them and funds raised per capita.

Some NW DCPS also teach a foreign language once a week during the core school day. (DC has many immersion schools, too, if you want to go that route).

Also, many MCPS don’t allow parent tours; it’s up to the principal. I was only able to tour two Bethesda publics, one Silver Spring, and one Chevy Chase public school. The MCPS schools I toured wouldn’t let us observe a class (with the exception of Somerset, whose parent guide let us pop into two classes for a few minutes) and wouldn’t allow us to come by during recess, when student—staff ratio is lowest / chaos level is highest.

DCPS, on the other hand, provides so much transparency. I visited nearly every NW school, some multiple times, and it made me feel more comfortable with DCPS as a whole. I was able to take pre-scheduled and one-off tours. Everyone was so friendly in administration! The front office staff just seem happier in DC.

I also like that DC schools are largely walkable. In MCPS, many students bus to school. I know many kids enjoy the bus, but we want to sort of “root” ourselves in a walkable school community.

Finally, I liked how diverse the parents on the tour were, by nationality and race in DC. In the Bethesda and Chevy Chase elementaries, it was almost universally white, American parents (many born in Maryland) on the tours — maybe 80-90% of the parents fit that description. We were looking for more international family community.

Your observations are bizarre and inaccurate. MCPS publishes data on the demographics of all of its elementary schools--Bethesda Elementary school is 60% non-white. Chevy Chase Elementary School is 50% non-white. There are several other elementary schools in the BCC cluster but none of them are "universally white. And there are walkable parts of Bethesda and Chevy Chase--you just need to do your research.

PP said on the tour not at the school!

Ah yes, we should all make our conclusions about the demographics of a school based on the one or two other families you meet on a public school tour rather than the data MCPS publishes annually on their website (which shows many of these schools are 40%+ non-white.)

[Anonymous]

We moved from DC to Maryland a few years ago and I never look at the DCPS forum. I looked today out of curiosity, and I'm so glad I did so I can share some lived perspective with the OP.

We really love MCPS. The quality of instruction has felt very solid, communication is decent, and the community is lovely. We've seen great PTAs, who host all kinds of events. We have also been grateful for the bus system. Our children can walk to elementary and high school, but not to middle school. The buses are reliable, convenient, and free. Tons of afterschool enrichment options. Our kids are thriving.

We were sad to leave DC, and originally tried to buy a house in upper Northwest, but got priced out. Not having to deal with DCPS schools and the lottery was a silver lining. Now we feel deeply grateful to be where we are. We love DC, but we also love MCPS, and there's a lot to be said for Maryland more broadly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The smaller NW DCPS elementaries feel like privates: small grade sizes, two teachers per class in K, beautiful facilities, and more varied after-school enrichment offerings than MCPS ES.

There is more latitude in DC for PTAs to fund extra staff than in MCPS, where there is no allowance for it. PTAs also seem more active in DC, by percentage of parents participating in them and funds raised per capita.

Some NW DCPS also teach a foreign language once a week during the core school day. (DC has many immersion schools, too, if you want to go that route).

Also, many MCPS don’t allow parent tours; it’s up to the principal. I was only able to tour two Bethesda publics, one Silver Spring, and one Chevy Chase public school. The MCPS schools I toured wouldn’t let us observe a class (with the exception of Somerset, whose parent guide let us pop into two classes for a few minutes) and wouldn’t allow us to come by during recess, when student—staff ratio is lowest / chaos level is highest.

DCPS, on the other hand, provides so much transparency. I visited nearly every NW school, some multiple times, and it made me feel more comfortable with DCPS as a whole. I was able to take pre-scheduled and one-off tours. Everyone was so friendly in administration! The front office staff just seem happier in DC.

I also like that DC schools are largely walkable. In MCPS, many students bus to school. I know many kids enjoy the bus, but we want to sort of “root” ourselves in a walkable school community.

Finally, I liked how diverse the parents on the tour were, by nationality and race in DC. In the Bethesda and Chevy Chase elementaries, it was almost universally white, American parents (many born in Maryland) on the tours — maybe 80-90% of the parents fit that description. We were looking for more international family community.

We attend a Bethesda elementary school and it's incredibly diverse and international. On my street alone it's nearly 50% international families. We also walk to school. Additionally, many MCPS elementary schools have foundations in addition to PTAs who pay for additional services, etc.