Question for freshman currently in Honors Algebra 2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

This, exactly. My kid hated that so they opted to do Algebra earlier to get around the learning multiple algorithms as it was useless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

This is a good path for some kids. Not almost the entire grade as was the case at our MS. Also see above, parents are having to get tutors for their kids to keep up.

[Anonymous]

Can anyone point me to the free tutoring mentioned several times on this thread? And is Khan academy helpful? I have a kid in Geometry in 8th and are considering having him repeat it next year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can anyone point me to the free tutoring mentioned several times on this thread? And is Khan academy helpful? I have a kid in Geometry in 8th and are considering having him repeat it next year.

Its though tutor me education You can use as many hours as you want.

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/tutoring.aspx

Beginning on January 25, 2022, all students will have access to free tutoring and 24/7 Homework Help to support success in their current courses/grade level, through two new approved tutoring providers, FEV Tutor and Tutor Me Education. As part of comprehensive strategies to mitigate learning disruption associated with the pandemic, all students will have access to these virtual tutoring services through their MCPS Google Account, using Clever. Some students will also be referred directly by their local school. To schedule tutoring sessions: Tutor Me students fill out this form or call/email at [e-mail] or 240-618-2549. The FEV students can email them @ [e-mail]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

This is a good path for some kids. Not almost the entire grade as was the case at our MS. Also see above, parents are having to get tutors for their kids to keep up.

MCPS provides the tutors at no cost to the students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can anyone point me to the free tutoring mentioned several times on this thread? And is Khan academy helpful? I have a kid in Geometry in 8th and are considering having him repeat it next year.

Its though tutor me education You can use as many hours as you want.

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/tutoring.aspx

Beginning on January 25, 2022, all students will have access to free tutoring and 24/7 Homework Help to support success in their current courses/grade level, through two new approved tutoring providers, FEV Tutor and Tutor Me Education. As part of comprehensive strategies to mitigate learning disruption associated with the pandemic, all students will have access to these virtual tutoring services through their MCPS Google Account, using Clever. Some students will also be referred directly by their local school. To schedule tutoring sessions: Tutor Me students fill out this form or call/email at [e-mail] or 240-618-2549. The FEV students can email them @ [e-mail]

Thank you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can anyone point me to the free tutoring mentioned several times on this thread? And is Khan academy helpful? I have a kid in Geometry in 8th and are considering having him repeat it next year.

Its though tutor me education You can use as many hours as you want.

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/tutoring.aspx

Beginning on January 25, 2022, all students will have access to free tutoring and 24/7 Homework Help to support success in their current courses/grade level, through two new approved tutoring providers, FEV Tutor and Tutor Me Education. As part of comprehensive strategies to mitigate learning disruption associated with the pandemic, all students will have access to these virtual tutoring services through their MCPS Google Account, using Clever. Some students will also be referred directly by their local school. To schedule tutoring sessions: Tutor Me students fill out this form or call/email at [e-mail] or 240-618-2549. The FEV students can email them @ [e-mail]

Thank you!

They have on demand tutoring as well or you can sign up for a regular tutor. If you don't like the tutor, you can request a new one. We've had a mix of great, good, and we replaced them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

This is a good path for some kids. Not almost the entire grade as was the case at our MS. Also see above, parents are having to get tutors for their kids to keep up.

Depends on the kid but sometimes what trips them up may not be the algebra but gaps in their earlier math base. It's tough to factor quadratics if they don't know their multiplication facts from memory. If it takes time for them to figure out the factors (using the mental math strategies that so much of elementary math presently focuses on), they may get frustrated and give up on algebra. Parents then think algebra did them in when in fact it's the prior gaps that posed the challenges. This is not all kids but it is some. Restructuring elementary math to ensure students memorize their math facts and standard algorithms could ultimately help reduce the need for outside tutors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors. Much better choice to put your kid on a slower track so they can stay in honors. Need to break the stigma that all the kids need to be in the hardest classes. That does not work out for many kids down the road in HS.

Current 9th graders in A2 took A1 during remote school. Their struggle is likely a lot worse than prior 9th grade A2 cohorts given the weak A1 base they received.

Not necessarily. And, Algebra 2 is generally 8-10 grade, not just 9th. Mine did fine in virtual learning. We also supplemented outside.

Outside supplementation was important to come out of virtual learning on track. But a lot of kids didn't have access to that, either from lack of resources or because parents didn't realize it was needed in time. Those latter kids are struggling more than usual now, particularly in 9th grade A2 since they were virtual for A1.

Mcps has offered multiple options for two years for tutoring. If you choose not to use them or help your kids that’s on you.

My only point was in responding to one sentence of a PP: "I keep hearing about more and more current 9th graders struggling in Alg 2 and AP history and needing tutors." For this particular cohort noted (9th grade A2), there's likely an issue beyond just the generalized pacing of math that's causing some to struggle. Their current A2 results were likely affected (for some) by taking A1 virtually. In other words, be careful extrapolating the difficulties this one cohort is experiencing this year (that may be covid-influenced) to 9th grade A2 in general.

I think it’s the teaching style, lack of textbooks and homework. They also heavily rely on calculators. This has nothing to do with virtual. It also is when things ramp up and these kids are not prepared as mcps has changed academics for the worse.

Nope. There is no reason most 9th graders need to be in Alg 2. Mcps and parents are doing some kids a big disservice by pushing most of these kids ahead. A year lost to COVID made it even worse.

A truly gifted math student is able to more easily learn math. Unless you have encountered a kid like this you might not understand what this kind of kid is like. These are the kids that need to be advanced, not almost the whole grade. Seems many parents seem to panic if their kid is not in the “best” class.

Taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade can be useful. By completing calculus as a junior, students have the option to take statistics or multivariable as a senior. Otherwise, if they want to take stats, they have to double up on math one year. Internationally, it is common for students to take Algebra earlier than 8th grade. One reason kids may struggle with accelerated math concerns the pacing of math content in elementary school. So much time is spent in the early years learning multiple algorithms which they'll never use (and which may impair their developing automaticity with standard, efficient algorithms), that the pace of early math is slow and then ramps up more sharply in upper elementary and middle school, just when concepts get tougher. Advocates of multiple algorithms argue this develops conceptual understanding, but you can also develop conceptual understanding through use of standard algorithms over time. If early elementary focused on getting kids proficient in their math facts and standard algorithms, they would have a stronger base and more time to spend learning the harder concepts later that could result in them being better prepared for 7th grade Algebra 1.

This is a good path for some kids. Not almost the entire grade as was the case at our MS. Also see above, parents are having to get tutors for their kids to keep up.

Depends on the kid but sometimes what trips them up may not be the algebra but gaps in their earlier math base. It's tough to factor quadratics if they don't know their multiplication facts from memory. If it takes time for them to figure out the factors (using the mental math strategies that so much of elementary math presently focuses on), they may get frustrated and give up on algebra. Parents then think algebra did them in when in fact it's the prior gaps that posed the challenges. This is not all kids but it is some. Restructuring elementary math to ensure students memorize their math facts and standard algorithms could ultimately help reduce the need for outside tutors.

No argument on the gaps in earlier math. But I still say a slow and steady path to Calculus in 12th grade is a better path for most students than ending up there in 11th.