WTU rallies for new contract

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All teacher's unions have enormous power now with teachers quitting, retiring, etc. I suspect a deal will get done fairly quickly. One side has all the leverage and it's not even close.

Then why no contract after over 3 years? If they have ‘enormous’ power.

Please, I encourage you to stop spreading misinformation. It only hurts us and ultimately the kids pay the price as they have been. And yes, covid was a part of that and the learning loss. I volunteered to go back in Jan 2021 but even still I understand the hurt parents feel for their babies’ loss.

But we can only move forward and we (teachers) need a better evaluation system, title 1 schools especially need more resources, we need to figure out how we can stop chronic absences and tardies, and yes teachers do need a raise. I know we are paid ‘well’ but I want to continue living in DC, I support better wages for literally almost everyone.

This is the insidious framing that teachers often employ, and it's often nonsense. They suggest that anything that hurts teachers will inevitably hurt students. In reality, the teachers union is looking out for the interests of teachers (as it should - this is not a criticism, that is the function of the union). If it also helps the kids, great. But that's serendipitous, not the purpose of the union's position. But you can't have a conversation with a teacher without being told "what's good for teachers is good for students." That's a myth.

Oh? So keeping great teachers doesn’t help students?
Attracting people to DCPS doesn’t help?

Because if you did not know the WTU includes SLPs, OTs, social workers, etc.

What is good for teachers is indeed related to students besides maybe pay. And the purpose of the union is connected to students because WE (teachers) connect it to them.

For example class size doesn’t impact students?
Caseload size?
If the teacher is absent having a sub in place?
Planning time so students can engage in well thought out lessons?
Actually being paid for after school time so students can enjoy more clubs?

Wow poor logic. I'm not PP but the point is that while yes, some (and perhaps many!) of the things the WTU wants will also help kids, that is not their purpose. I assume I don't need to define serendipity to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are absolutely evil to be threatening to strike.

Could you provide some examples of other ways you would like them to advocate for a new contract?

Pretty much any way except that? But sure, you can keep on asserting that teacher’s unions can do whatever they want to advance their interests, and that the interests of children are irrelevant to the union. And if you say that, I will assert that the union is evil because they are using their power to hurt children. Even the threat of hurting children is unconscionable. The sad part is, most DC parents would actually support teachers getting a good contract - but when you make clear you don’t GAF about hurting kids, you lose your natural allies.

Ok, can you elaborate? If your employer is unwilling to negotiate in good faith and just wants to give you a little money instead of better working conditions what would you do? The option is wait until Bowser is no longer mayor?
I’m seriously asking.

Your premise that Bowser is refusing to negotiate in good faith is totally unsupported and incorrect afaik. In my job I don’t have the right to strike so I don’t think teachers should either.

We don’t just want MONEY! So you’re saying you want us all to quit instead? Because isn’t that what you’d do if your employer was corrupt? Great plan.

Real talk here. You're a teacher, presumably on this board to rally support. I don't think this argument is going the way you want it to. It is making the parents worried and mad. That can't possibly be how you want them to feel.

And you’re making me ‘mad’ with your lackluster and unrealistic suggestions. Why do only your feelings matter? I am a parent too. I’d rather not strike, obviously that is the last thing I want to do.

But how can you tell a teacher to willfully stop doing things beyond their duty when that will also hurt students? Anything we do can hurt them, I feel as though we cannot win.

This is black and white thinking. Say for the sake of argument that a strike incurs twice as much harm to children as teachers working to rule. You are arguing that because both situations cause harm, they are morally equivalent. That is not the case. Furthermore, the main objection to working to rule type strategies has been the effect in IMPACT, not to the education of kids.

Lol if your kid’s teacher doesn’t do well on IMPACT they are fired, guess that doesn’t hurt students at all.

I’d rather strike for 1 day (I bet that’s all it would take since I know parents would be angry and that would cause Bowser to move) than not do my extra duties for 3+ month. Btw extra duties include helping teachers reach hard to reach students, doing lunch bunches, covering classes, home visits, tutoring, etc. Seems pretty student centered to me.


Idk, I will ask members if they’d be willing to try just saying no to extras but that can also be dangerous. We had so many quarantines that teachers and staff were pulled, who will watch those children? Even without covid maternity leave, FMLA, and just being sick happens daily.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All teacher's unions have enormous power now with teachers quitting, retiring, etc. I suspect a deal will get done fairly quickly. One side has all the leverage and it's not even close.

Then why no contract after over 3 years? If they have ‘enormous’ power.

Please, I encourage you to stop spreading misinformation. It only hurts us and ultimately the kids pay the price as they have been. And yes, covid was a part of that and the learning loss. I volunteered to go back in Jan 2021 but even still I understand the hurt parents feel for their babies’ loss.

But we can only move forward and we (teachers) need a better evaluation system, title 1 schools especially need more resources, we need to figure out how we can stop chronic absences and tardies, and yes teachers do need a raise. I know we are paid ‘well’ but I want to continue living in DC, I support better wages for literally almost everyone.

This is the insidious framing that teachers often employ, and it's often nonsense. They suggest that anything that hurts teachers will inevitably hurt students. In reality, the teachers union is looking out for the interests of teachers (as it should - this is not a criticism, that is the function of the union). If it also helps the kids, great. But that's serendipitous, not the purpose of the union's position. But you can't have a conversation with a teacher without being told "what's good for teachers is good for students." That's a myth.

Oh? So keeping great teachers doesn’t help students?
Attracting people to DCPS doesn’t help?

Because if you did not know the WTU includes SLPs, OTs, social workers, etc.

What is good for teachers is indeed related to students besides maybe pay. And the purpose of the union is connected to students because WE (teachers) connect it to them.

For example class size doesn’t impact students?
Caseload size?
If the teacher is absent having a sub in place?
Planning time so students can engage in well thought out lessons?
Actually being paid for after school time so students can enjoy more clubs?

Wow poor logic. I'm not PP but the point is that while yes, some (and perhaps many!) of the things the WTU wants will also help kids, that is not their purpose. I assume I don't need to define serendipity to you.

But that is teacher’s purpose, who are the WTU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All teacher's unions have enormous power now with teachers quitting, retiring, etc. I suspect a deal will get done fairly quickly. One side has all the leverage and it's not even close.

Then why no contract after over 3 years? If they have ‘enormous’ power.

Please, I encourage you to stop spreading misinformation. It only hurts us and ultimately the kids pay the price as they have been. And yes, covid was a part of that and the learning loss. I volunteered to go back in Jan 2021 but even still I understand the hurt parents feel for their babies’ loss.

But we can only move forward and we (teachers) need a better evaluation system, title 1 schools especially need more resources, we need to figure out how we can stop chronic absences and tardies, and yes teachers do need a raise. I know we are paid ‘well’ but I want to continue living in DC, I support better wages for literally almost everyone.

If you are indeed an educator and don't realize the teacher labor shortage around the country, no one can help you. Show me the misinformation on projected teacher shortages as you claim? At this point and time, you, the teacher, has a ton of leverage. This is not three years ago. I'm on the teacher's side but you have to realize your value to win anything.

?? Bowser does not care, she can literally see how many positions we have open. And misinformation was referring to enormous power.

If you look across our nation the teachers who got a new and better contract went on strike, please link any articles where that didn’t happen and teachers got what they wanted overall.

MoCo got a new contract without a strike to my knowledge and are up again--https://news.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/staff-bulletin/mcps-mcea-agree-on-two-year-contract/.

The point is this is a post Covid(kinda) world and things are different. I'm sure Bowser cares and is under a great deal of pressure to get this done. Now ability is a different conversation. Strikes are the last resort for pretty much most people. I hope it doesn't come to that but I understand if it does. Teachers are essential but a lot think they are just glorified babysitters. They don't see the unpaid hours and sacrifices made. Most people only see things thru their personal lenses. That's why you always hear-"hurting the kids" and little about mental and emotional burnout of teachers.

I'd suggest someone post or point to what the actual demands are. It's all a black box. No one can support anything they are not aware of.

[Anonymous]

I do wish that my kids’ teachers could afford to live in DC. Some of them commute from the exurbs which is not good for them or the school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I do wish that my kids’ teachers could afford to live in DC. Some of them commute from the exurbs which is not good for them or the school

Yep, it’s really hard to live in dc, esp once you have a family. ~50% of my income goes to my mortgage, which is for a pretty simple starter home in the brightwood area.

[Anonymous]

I am never really sure if the toxic, combative, resentful attitudes (from both parents and teachers) on these boards are representative of attitudes in the district. Most discussions of teachers/the union on these boards go exactly as this one has, with people talking past each other and getting angry. And this really is a "both sides" situation -- I'm appalled by the way some posters talk about teachers but I also find some of the comments from teachers and union advocates incredibly offensive. People get nasty and start saying things about all involved parties (teachers, administrators, parents, even kids!) that are really upsetting coming from some who claims to care about public education.

We need a less combative system. And the PPs saying that the union needs to consider coalition building are right. It makes no sense to for the union, or individual teachers, to try and improve the contract or the general attitude toward teachers by antagonizing parents. For better or worse, parents are the best natural allies teachers have because they are the ones whose interests most closely align with teachers. Most parents want teachers to be happy in their jobs and get the resources they need. Most parents respect what teachers do because they see the benefits every day in their own kids. When you look at other districts that have done a good job of treating teachers well and retaining good teachers, you often see a close relationship between the union and PTAs and other parent organizations, because the parents in those districts want the schools to be as good as they can possibly be and they know that begins with teachers.

As for parents who are always putting down teachers and teachers unions, I wish y'all would just move to charters/privates or move out of the city like you are always threatening to do. You are not helping!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are absolutely evil to be threatening to strike.

Could you provide some examples of other ways you would like them to advocate for a new contract?

Pretty much any way except that? But sure, you can keep on asserting that teacher’s unions can do whatever they want to advance their interests, and that the interests of children are irrelevant to the union. And if you say that, I will assert that the union is evil because they are using their power to hurt children. Even the threat of hurting children is unconscionable. The sad part is, most DC parents would actually support teachers getting a good contract - but when you make clear you don’t GAF about hurting kids, you lose your natural allies.

Would you mind building on your first sentence? What are some other ways?

NP but teachers could work to the contract:
Only at school during contracted hours (no after school extra help, club meetings, etc.)
Only cover classes under the contractual way (I don’t remember what it is but there’s something where you don’t have to give up your planning every day for class coverage)
Don’t write any college recommendation or scholarship recommendation letters because it’s not in the contract (HS mostly, and this one most teachers won’t actually do but it’s effective)

Guess what? Teachers aren’t going to strike. You know it, and so do we. Also, your ideas are great. If I did any of them my Impact rating would be abysmally low. That’s right, part of our evaluation is based on what we do outside of our contracted requirements. How fair is that?

Seems pretty sensible to me. I am a public servant, and we all understand that our contract is the bare minimum. If we work to that standard, we meet expectations. If we do more, that is how we achieve exceeds expectations or outstanding.

Working to the contract DOES NOT MEET EXPECTATIONS. I thought that was clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are absolutely evil to be threatening to strike.

Could you provide some examples of other ways you would like them to advocate for a new contract?

Pretty much any way except that? But sure, you can keep on asserting that teacher’s unions can do whatever they want to advance their interests, and that the interests of children are irrelevant to the union. And if you say that, I will assert that the union is evil because they are using their power to hurt children. Even the threat of hurting children is unconscionable. The sad part is, most DC parents would actually support teachers getting a good contract - but when you make clear you don’t GAF about hurting kids, you lose your natural allies.

Would you mind building on your first sentence? What are some other ways?

NP but teachers could work to the contract:
Only at school during contracted hours (no after school extra help, club meetings, etc.)
Only cover classes under the contractual way (I don’t remember what it is but there’s something where you don’t have to give up your planning every day for class coverage)
Don’t write any college recommendation or scholarship recommendation letters because it’s not in the contract (HS mostly, and this one most teachers won’t actually do but it’s effective)

Guess what? Teachers aren’t going to strike. You know it, and so do we. Also, your ideas are great. If I did any of them my Impact rating would be abysmally low. That’s right, part of our evaluation is based on what we do outside of our contracted requirements. How fair is that?

Seems pretty sensible to me. I am a public servant, and we all understand that our contract is the bare minimum. If we work to that standard, we meet expectations. If we do more, that is how we achieve exceeds expectations or outstanding.

Working to the contract DOES NOT MEET EXPECTATIONS. I thought that was clear.

+1

[Anonymous]

I would never allow my children to attend school in a district if I hated and disparaged the teachers every chance I get. What a strange group of posters here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are absolutely evil to be threatening to strike.

Could you provide some examples of other ways you would like them to advocate for a new contract?

Pretty much any way except that? But sure, you can keep on asserting that teacher’s unions can do whatever they want to advance their interests, and that the interests of children are irrelevant to the union. And if you say that, I will assert that the union is evil because they are using their power to hurt children. Even the threat of hurting children is unconscionable. The sad part is, most DC parents would actually support teachers getting a good contract - but when you make clear you don’t GAF about hurting kids, you lose your natural allies.

Would you mind building on your first sentence? What are some other ways?

NP but teachers could work to the contract:
Only at school during contracted hours (no after school extra help, club meetings, etc.)
Only cover classes under the contractual way (I don’t remember what it is but there’s something where you don’t have to give up your planning every day for class coverage)
Don’t write any college recommendation or scholarship recommendation letters because it’s not in the contract (HS mostly, and this one most teachers won’t actually do but it’s effective)

Guess what? Teachers aren’t going to strike. You know it, and so do we. Also, your ideas are great. If I did any of them my Impact rating would be abysmally low. That’s right, part of our evaluation is based on what we do outside of our contracted requirements. How fair is that?

Seems pretty sensible to me. I am a public servant, and we all understand that our contract is the bare minimum. If we work to that standard, we meet expectations. If we do more, that is how we achieve exceeds expectations or outstanding.

Working to the contract DOES NOT MEET EXPECTATIONS. I thought that was clear.

+1

No, I asked if you are fired. I know that was clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All teacher's unions have enormous power now with teachers quitting, retiring, etc. I suspect a deal will get done fairly quickly. One side has all the leverage and it's not even close.

Then why no contract after over 3 years? If they have ‘enormous’ power.

Please, I encourage you to stop spreading misinformation. It only hurts us and ultimately the kids pay the price as they have been. And yes, covid was a part of that and the learning loss. I volunteered to go back in Jan 2021 but even still I understand the hurt parents feel for their babies’ loss.

But we can only move forward and we (teachers) need a better evaluation system, title 1 schools especially need more resources, we need to figure out how we can stop chronic absences and tardies, and yes teachers do need a raise. I know we are paid ‘well’ but I want to continue living in DC, I support better wages for literally almost everyone.

If you are indeed an educator and don't realize the teacher labor shortage around the country, no one can help you. Show me the misinformation on projected teacher shortages as you claim? At this point and time, you, the teacher, has a ton of leverage. This is not three years ago. I'm on the teacher's side but you have to realize your value to win anything.

?? Bowser does not care, she can literally see how many positions we have open. And misinformation was referring to enormous power.

If you look across our nation the teachers who got a new and better contract went on strike, please link any articles where that didn’t happen and teachers got what they wanted overall.

MoCo got a new contract without a strike to my knowledge and are up again--https://news.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/staff-bulletin/mcps-mcea-agree-on-two-year-contract/.

The point is this is a post Covid(kinda) world and things are different. I'm sure Bowser cares and is under a great deal of pressure to get this done. Now ability is a different conversation. Strikes are the last resort for pretty much most people. I hope it doesn't come to that but I understand if it does. Teachers are essential but a lot think they are just glorified babysitters. They don't see the unpaid hours and sacrifices made. Most people only see things thru their personal lenses. That's why you always hear-"hurting the kids" and little about mental and emotional burnout of teachers.

I'd suggest someone post or point to what the actual demands are. It's all a black box. No one can support anything they are not aware of.

I agree. What is the union asking for? Asking parents for blind support and then threatening to strike if you don't get the unknown thing isn't a good way to build consensus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am never really sure if the toxic, combative, resentful attitudes (from both parents and teachers) on these boards are representative of attitudes in the district. Most discussions of teachers/the union on these boards go exactly as this one has, with people talking past each other and getting angry. And this really is a "both sides" situation -- I'm appalled by the way some posters talk about teachers but I also find some of the comments from teachers and union advocates incredibly offensive. People get nasty and start saying things about all involved parties (teachers, administrators, parents, even kids!) that are really upsetting coming from some who claims to care about public education.

We need a less combative system. And the PPs saying that the union needs to consider coalition building are right. It makes no sense to for the union, or individual teachers, to try and improve the contract or the general attitude toward teachers by antagonizing parents. For better or worse, parents are the best natural allies teachers have because they are the ones whose interests most closely align with teachers. Most parents want teachers to be happy in their jobs and get the resources they need. Most parents respect what teachers do because they see the benefits every day in their own kids. When you look at other districts that have done a good job of treating teachers well and retaining good teachers, you often see a close relationship between the union and PTAs and other parent organizations, because the parents in those districts want the schools to be as good as they can possibly be and they know that begins with teachers.

As for parents who are always putting down teachers and teachers unions, I wish y'all would just move to charters/privates or move out of the city like you are always threatening to do. You are not helping!

I agree. As a teacher I can admit I can be combative and have a knee jerk reaction reading some of these comments.
I obviously don’t want to hurt the kids I serve, that’s why I’m still here even after all this BS from DCPS and the mayor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am never really sure if the toxic, combative, resentful attitudes (from both parents and teachers) on these boards are representative of attitudes in the district. Most discussions of teachers/the union on these boards go exactly as this one has, with people talking past each other and getting angry. And this really is a "both sides" situation -- I'm appalled by the way some posters talk about teachers but I also find some of the comments from teachers and union advocates incredibly offensive. People get nasty and start saying things about all involved parties (teachers, administrators, parents, even kids!) that are really upsetting coming from some who claims to care about public education.

We need a less combative system. And the PPs saying that the union needs to consider coalition building are right. It makes no sense to for the union, or individual teachers, to try and improve the contract or the general attitude toward teachers by antagonizing parents. For better or worse, parents are the best natural allies teachers have because they are the ones whose interests most closely align with teachers. Most parents want teachers to be happy in their jobs and get the resources they need. Most parents respect what teachers do because they see the benefits every day in their own kids. When you look at other districts that have done a good job of treating teachers well and retaining good teachers, you often see a close relationship between the union and PTAs and other parent organizations, because the parents in those districts want the schools to be as good as they can possibly be and they know that begins with teachers.

As for parents who are always putting down teachers and teachers unions, I wish y'all would just move to charters/privates or move out of the city like you are always threatening to do. You are not helping!

This is a great post. I would argue that consensus building also extends to other social media. I followed a bunch of vocal teachers on Twitter during the pandemic, and I was horrified at some of their posts putting down parents as “wine moms who want the kids out of the house so they can do yoga” etc. I still follow them because they provide an important insight into education (a space I’m not familiar with), but man those posts sting. And they still periodically happen. I would love to see more transparency into what is holding up the contract negotiations and more of what they aspire to get, rather than punching down on Bowser and Open Schools parents (whatever that means). (And 100% agree that parents are just as nasty, if not more so. I just think they are less likely to post those views if not anonymous.)

[Anonymous]

A strike under any circumstances would be unconscionable. It's illegal for a reason.