Novel suggestion for TJ admissions - just for fun

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, since each school has allocated TJ spots, and kids are mostly compared with other kids from their school, the lack of Mathcounts or Science Olympiad at some schools isn't relevant.

At schools like Longfellow, kids who were on the Mathcounts team or earned gold medals at Science olympiad or qualified for AIME should get admissions preference over the kids from the same school with all of the same opportunities who haven't achieved much of anything.

As is with current essay-based admissions aimed to build a diverse class, there is already a two year difference between the top and bottom tier students of the same TJ class. If additional merit criteria are introduced for top-tier students, the concern may be that it could further widen the achievement gap between them and those in the bottom tier.

Wait you're saying you don't want the very top top top kids out of fear it will make the bottom tier kids look worse?

Some FCPS actions suggest that is the FCPS way. No Valedictorians, the whole national merit thing….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is much diversity within regular FCPS schools. Why are we making it a goal to water down our singular top school to achieve what we have in plenty at all our other schools?

How about make TJ an IB school? Or is that the definitive support for AP>IB that TJ is not an IB school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

How is a robotics team an unfair advantage?

Because not every school has a robotics team. A robotics team implies having parents or Teachers who are willing to devote time and resources to the robotics team. Resources require money or the ability to raise the funds to get the resources, which is not available at every MS. You need studetns who are interested in robotics, which requires an interest in math and science that is not fostered at every ES or MS.

If you start giving out slots to TJ based on performance in academic style clubs that are not available at every MS or in a manner that allows many schools to be competitive, then the kids at MS without access to the programs are at an unfair advantage.

There are MSs that don't have MathCounts or Science Olympiad or Science Bowl. The changes made to TJ admissions were made to even out the application field by focusing on what can be had at every MS and only that. Students can discuss their STEM activities in their essay so there is a way to discuss their activities but a kid who is just figuring out how much they enjoy STEM activities because they were able to take engineering or coding in MS has a chance to discuss that.

I don't understand this obsession with complete and utter discounting of achievement.

Lets leave out for now the schools without teams or clubs.

Longfellow has a Sci Oly team. A very competitive one! Yet, only FIVE students from that team won gold medals at State Sci Oly tournament. Five, out of a pool of probably 150+ testers, 30+strong wider team, and 15-strong state tournament team.

Is there a difference between a Longfellow Sci Oly gold medalist and a Longfellow student who isn't? Yes! There is! Why pretend that there isn't? Why pretend that accomplishing something very difficult in STEM doesn't make you a better fit in a damn STEM focused high school?

We did that for a very long time…which was a problem.

Now kids from across the county have a shot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

How is a robotics team an unfair advantage?

Because not every school has a robotics team. A robotics team implies having parents or Teachers who are willing to devote time and resources to the robotics team. Resources require money or the ability to raise the funds to get the resources, which is not available at every MS. You need studetns who are interested in robotics, which requires an interest in math and science that is not fostered at every ES or MS.

If you start giving out slots to TJ based on performance in academic style clubs that are not available at every MS or in a manner that allows many schools to be competitive, then the kids at MS without access to the programs are at an unfair advantage.

There are MSs that don't have MathCounts or Science Olympiad or Science Bowl. The changes made to TJ admissions were made to even out the application field by focusing on what can be had at every MS and only that. Students can discuss their STEM activities in their essay so there is a way to discuss their activities but a kid who is just figuring out how much they enjoy STEM activities because they were able to take engineering or coding in MS has a chance to discuss that.

I don't understand this obsession with complete and utter discounting of achievement.

Lets leave out for now the schools without teams or clubs.

Longfellow has a Sci Oly team. A very competitive one! Yet, only FIVE students from that team won gold medals at State Sci Oly tournament. Five, out of a pool of probably 150+ testers, 30+strong wider team, and 15-strong state tournament team.

Is there a difference between a Longfellow Sci Oly gold medalist and a Longfellow student who isn't? Yes! There is! Why pretend that there isn't? Why pretend that accomplishing something very difficult in STEM doesn't make you a better fit in a damn STEM focused high school?

We did that for a very long time…which was a problem.

Now kids from across the county have a shot.

Explain why you think a Cooper student with a gold Sci Oly medal shouldn't be chosen over a Cooper student without one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

How is a robotics team an unfair advantage?

Because not every school has a robotics team. A robotics team implies having parents or Teachers who are willing to devote time and resources to the robotics team. Resources require money or the ability to raise the funds to get the resources, which is not available at every MS. You need studetns who are interested in robotics, which requires an interest in math and science that is not fostered at every ES or MS.

If you start giving out slots to TJ based on performance in academic style clubs that are not available at every MS or in a manner that allows many schools to be competitive, then the kids at MS without access to the programs are at an unfair advantage.

There are MSs that don't have MathCounts or Science Olympiad or Science Bowl. The changes made to TJ admissions were made to even out the application field by focusing on what can be had at every MS and only that. Students can discuss their STEM activities in their essay so there is a way to discuss their activities but a kid who is just figuring out how much they enjoy STEM activities because they were able to take engineering or coding in MS has a chance to discuss that.

I don't understand this obsession with complete and utter discounting of achievement.

Lets leave out for now the schools without teams or clubs.

Longfellow has a Sci Oly team. A very competitive one! Yet, only FIVE students from that team won gold medals at State Sci Oly tournament. Five, out of a pool of probably 150+ testers, 30+strong wider team, and 15-strong state tournament team.

Is there a difference between a Longfellow Sci Oly gold medalist and a Longfellow student who isn't? Yes! There is! Why pretend that there isn't? Why pretend that accomplishing something very difficult in STEM doesn't make you a better fit in a damn STEM focused high school?

We did that for a very long time…which was a problem.

Now kids from across the county have a shot.

Explain why you think a Cooper student with a gold Sci Oly medal shouldn't be chosen over a Cooper student without one.

Two Cooper students went to national MathCounts. Curious what the admissions results will be for what should be automatic admissions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Not everyone can make it to Science Olympiad. Carson has a 30 person club that sends the kids to the Science Olympiad but there are around 130 kids who try out for the 30 person club. The same is true for Math Counts. I know that there are schools that are not as competitive but there are MSs were the kids who end up making their schools team are very much kids who have been attending enrichment in STEM for a while. I would bet that the the kids who are most competitive on Carson's teams are all kids who have been attending STEM enrichment since early ES. I would expect the same thing for Rocky Run, Longfellow, and Cooper MS. Possibly a few others.

limited spots for top MS seems like a plus for TJ admissions given that it's their current strategy of choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had a similar argument as OP, but with math instead. If TJ heavily weighted or even guaranteed admission to any kids scoring in the top 10 at mathcounts state and the top 10 8th grade scorers in VA in the AMC 10A and AMC10B, that would only add maybe 10-15 TJ seats.

Massively pro-reform here and very happy with the way things have gone with the new admissions process...

But any sensible admissions process to TJ would at least have an opportunity for kids to indicate an outstanding achievement like this - and to write about what it meant to them. I've argued for some time that the seated and proctored part of the process should include a chance for kids to write about their single proudest accomplishments both in STEM and outside of STEM, as well as what they hope to get from and provide to TJ if admitted.

Doesn't mean you take everyone who does Science Olympiad or everyone who performs at an exceptional level in major math contests, but those things absolutely should be part of the narrative that is built through the application.

The kids ARE writing about it in their essays so already happening.

Only if they're coachesld. If they haven't been, they might not know to bring up their achievements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

What is your theory for the reason why Sci Oly teams, even in the wealthiest of "feeder schools", as well as in other schools, are OVERWHELMINGLY Asian?

My son is on a Sci Oly team in one of the semi-wealthy feeder school. He was the only half-Caucasian in the initial team of 45, and remained the only half-Caucasian in the final team of 15.

Cultural factors. Try bringing it up to a Caucasian acquaintance - no doubt they will mentally classify you as a "tiger parent" - very gauche.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had a similar argument as OP, but with math instead. If TJ heavily weighted or even guaranteed admission to any kids scoring in the top 10 at mathcounts state and the top 10 8th grade scorers in VA in the AMC 10A and AMC10B, that would only add maybe 10-15 TJ seats.

Massively pro-reform here and very happy with the way things have gone with the new admissions process...

But any sensible admissions process to TJ would at least have an opportunity for kids to indicate an outstanding achievement like this - and to write about what it meant to them. I've argued for some time that the seated and proctored part of the process should include a chance for kids to write about their single proudest accomplishments both in STEM and outside of STEM, as well as what they hope to get from and provide to TJ if admitted.

Doesn't mean you take everyone who does Science Olympiad or everyone who performs at an exceptional level in major math contests, but those things absolutely should be part of the narrative that is built through the application.

The kids ARE writing about it in their essays so already happening.

Only if they're coachesld. If they haven't been, they might not know to bring up their achievements.

Coaching not needed for that because the topic prompts for the essays are things like what stem activity would you imagine pursuing at TJ and explain a time when you have worked as a team. And admissions people told all kids in their MS presentations that the essays are the time to brag.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

What is your theory for the reason why Sci Oly teams, even in the wealthiest of "feeder schools", as well as in other schools, are OVERWHELMINGLY Asian?

My son is on a Sci Oly team in one of the semi-wealthy feeder school. He was the only half-Caucasian in the initial team of 45, and remained the only half-Caucasian in the final team of 15.

Cultural factors. Try bringing it up to a Caucasian acquaintance - no doubt they will mentally classify you as a "tiger parent" - very gauche.

Striving is seen as good in Asian cultures. Other cultures look down at you for working too hard.

You have to be effortlessly smart or it doesn’t count.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

How is a robotics team an unfair advantage?

Because not every school has a robotics team. A robotics team implies having parents or Teachers who are willing to devote time and resources to the robotics team. Resources require money or the ability to raise the funds to get the resources, which is not available at every MS. You need studetns who are interested in robotics, which requires an interest in math and science that is not fostered at every ES or MS.

If you start giving out slots to TJ based on performance in academic style clubs that are not available at every MS or in a manner that allows many schools to be competitive, then the kids at MS without access to the programs are at an unfair advantage.

There are MSs that don't have MathCounts or Science Olympiad or Science Bowl. The changes made to TJ admissions were made to even out the application field by focusing on what can be had at every MS and only that. Students can discuss their STEM activities in their essay so there is a way to discuss their activities but a kid who is just figuring out how much they enjoy STEM activities because they were able to take engineering or coding in MS has a chance to discuss that.

I don't understand this obsession with complete and utter discounting of achievement.

Lets leave out for now the schools without teams or clubs.

Longfellow has a Sci Oly team. A very competitive one! Yet, only FIVE students from that team won gold medals at State Sci Oly tournament. Five, out of a pool of probably 150+ testers, 30+strong wider team, and 15-strong state tournament team.

Is there a difference between a Longfellow Sci Oly gold medalist and a Longfellow student who isn't? Yes! There is! Why pretend that there isn't? Why pretend that accomplishing something very difficult in STEM doesn't make you a better fit in a damn STEM focused high school?

We did that for a very long time…which was a problem.

Now kids from across the county have a shot.

Explain why you think a Cooper student with a gold Sci Oly medal shouldn't be chosen over a Cooper student without one.

I was commenting on the extreme inequity across the county.

As for admissions, there are a variety of factors that should be considered. Participation and achievement in external activities is just one data point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

What is your theory for the reason why Sci Oly teams, even in the wealthiest of "feeder schools", as well as in other schools, are OVERWHELMINGLY Asian?

My son is on a Sci Oly team in one of the semi-wealthy feeder school. He was the only half-Caucasian in the initial team of 45, and remained the only half-Caucasian in the final team of 15.

Cultural factors. Try bringing it up to a Caucasian acquaintance - no doubt they will mentally classify you as a "tiger parent" - very gauche.

My neighbor has had their child involved in basketball since they were four or five years old, with at least three to four days of practice, training, or games every week, year-round. We also know another parent who had their kid similarly involved in soccer as well. Both attend public school, and likely score a placement on the school team. Does this make them a "tiger parent"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was at the Virginia Science Olympiad Division B and C last Saturday and it was a joy to see soooo many great kids who are genuinely excited about all things science. You had to see the fire in their eyes!

As I sat through the awards ceremony, I thought - TJ admits decisions must be getting made right about now. They should send an officer to the event, and extend automatic offers of admission to all gold medalists in Division B (middle schoolers). That won't tip the scale by much - there's only 23 disciplines, and some kids medaled in more than one. So it's like 20 seats. What other proof of commitment and interest in STEM does one need? Sci Oly is free so there is no suggestion that affluence matters - all one needs to do is study. Why not?

Obviously you don't understand it. Look at the skin colors of the medalists. Most of them belong to the wrong group which FCPS's current admission policy was created to reduce.

They weren’t trying to reduce anyone based on skin color.

They added seats to bring in more kids from all over the area, not just from a handful of wealthy feeder schools that provide unfair advantages with robotics teams, etc.

What is your theory for the reason why Sci Oly teams, even in the wealthiest of "feeder schools", as well as in other schools, are OVERWHELMINGLY Asian?

My son is on a Sci Oly team in one of the semi-wealthy feeder school. He was the only half-Caucasian in the initial team of 45, and remained the only half-Caucasian in the final team of 15.

Cultural factors. Try bringing it up to a Caucasian acquaintance - no doubt they will mentally classify you as a "tiger parent" - very gauche.

Striving is seen as good in Asian cultures. Other cultures look down at you for working too hard.

You have to be effortlessly smart or it doesn’t count.

Effort looked down? 5 days of baseball per week to make it to high school team and eventually college team - doesnt look like effort is looked down?

[Anonymous]

None of this matters. At some point the anti DEI movement is going to catch up to FCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:None of this matters. At some point the anti DEI movement is going to catch up to FCPS

No, the MAGA idiocy is going to implode at some point.

You can’t stop progress.