Help me find a new club

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:what are the main clubs' reps?

We have the folks on here saying Marlins are small and give more attention, others saying they only care about l.aps and not technique

Many Older Machine swimmers at our summer pool seem to be in physical therapy by 13, but they churn out very strong athletes?

Marlins have a lot of coaches that do garbage yardage. It is part of their culture. They push kids to swim WAY too much way too early. And similar to Machine I suspect a lot of burn out and injuries at 15/16. Their best swimmers in each age group swim way too much, particularly in their 13&U ages. They have kids that have not gone through puberty in the water several hours a day, six days a week. Most age group programs are 3-4 days and less hours at that age. It accounts for some of the speed gains but will be tough as they age up and their peers start catching up with their increased yardage when it is age appropriate.

It is one of the few clubs I do not recommend.

This whole screed is confusing for me. Marlins have little ones in the water much less then other comparable clubs. I've heard of zero overuse injuries. The most negative thing I'd say about the club is that older teenagers get lured away to the bigger clubs (just look at their records and you see a lot of names that moved to other clubs).

Our DS is with the Potomac Marlins and trains at Cub Run. I could not have picked a better club for our kid. Coaches are amazing, he gets a lot of attention and he has improved so much since we moved over from another team. There are great swimmers in the roster. I cannot thank his coaches enough. We are very happy with our club.

I am not impressed with the Marlins. They have a 12 year old practicing with the senior group which is completely inappropriate. I am sure it was crazy parent driven but they allowed it. That is not an indicator of a good club. York would never allow that and they are similar in size.

I’m not a Marlin parent but I have an 11-12 swimmer who is pretty good, so I know who the swimmer you’re referring to likely is. This is the problem that the smaller clubs have, I’m sure that swimmer does not have a good enough training cohort with the Marlins of kids that are say 11-13. So the club either lets the swimmer train with the senior group or the swimmer jumps to NCAP or Machine.

Correct. The club doesn't want to lose the 12-year old swimmer to a better club, so they let the kid swim against/with more challenging swimmers in the next higher age bracket. That bracket is typically 15+, so that 3-year difference isn't a big deal if the 12-year old can keep up. The club probably can't get better coaching in the 11-14 group, so this is how the club is handling it.

And it is not appropriate for a variety of reasons. It is overtraining for the swimmer. A senior group is swimming more yards and time which would never be appropriate for a 12 year old. Recipe for injury and burn out. Also a swimmer will peak early not training appropriately.

This is completely true. If I was the parent in this situation I would bite the bullet and switch clubs so that my kid could train in an age appropriate group while still being challenged. I also can’t imagine swim is fun for a 12 year old training with kids 15+.

This isn’t actually happening. The younger kids practice at the same time as the seniors with similar but affair sets. There are no 12 year olds swimming in the lanes with the teenagers.

This is happening with the Marlins. I am with the club. The parents are obnoxious (well the one) and have pushed and pushed. It is apparent they do not understand swim and because their kids have talent (and a lot of it) they are pushing and living through them. It is inappropriate and injuries will happen (and are) - if the parents really wanted what was best they would move to NCAP so that there swimmers were with kids that are the same age and speed.

I am with the club. I have seen the rosters and have teenagers. This is not happening. Stop making stuff up.

Do the Marlins have more than one practice site? We have had several posters say that this is happening with one non-teen swimmer. Possibly not at your site. Looking at the roster it is pretty easy to determine which swimmer.

I hope that this is not the case. The swimmer should move to a club with a larger cohort of talent. If this swimmer was at NCAP then they probably would improve and get the correct type of training. If they swimmer is practicing with a senior group - they will not be the focus of those coaches because the goals of those groups are very different. If the swimmer is with their cohort practicing, the roster shows that they are well above their cohort and are not going to be effectively challenged or pushed by their peers. Either scenario is not ideal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:what are the main clubs' reps?

We have the folks on here saying Marlins are small and give more attention, others saying they only care about l.aps and not technique

Many Older Machine swimmers at our summer pool seem to be in physical therapy by 13, but they churn out very strong athletes?

Marlins have a lot of coaches that do garbage yardage. It is part of their culture. They push kids to swim WAY too much way too early. And similar to Machine I suspect a lot of burn out and injuries at 15/16. Their best swimmers in each age group swim way too much, particularly in their 13&U ages. They have kids that have not gone through puberty in the water several hours a day, six days a week. Most age group programs are 3-4 days and less hours at that age. It accounts for some of the speed gains but will be tough as they age up and their peers start catching up with their increased yardage when it is age appropriate.

It is one of the few clubs I do not recommend.

This whole screed is confusing for me. Marlins have little ones in the water much less then other comparable clubs. I've heard of zero overuse injuries. The most negative thing I'd say about the club is that older teenagers get lured away to the bigger clubs (just look at their records and you see a lot of names that moved to other clubs).

Our DS is with the Potomac Marlins and trains at Cub Run. I could not have picked a better club for our kid. Coaches are amazing, he gets a lot of attention and he has improved so much since we moved over from another team. There are great swimmers in the roster. I cannot thank his coaches enough. We are very happy with our club.

I am not impressed with the Marlins. They have a 12 year old practicing with the senior group which is completely inappropriate. I am sure it was crazy parent driven but they allowed it. That is not an indicator of a good club. York would never allow that and they are similar in size.

I’m not a Marlin parent but I have an 11-12 swimmer who is pretty good, so I know who the swimmer you’re referring to likely is. This is the problem that the smaller clubs have, I’m sure that swimmer does not have a good enough training cohort with the Marlins of kids that are say 11-13. So the club either lets the swimmer train with the senior group or the swimmer jumps to NCAP or Machine.

Correct. The club doesn't want to lose the 12-year old swimmer to a better club, so they let the kid swim against/with more challenging swimmers in the next higher age bracket. That bracket is typically 15+, so that 3-year difference isn't a big deal if the 12-year old can keep up. The club probably can't get better coaching in the 11-14 group, so this is how the club is handling it.

And it is not appropriate for a variety of reasons. It is overtraining for the swimmer. A senior group is swimming more yards and time which would never be appropriate for a 12 year old. Recipe for injury and burn out. Also a swimmer will peak early not training appropriately.

This is completely true. If I was the parent in this situation I would bite the bullet and switch clubs so that my kid could train in an age appropriate group while still being challenged. I also can’t imagine swim is fun for a 12 year old training with kids 15+.

This isn’t actually happening. The younger kids practice at the same time as the seniors with similar but affair sets. There are no 12 year olds swimming in the lanes with the teenagers.

This is happening with the Marlins. I am with the club. The parents are obnoxious (well the one) and have pushed and pushed. It is apparent they do not understand swim and because their kids have talent (and a lot of it) they are pushing and living through them. It is inappropriate and injuries will happen (and are) - if the parents really wanted what was best they would move to NCAP so that there swimmers were with kids that are the same age and speed.

I am with the club. I have seen the rosters and have teenagers. This is not happening. Stop making stuff up.

Do the Marlins have more than one practice site? We have had several posters say that this is happening with one non-teen swimmer. Possibly not at your site. Looking at the roster it is pretty easy to determine which swimmer.

I hope that this is not the case. The swimmer should move to a club with a larger cohort of talent. If this swimmer was at NCAP then they probably would improve and get the correct type of training. If they swimmer is practicing with a senior group - they will not be the focus of those coaches because the goals of those groups are very different. If the swimmer is with their cohort practicing, the roster shows that they are well above their cohort and are not going to be effectively challenged or pushed by their peers. Either scenario is not ideal.

No, you have had one poster with an ax to grind say it over and over again. My kids have done practice at Cub Run, Audrey Moore, Franconia, and once even at Colgan.

[Anonymous]

The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

They probably do not want to lose the swimmer. They need the talent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

If you want your kid to crush team records by 5 seconds, then they need to train like a high schooler.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can’t tell how far west you are, but we left York for AAC and cannot say enough great things about AAC. A friend left machine for fish and says the same. I know this is coach dependent - we have connected with this coach far more than any my kids have had in other clubs (we move a lot). My suggestions would be fish, aac, or maybe ncap (location dependent).

I wonder if I am your friend lol. We left Machine for Fish and have been very happy. They seem to really encourage good swim habits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t tell how far west you are, but we left York for AAC and cannot say enough great things about AAC. A friend left machine for fish and says the same. I know this is coach dependent - we have connected with this coach far more than any my kids have had in other clubs (we move a lot). My suggestions would be fish, aac, or maybe ncap (location dependent).

I wonder if I am your friend lol. We left Machine for Fish and have been very happy. They seem to really encourage good swim habits.

This is strange to hear as I feel like the general consensus here of these two teams is the exact opposite of what you say but could definitely by site/coach I guess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

If you want your kid to crush team records by 5 seconds, then they need to train like a high schooler.

I don' t know the swimmer/family but I will say that they are asking for injuries to happen. Particularly if the swimmer has not hit puberty. I am assuming that the swimmer has hit puberty because I can't imagine any family or coach pushing a kid that young to train like that. It is irresponsible and short sited to not progress in an age appropriate manner. This swimmer should have another ten years, but pushing them that young that early is probably going to be a shoulder surgery or two by the time they are 16 and could derail their swim career.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

If you want your kid to crush team records by 5 seconds, then they need to train like a high schooler.

I agree that the training is probably not appropriate if happening. That being said, that swimmer has some real talent at distance free and probably could do some incredible things with the proper training. The family should seriously go to NCAP's better practice groups.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

If you want your kid to crush team records by 5 seconds, then they need to train like a high schooler.

I don' t know the swimmer/family but I will say that they are asking for injuries to happen. Particularly if the swimmer has not hit puberty. I am assuming that the swimmer has hit puberty because I can't imagine any family or coach pushing a kid that young to train like that. It is irresponsible and short sited to not progress in an age appropriate manner. This swimmer should have another ten years, but pushing them that young that early is probably going to be a shoulder surgery or two by the time they are 16 and could derail their swim career.

We don't live in VA and I have college age swimmers. In my swim mom time, there were always a few parents that wanted their kids to do extra practice and yardage at 11/12/13. We would see parents on deck giving more practice. Fast forward a few years, all of the kids quit, not one of them swam in college. I know that not all coaches are great and some kids have special talent, but 99.5% of the swimmers will do just fine doing the set amount of practice that a club sets for that group. Look for coaches that are fair and consistent, and nice group of kids. Once your kid gets to high school, if swimming is their primary sport, their swim group becomes their best friends.

[Anonymous]

I find being closest to home is best for us, but ymmv.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

If you want your kid to crush team records by 5 seconds, then they need to train like a high schooler.

I don' t know the swimmer/family but I will say that they are asking for injuries to happen. Particularly if the swimmer has not hit puberty. I am assuming that the swimmer has hit puberty because I can't imagine any family or coach pushing a kid that young to train like that. It is irresponsible and short sited to not progress in an age appropriate manner. This swimmer should have another ten years, but pushing them that young that early is probably going to be a shoulder surgery or two by the time they are 16 and could derail their swim career.

We don't live in VA and I have college age swimmers. In my swim mom time, there were always a few parents that wanted their kids to do extra practice and yardage at 11/12/13. We would see parents on deck giving more practice. Fast forward a few years, all of the kids quit, not one of them swam in college. I know that not all coaches are great and some kids have special talent, but 99.5% of the swimmers will do just fine doing the set amount of practice that a club sets for that group. Look for coaches that are fair and consistent, and nice group of kids. Once your kid gets to high school, if swimming is their primary sport, their swim group becomes their best friends.

I would agree that this is good advice. There is supposed to be a natural progression and there is no need to go beyond that in reality. Extra yards and all that will only get you to a point and if you start it too young then they swimmer never gets those time drops when their peers have now upped their yardage. The wunderkind is no longer special.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

You should be concerned. Swimming 5-6 days a week before high school is insanity. -Former d1 swimmer whose daughter is 11, swims 3 days a week and still finals at JOs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The swimmer is at Chinquapin and Mt. Vernon. They are in the water six days a week. They are not even a teen yet. Yes, it is happening. The swimmer's parents pushed for it and have been pushing since their swimmer was 10, Barry finally gave in when the swimmer turned 12.

The # of days in the water wouldn’t be so much of a concern for me. I’m fairly certain I know who you’re taking about, and my kid in the same age group (with a big club) is in the water 5-6 days a week. The difference is the actual training my kid is doing is geared toward kids that are 11-13 years old not HS kids.

You should be concerned. Swimming 5-6 days a week before high school is insanity. -Former d1 swimmer whose daughter is 11, swims 3 days a week and still finals at JOs.

I’m not. My kid has not been injured or had any aches and pains. She’s training appropriately for her age. I’m calling BS that she was 11 last year and finaled at JOs training 3 days a week. You can final at age 10 with that but once you get past the 10U group you are way behind the curve if you’re only in the water 3 days a week.