Fed employees and work ethic

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to any pickleball courts in the DMV and you will find A LOT of remote Fed workers playing pickleball during normal work hours. There are also A LOT of remote Fed workers at public golf courses during normal work hours. I have played with so many of them for the past five years. They book the golf tee times under their spouse's names, so that it can not be traced back to them.

Please like Feds have the money for even regular play on a public course.

They definitely do, especially those GS-14/15 with specialized pay. I know several GS-14 people at DHS making over 212K/yr. Public golf courses in Fairfax County are very affordable. It costs $39 for an 18-hole round of golf. When a Fed works remotely, he/she saves money on lunch & transportation, and use that money for golf. It's not that hard to understand.

Do tell where your friends are earning $212k a year as GS14s. I am a 14 in the DC area and the pay scale tops out at $181k. Despite my Ph.D. from a top 5 program I earn considerably less than that even after multiple years with the government. Looking at the locality table it tops out at $187k for New York. I call BS. I suspect the rest of your post is just as accurate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have the same problem in corporate America. There are the hard workers and then those who skate by. It took me almost a year to fire a person who was doing basically no work.

For every Fed worker reading a newspaper I see a nepo hire. There are inequalities all over.

The Feds are the last bastion of MC life though where the expectation is just 40 hour weeks for many and some stability, the same deal corp workers had in the 60s. I can see why the corporate masters want to end it.

THANK YOU 🙏 for pointing this out. 🔥🔥🔥

What a weird mindset being displayed on this thread. I get paid far less than the private sector and I work my 40 hours exactly- and that’s the way it should be for everyone. It’s enough for a happy, healthy middle class existence at the present moment and it must infuriate people like Elon Musk who think workers need to have a slavery/hustle mentality. It’s a race to the bottom and they want the government to join.

I want to raise my children, go to pottery class, clean my own house, and have regular sex with my husband. I do not want to work to the point of exhaustion in some job where people will forget about me 2 months after I’m gone. I don’t need to explain myself to random strangers who think feds don’t work enough. If I get fired, my educational background is elite enough that I could get a really good job wherever I want. My work is valuable and I love working for the public good- but that’s doesn’t mean I or anyone else needs to be dominated by our jobs.

+1,000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have the same problem in corporate America. There are the hard workers and then those who skate by. It took me almost a year to fire a person who was doing basically no work.

For every Fed worker reading a newspaper I see a nepo hire. There are inequalities all over.

The Feds are the last bastion of MC life though where the expectation is just 40 hour weeks for many and some stability, the same deal corp workers had in the 60s. I can see why the corporate masters want to end it.

THANK YOU 🙏 for pointing this out. 🔥🔥🔥

What a weird mindset being displayed on this thread. I get paid far less than the private sector and I work my 40 hours exactly- and that’s the way it should be for everyone. It’s enough for a happy, healthy middle class existence at the present moment and it must infuriate people like Elon Musk who think workers need to have a slavery/hustle mentality. It’s a race to the bottom and they want the government to join.

I want to raise my children, go to pottery class, clean my own house, and have regular sex with my husband. I do not want to work to the point of exhaustion in some job where people will forget about me 2 months after I’m gone. I don’t need to explain myself to random strangers who think feds don’t work enough. If I get fired, my educational background is elite enough that I could get a really good job wherever I want. My work is valuable and I love working for the public good- but that’s doesn’t mean I or anyone else needs to be dominated by our jobs.

Everyone wants this in Fed or Private or Nonprofit.
I think the problem is that the kind of people in charge don't want to use economics (sometimes it's a workers' market!) but rather want to create false scarcity of jobs and keep everyone "hungry" and competitive. Which is not a real economic condition. But think about who these people are. They want to maximize shareholder profits.

What's the answer? Stronger unions again? That could backfire.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have the same problem in corporate America. There are the hard workers and then those who skate by. It took me almost a year to fire a person who was doing basically no work.

For every Fed worker reading a newspaper I see a nepo hire. There are inequalities all over.

The Feds are the last bastion of MC life though where the expectation is just 40 hour weeks for many and some stability, the same deal corp workers had in the 60s. I can see why the corporate masters want to end it.

THANK YOU 🙏 for pointing this out. 🔥🔥🔥

What a weird mindset being displayed on this thread. I get paid far less than the private sector and I work my 40 hours exactly- and that’s the way it should be for everyone. It’s enough for a happy, healthy middle class existence at the present moment and it must infuriate people like Elon Musk who think workers need to have a slavery/hustle mentality. It’s a race to the bottom and they want the government to join.

I want to raise my children, go to pottery class, clean my own house, and have regular sex with my husband. I do not want to work to the point of exhaustion in some job where people will forget about me 2 months after I’m gone. I don’t need to explain myself to random strangers who think feds don’t work enough. If I get fired, my educational background is elite enough that I could get a really good job wherever I want. My work is valuable and I love working for the public good- but that’s doesn’t mean I or anyone else needs to be dominated by our jobs.

Everyone wants this in Fed or Private or Nonprofit.
I think the problem is that the kind of people in charge don't want to use economics (sometimes it's a workers' market!) but rather want to create false scarcity of jobs and keep everyone "hungry" and competitive. Which is not a real economic condition. But think about who these people are. They want to maximize shareholder profits.

What's the answer? Stronger unions again? That could backfire.

+100

+1
Non fed PP here. I appreciate most fed public servants. Thank you to those that have worked particularly to serve, you are appreciated! I agree that we all really should have better options for work and family life balance.
I also agree that this is about creating false market scarcity conditions, maximizing shareholder profits, and especially maximizing the pursuit of power and control by a few oligarchs.

[Anonymous]

OP get over yourself. At my agency and others that I’ve worked at, we are held accountable for our performance and meeting objectives. We are monitored as well on our productivity. If we don’t meet them, there are consequences. I’ve seen many people pushed out of government because of being a bad performer. And need I remind you that in the private sector there are tons of people who do the exact same thing you complain about. Picking on federal employees is just something you’ve learned to parrot over and over because of a vocal I or it’s that wa to to make life more difficult for everyone. But it has no real teeth to it.

I’m at the office at 7:30 am and out by 5:30 pm. I have a life. I have kids and an aging father to take care of. Don’t come with this BS unless you’ve walked in my shoes.

[Anonymous]

Im a GS 14 Fed with no remote work. I too am frustrated by peers with more flexibility who are running errands during the day and not commuting, while I'm stuck up to two hours a day dealing with my commute and then coming home to chaos. Something's got to give. Either pay those getting flexibility less, or bump up those of us holding down the fort in the office to make things more equitable.

I don't think this is unique to govt. I have plenty of friends in the private sector who sign on for a few emails throughout the day, but nap and do yoga in between. On the flip side, I know remote workers who work 80 hour weeks and won't even pause for lunch during the day, let alone run an errand or help manage around the house.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have the same problem in corporate America. There are the hard workers and then those who skate by. It took me almost a year to fire a person who was doing basically no work.

+1 to this. Ive seen this in the Fed and in private sector. There are bad apples in every job

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, it is entirely possible that your 3 examples are just genuinely bad employees with a bad work ethic. I can see why that would make you feel as you do. I don’t like that either and, as a long time fed get mad about that because they make the honest hardworking feds look bad. In my career the bad actors have been the exceptions.

I would ask that you genuinely consider if these 3 people accurately represent a ~3 million person work sector (is that right? whatever the exact #, you get the idea) that covers diverse fields but also diverse positions from say lawyers and engineers through clerical and maintenance staff. It might be akin to having 2 bad plumbers and deciding all tradespersons are inept.

Then consider the vast # agencies that all have their own scheduling and telework policies. Plenty can step away for an hour or two so long as they get the hours in on a flex schedule. As in the general workforce, I am sure some abuse or take advantage.

The government is certainly not exempt from bad employees the same as any employer, and I agree they should be able to get rid of them more easily than they sometimes are. In my experience, which may be specific to my unique agency, by and large we do get rid of poor performers though it takes a long time. I would welcome thoughtful effective changes and would be happy to see that. The slash and grab or burn it all down mentality is not that though and I think is not in the country’s overall best interests.

Yeah, I think the bigger issue is what these 3 people mostly have in common is OP. Somehow OP is choosing to associate with people who have bad ethics. The 2.3 million civilian workers across the country are likely very poorly represented by these three people. Other things to note: 54% of the workforce work entirely in-person. Of those that telework, 60% of those hours are performed at the worksite. Very few positions are full remote or primarily telework. https://www.govexec.com/workforce/2024/08/teleworking-feds-are-spending-60-their-time-working-person-omb-says/398779/

I definitely appreciate a flex schedule, where I only need to take leave for those hours I cannot be at my computer, rather than having to take the entire day off just to take my kiddo to a doctors appointment before school. As a long-term fed, accumulating 12 hours of leave per pay period (8 annual, 4 sick), I definitely carry over 6 weeks of annual leave every year. But that leave is also designed to be a short-term disability policy, as the federal government does not offer STD plans to the entire workforce. (some few agencies do offer STD and LTD policies for purchase.)

+1 also before the 6 weeks maternity leave I had to use every bit of leave I had for maternity leave and then some (i owed the government hours of sick leave) and/or went unpaid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to any pickleball courts in the DMV and you will find A LOT of remote Fed workers playing pickleball during normal work hours. There are also A LOT of remote Fed workers at public golf courses during normal work hours. I have played with so many of them for the past five years. They book the golf tee times under their spouse's names, so that it can not be traced back to them.

Please like Feds have the money for even regular play on a public course.

They definitely do, especially those GS-14/15 with specialized pay. I know several GS-14 people at DHS making over 212K/yr. Public golf courses in Fairfax County are very affordable. It costs $39 for an 18-hole round of golf. When a Fed works remotely, he/she saves money on lunch & transportation, and use that money for golf. It's not that hard to understand.

Do tell where your friends are earning $212k a year as GS14s. I am a 14 in the DC area and the pay scale tops out at $181k. Despite my Ph.D. from a top 5 program I earn considerably less than that even after multiple years with the government. Looking at the locality table it tops out at $187k for New York. I call BS. I suspect the rest of your post is just as accurate.

​For someone with a Ph.D., it is unbelievable that you don't even know this, and you're a Fed. Your Ph.D. should be revoked. LOL....

The DHS Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) has special pay for people who are specialized in cybersecurity. I joined CISA in 2021 as a GS-14 step 6. After one year, my salary was increased by 25%, and I also received about 8K in bonuses. In 2024, I am at GS-14 step 7 ($167,276 x 1.25 = $208.75K + $8K bonus = 216K). FWIW, I only have a BS degree in Computer Engineering from UVA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Im a GS 14 Fed with no remote work. I too am frustrated by peers with more flexibility who are running errands during the day and not commuting, while I'm stuck up to two hours a day dealing with my commute and then coming home to chaos. Something's got to give. Either pay those getting flexibility less, or bump up those of us holding down the fort in the office to make things more equitable.

I don't think this is unique to govt. I have plenty of friends in the private sector who sign on for a few emails throughout the day, but nap and do yoga in between. On the flip side, I know remote workers who work 80 hour weeks and won't even pause for lunch during the day, let alone run an errand or help manage around the house.

Agreed. I think remote should get the basic US pay. Truly those of us in the office do way more and get more grunt work.

[Anonymous]

What’s up with all these Feds bashing threads lately? Is this same OP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to any pickleball courts in the DMV and you will find A LOT of remote Fed workers playing pickleball during normal work hours. There are also A LOT of remote Fed workers at public golf courses during normal work hours. I have played with so many of them for the past five years. They book the golf tee times under their spouse's names, so that it can not be traced back to them.

Please like Feds have the money for even regular play on a public course.

They definitely do, especially those GS-14/15 with specialized pay. I know several GS-14 people at DHS making over 212K/yr. Public golf courses in Fairfax County are very affordable. It costs $39 for an 18-hole round of golf. When a Fed works remotely, he/she saves money on lunch & transportation, and use that money for golf. It's not that hard to understand.

Do tell where your friends are earning $212k a year as GS14s. I am a 14 in the DC area and the pay scale tops out at $181k. Despite my Ph.D. from a top 5 program I earn considerably less than that even after multiple years with the government. Looking at the locality table it tops out at $187k for New York. I call BS. I suspect the rest of your post is just as accurate.

​For someone with a Ph.D., it is unbelievable that you don't even know this, and you're a Fed. Your Ph.D. should be revoked. LOL....

The DHS Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) has special pay for people who are specialized in cybersecurity. I joined CISA in 2021 as a GS-14 step 6. After one year, my salary was increased by 25%, and I also received about 8K in bonuses. In 2024, I am at GS-14 step 7 ($167,276 x 1.25 = $208.75K + $8K bonus = 216K). FWIW, I only have a BS degree in Computer Engineering from UVA.

NP but this is a dumb take.

Also, great job with letting the Russian bots and trolls destroy our democracy! Your BS should be revoked…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go to any pickleball courts in the DMV and you will find A LOT of remote Fed workers playing pickleball during normal work hours. There are also A LOT of remote Fed workers at public golf courses during normal work hours. I have played with so many of them for the past five years. They book the golf tee times under their spouse's names, so that it can not be traced back to them.

Please like Feds have the money for even regular play on a public course.

They definitely do, especially those GS-14/15 with specialized pay. I know several GS-14 people at DHS making over 212K/yr. Public golf courses in Fairfax County are very affordable. It costs $39 for an 18-hole round of golf. When a Fed works remotely, he/she saves money on lunch & transportation, and use that money for golf. It's not that hard to understand.

Do tell where your friends are earning $212k a year as GS14s. I am a 14 in the DC area and the pay scale tops out at $181k. Despite my Ph.D. from a top 5 program I earn considerably less than that even after multiple years with the government. Looking at the locality table it tops out at $187k for New York. I call BS. I suspect the rest of your post is just as accurate.

​For someone with a Ph.D., it is unbelievable that you don't even know this, and you're a Fed. Your Ph.D. should be revoked. LOL....

The DHS Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA) has special pay for people who are specialized in cybersecurity. I joined CISA in 2021 as a GS-14 step 6. After one year, my salary was increased by 25%, and I also received about 8K in bonuses. In 2024, I am at GS-14 step 7 ($167,276 x 1.25 = $208.75K + $8K bonus = 216K). FWIW, I only have a BS degree in Computer Engineering from UVA.

Yeah, because no one wants to runs checklist security theater for peanuts when even middling tech pays better.

Why in the world did you waste your time at UVA on engineering??

[Anonymous]

My question is for you OP. What kind of people are you hanging out with that happen to be the FEDS with poor ethics? I know plenty of FEDS who work hard and earn every dollar. I’d reflect on my circle of friends

[Anonymous]

I attend industry conferences that have a focus on recruiting in various fields, depending on the conference. Some of these conferences run through Saturday. The recruiters for fed agencies always pack up their table and fly back on Friday since no way they are going to work outside of their standard hours. The private sector people all stay the final day (and get more recruits because of it).

We just have a laugh about it. It's more than one agency, but they all seem to do it. I don't doubt plenty of Feds do work hard, but no one if private industry would get away with leaving a conference a day early like that.