Treating ADHD without meds

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For what it’s worth, our pediatrician strongly recommends delaying ADHD meds until middle school for all but the most severe cases. There are plenty of therapies that will help your kid before you go the meds (which, to be clear, will be needed eventually).

Agree. The benefit for school lasts only for a few years - make them count.

Did you post a message along these lines recently on a different thread? I have not heard about a window of effectiveness before. Has this been studied?

NP here,

I read it as your kid will graduate at which point there will be no more opportunity to improve their grades and academic trajectory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. I’m unsure of the degree to which he may have adhd. We were told by the pediatrician that she could prescribe him medication directly after evaluating the Vanderbilt forms and discussing options with us. No expensive outside diagnosis needed.

I have seen my son be so beautifully focused on projects, like the 3-D car he is working on now. His teacher says he focuses beautifully when she works with him directly one on one and says he’s absolutely a bright kid.

It’s when he’s in a group setting that he is disruptive and distracting other children, trying to be the class clown. He doesn’t listen to directions in school and gets distracted very easily. He doesn’t seem to hear when asked a question directly.

We love our son so much and want the best for him. We’re just concerned about whether meds is the correct method, given that he can absolutely be focused.

Listen I don't know if meds are right for your kid or not, but you're very misinformed about what ADHD means/looks like in real life. People with ADHD can absolutely focus (or even hyperfocus) on their interests. It's not a *complete* lack of focus, it's variable focus to the point that people can only focus on stuff they're interested in and not anything else.

Interesting that you call it "variable" focus.

Drs. Hallowell and Ratey are arguing that the name "attention deficit disorder" is misleading as a diagnosis. They argue that people with ADHD don't have a deficit on attention, instead they have variability in their ability to regulate and direct attention. They propose that ADHD would more accurately be called a "trait" not a disorder, because it comes with strengths like hyperfocus and often strong intelligence, creativity in thinking, etc. They prefer the term "variable attention stimulus disorder" or VAST.

See more here https://youtu.be/SbRHkbPhfjY?si=SGhYSBHDg7jvMaWD

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are pretty sure our child,8,has some form of ADHD, especially after his teacher filled out the Vanderbilt form. We are talking with the ped next month to figure out next steps, but we hesitate to give him stimulant medication as there are so many side effects.

My question is what natural methods have you tried to help a child with ADHD symptoms focus and reduce disruptive behavior? My child’s academics are fine; it’s peer relationships and disruptive activity in the classroom that are the main issues.

Thanks for any insights.

If your child was diabetic would you seek medication or other natural methods? Please try medication for your child and their teachers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to all of you for your insights.

Each teacher since K has said my son has had difficulty following directions. This year, his teacher says he’s the one she has to redirect the most and is most disruptive to other children. He has difficulty with peers, although he does have friends and a good number of birthday party invites, play dates, etc.

Academics are average or above average. Writing is a challenge although I have seen proper handwriting.

Sometimes I wonder if this is just little kid immaturity.

Op I know it’s hard to hear but if it was little kid immaturity other kids would be having the same thing. The key here is that he is the most disruptive and needs the most redirection. So developmentally he’s behind in those skills. You’re right that it is immaturity, but it may be because of adhd. Kids with adhd are usually about 2-3 years behind in maturity level.

Again as others have said not medicating if your child needs it, and many of our kids with adhd do, can lead to other mental health disorders like depression and anxiety because kids sense of self gets so smashed by the constant negative feedback. Think about all the redirection the teacher says she is doing. The side effects from that need to be considered just as much as the side effects from meds. That’s why you see some of the parents who have come on here and said they waited too long. Wait until the problems get bigger and they will be behind what adhd meds can fix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:op - 2 things:
1. kids who were unmedicated grow up to be adults who have poor self esteem, a lack of ability to handle their condition and huge knowledge gaps where they were too zoned out or too hyper to be learning from an educational pov but also a social emotional and maturity pov. what causes adult defiicts is the lack of input to the brain as a child.
2. recent studies show that adhd medication actually helps the maturing adhd brain 'normalize' when compared in scans to unmedicated brains.

DP - This is interesting. Do you have any information/sources/reading materials for the studies mentioned in #2. Would like to explore further. TIA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:op - 2 things:
1. kids who were unmedicated grow up to be adults who have poor self esteem, a lack of ability to handle their condition and huge knowledge gaps where they were too zoned out or too hyper to be learning from an educational pov but also a social emotional and maturity pov. what causes adult defiicts is the lack of input to the brain as a child.
2. recent studies show that adhd medication actually helps the maturing adhd brain 'normalize' when compared in scans to unmedicated brains.

Please post links. I've never heard this. I have heard that there is not enough research into the long-term effects of ADHD medication on growing brains. I had to give my kid something that could harm him when he's in college or even later in his life.

[Anonymous]

^^I'd HATE to give my kid something...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to all of you for your insights.

Each teacher since K has said my son has had difficulty following directions. This year, his teacher says he’s the one she has to redirect the most and is most disruptive to other children. He has difficulty with peers, although he does have friends and a good number of birthday party invites, play dates, etc.

Academics are average or above average. Writing is a challenge although I have seen proper handwriting.

Sometimes I wonder if this is just little kid immaturity.

I wonder the same thing. My 9 year son does well academically, largely follows directions at home and school. Listens well during class. Where he struggles is frustration tolerance with friends, group work and everyday challenges. Other than teachers commenting on this at parent teacher conferences, we don’t hear about it during the year. He is able to control his impulses I would say 80% of the time with skills he’s learned in social skills groups but it’s definitely work for him. I’m not sure if medication is worth it in his case. I think about it often.

[Anonymous]

I would actually be MORE inclined to medicate for social difficulties, not less. There is no such thing as "just" social difficulties to me, or being fine with my child struggling socially because they are "fine" academically. Social struggles are a lot harder to overcome than a bad grade on a test, because that's between you and the material but when you start getting other kids involved, that is when you start having to deal with reputations, ostracism, judgment, etc. Right around ages 9-10 is when other kids start getting a lot less tolerant of class clown behavior and instead find it annoying and obnoxious and start avoiding those kids. Social difficulties make school life much more miserable more quickly than anything else for a child, and that is where the real psychological damage can start.

It is also the area the teacher is likely to give less feedback about, or not know as much about, because they aren't hovering on the playground. Teachers are more comfortable saying "Your child is struggling with XYZ math skills/following my directions" than saying "The other boys seem to think your child is becoming annoying and are playing with him less."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would actually be MORE inclined to medicate for social difficulties, not less. There is no such thing as "just" social difficulties to me, or being fine with my child struggling socially because they are "fine" academically. Social struggles are a lot harder to overcome than a bad grade on a test, because that's between you and the material but when you start getting other kids involved, that is when you start having to deal with reputations, ostracism, judgment, etc. Right around ages 9-10 is when other kids start getting a lot less tolerant of class clown behavior and instead find it annoying and obnoxious and start avoiding those kids. Social difficulties make school life much more miserable more quickly than anything else for a child, and that is where the real psychological damage can start.

It is also the area the teacher is likely to give less feedback about, or not know as much about, because they aren't hovering on the playground. Teachers are more comfortable saying "Your child is struggling with XYZ math skills/following my directions" than saying "The other boys seem to think your child is becoming annoying and are playing with him less."

Agree with some of this. But does every child with social difficulties belong on medication? What about learning naturally through consequences? If you’re annoying and other kids don’t want to play with you, you may change your behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would actually be MORE inclined to medicate for social difficulties, not less. There is no such thing as "just" social difficulties to me, or being fine with my child struggling socially because they are "fine" academically. Social struggles are a lot harder to overcome than a bad grade on a test, because that's between you and the material but when you start getting other kids involved, that is when you start having to deal with reputations, ostracism, judgment, etc. Right around ages 9-10 is when other kids start getting a lot less tolerant of class clown behavior and instead find it annoying and obnoxious and start avoiding those kids. Social difficulties make school life much more miserable more quickly than anything else for a child, and that is where the real psychological damage can start.

It is also the area the teacher is likely to give less feedback about, or not know as much about, because they aren't hovering on the playground. Teachers are more comfortable saying "Your child is struggling with XYZ math skills/following my directions" than saying "The other boys seem to think your child is becoming annoying and are playing with him less."

Agree with some of this. But does every child with social difficulties belong on medication? What about learning naturally through consequences? If you’re annoying and other kids don’t want to play with you, you may change your behavior.

Did you seriously just write that? He’s a 7 year old who struggles to attend. You think he has the maturity to connect what’s happening with his behaviors with the social struggles? And then to think he would be able to regulate them in such a way that he can engage in pro-social behaviors???

Yes, by all means he should continue to annoy others and be disruptive so that he can isolate himself more and more from his peers. And maybe one day the light bulb will go off and this kid will finally get it and decide to regulate his impulsive behavior that annoys everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would actually be MORE inclined to medicate for social difficulties, not less. There is no such thing as "just" social difficulties to me, or being fine with my child struggling socially because they are "fine" academically. Social struggles are a lot harder to overcome than a bad grade on a test, because that's between you and the material but when you start getting other kids involved, that is when you start having to deal with reputations, ostracism, judgment, etc. Right around ages 9-10 is when other kids start getting a lot less tolerant of class clown behavior and instead find it annoying and obnoxious and start avoiding those kids. Social difficulties make school life much more miserable more quickly than anything else for a child, and that is where the real psychological damage can start.

It is also the area the teacher is likely to give less feedback about, or not know as much about, because they aren't hovering on the playground. Teachers are more comfortable saying "Your child is struggling with XYZ math skills/following my directions" than saying "The other boys seem to think your child is becoming annoying and are playing with him less."

DP. I see posters talking about social problems caused by ADHD but IME my kids with ADHD are not judged by other kids and haven't lost friends because of being annoying. All 7 year old boys are annoying. If some are more annoying than others, kids seem to tolerate it better than adults do.

It is also my experience that as friends shake out in lower and upper elementary school, kids with ADHD find each other and are not bothered by each other's annoyingness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I totally understand why you want to first try natural methods. Medication can be scary. The thing is that medication is the only thing that truly helps with the implusive behaviors that hurt relationships.

By the time your child hits middle school they will hear over and over again that they are annoying. Kids will be irritated when they are partnered with them at school. This is going to eat away at your child's self-esteem. No amount of therapy or fish oil is going to help the situation.

How could you POSSIBLY know that?

I’ve spent years hyper focusing on the research.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:op - 2 things:
1. kids who were unmedicated grow up to be adults who have poor self esteem, a lack of ability to handle their condition and huge knowledge gaps where they were too zoned out or too hyper to be learning from an educational pov but also a social emotional and maturity pov. what causes adult defiicts is the lack of input to the brain as a child.
2. recent studies show that adhd medication actually helps the maturing adhd brain 'normalize' when compared in scans to unmedicated brains.

Please post links. I've never heard this. I have heard that there is not enough research into the long-term effects of ADHD medication on growing brains. I had to give my kid something that could harm him when he's in college or even later in his life.

I also am interested to learn more about "2. recent studies show that adhd medication actually helps the maturing adhd brain 'normalize' when compared in scans to unmedicated brains. "

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Following - how do you all address how scary it sounds to medicate a 7/8 y.o. for impulsivity?

(We are in the process of learning about med trials and have found OT to help significantly but not be enough.)

You tell yourself that just because something “sounds scary” doesn’t mean it is scary. In fact it can be good.

If you had cancer, chemo would sound scary right? But you’d do it? Or surgery for some other issue? You can do hard things for the benefit of your child.

This is overly simplistic. For SOME kids, meds are the easy answer. Behavior therapy, executive function coaching, parenting modification etc. are the harder things. But, CAN BE far better things. Meds work when you are taking the meds (unlike chemo where you can hopefully stop, or surgery where a problem gets addressed, ADHD meds are more like ozempic or insulin or thyroid meds that need to be taken to be effective). So, unless you want your kid taking them seven days a week, weekend soccer or weekend math or weekend music will contiue to be a problem. Or evening socializing. Skill development, if you can get it to work, will be carried across situations and time. Some kids have disabilities that are truly too severe for other options to work. But, many kids can learn to self regulate to at least improve functioning.