What has surprised you - as your kid comes to the end of this process

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:‘24. The role of hooks, narratives, and packaging.

This really resonated with me.
It's all about sales in the end. All those endless flyers and emails from various schools. Even College Board is more about selling (your data) than about testing ('adaptive' computerized test - how is that a standardized test?).
I can't tell you how many mailers we got from U Chicago hoping my kid would apply just so they can up their application numbers and decrease their yield.
All these organizations are trying to sell.
It's no surprise that the student has to do some hard selling too.

I didn't know where to put this comment, so resurrecting this thread.
Parent of '25 here who did quite well this year (many T20 admits etc.). I had followed a lot of advice on this board, including from this thread and this one: https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1235389.page

But, helping a friend's kid with WL LOCI last week, and saw the kid's (#1 in class, so many national awards, athlete, major school leadership, passion project) application for a bunch of Ivies and T10. Kid was dinged or WL everywhere. Parents were shocked. But they shouldn't have been. It was a scattered application with no story, no narrative, no "tagline" or application persona. It seemed like random accomplishments and interests thrown together, and a major that didn't quite seem connected to much in the application.

I explained that the kid didn't "package" themself and came across as too well-rounded. Like there was no thread between everything. It's quite sad, to be honest, when people don't realize the rules of the game. They thought the stats would carry the day (valedictorian, 35 and 1580).....It doesn't matter.

You don't need a counselor to package your kid (we didn't have one). You just need to learn a little (from this place, and podcasts or books, or webinars) and then be involved in reviewing your kid's applications.

And that is why a decent College counselor is worth every penny, if you can afford it. I'm talking one you pay $4-5K for the entire HS experience. They help you "take the right courses" in HS, if you as a parent don't understand that. They help your kid say "not drop orchestra or Theater their junior or senior year if it's something they've been doing for 10+ years. Unless the kid absolutely hates it. they help your kid find volunteering experiences that are more meaningful than just "volunteering"---find something you are passionate about for ECs and volunteering. And most importantly, they help your kid brainstorm essay topics, they don't write them, but they help you make yourself the most interesting person they can.
IMO, if you are paying $200K+ for 4 years of college, it's worth it to spend a bit to get that help navigating the application process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:‘24. The role of hooks, narratives, and packaging.

This really resonated with me.
It's all about sales in the end. All those endless flyers and emails from various schools. Even College Board is more about selling (your data) than about testing ('adaptive' computerized test - how is that a standardized test?).
I can't tell you how many mailers we got from U Chicago hoping my kid would apply just so they can up their application numbers and decrease their yield.
All these organizations are trying to sell.
It's no surprise that the student has to do some hard selling too.

I didn't know where to put this comment, so resurrecting this thread.
Parent of '25 here who did quite well this year (many T20 admits etc.). I had followed a lot of advice on this board, including from this thread and this one: https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1235389.page

But, helping a friend's kid with WL LOCI last week, and saw the kid's (#1 in class, so many national awards, athlete, major school leadership, passion project) application for a bunch of Ivies and T10. Kid was dinged or WL everywhere. Parents were shocked. But they shouldn't have been. It was a scattered application with no story, no narrative, no "tagline" or application persona. It seemed like random accomplishments and interests thrown together, and a major that didn't quite seem connected to much in the application.

I explained that the kid didn't "package" themself and came across as too well-rounded. Like there was no thread between everything. It's quite sad, to be honest, when people don't realize the rules of the game. They thought the stats would carry the day (valedictorian, 35 and 1580).....It doesn't matter.

You don't need a counselor to package your kid (we didn't have one). You just need to learn a little (from this place, and podcasts or books, or webinars) and then be involved in reviewing your kid's applications.

And that is why a decent College counselor is worth every penny, if you can afford it. I'm talking one you pay $4-5K for the entire HS experience. They help you "take the right courses" in HS, if you as a parent don't understand that. They help your kid say "not drop orchestra or Theater their junior or senior year if it's something they've been doing for 10+ years. Unless the kid absolutely hates it. they help your kid find volunteering experiences that are more meaningful than just "volunteering"---find something you are passionate about for ECs and volunteering. And most importantly, they help your kid brainstorm essay topics, they don't write them, but they help you make yourself the most interesting person they can.
IMO, if you are paying $200K+ for 4 years of college, it's worth it to spend a bit to get that help navigating the application process.

True. These parents were clueless. It's like they purposely had the kid throw the entire kitchen sink into the application.
Truly quite sad.
I bet it happens way more than we think for kids with perfect or near perfect stats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My advice is be wary of advice from dcum. It seems to have a lot of people (or at least a couple frequent posters) who don’t know very much about higher education and are obsessed with fine degrees of ranking difference that have no meaning in hiring decisions or grad school admissions. Unless your kid is is looking for IB or other very niche careers where being at a target school really matters, find schools you can afford, that are strong in what your kid wants to study (with room for change), and that seem to have an atmosphere where they can thrive. And make sure at least 2, maybe 3, on your list are schools they are almost assured to get accepted to. There are many great schools in the U.S. with many great outcomes. I just hired a 30 year old with two degrees from Duke to be my admin assistant’s assistant. Schools are not golden tickets. Kids who are bright and work hard will do well. My kids go to private colleges because they were good fits and we can afford them. But they would thrive at our state flagship too and I would be very proud of them to attend many kinds of schools.

I agree. It is hard to see the big picture while your child is still in highschool/freshman university. But in majority of cases, your child's career trajectory will be based off of getting ANY first job in their field - and using that job and that experience to climb.

I have seen many recent grads of top universities have trouble getting a first job in their related field - because they are still too fixated on status and wont consider small/new companies to get their initial work experience because of the stigma.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Now that we’re done, I’m surprised by how personally I’m taking this (awful, terrible, no good) process. My really great kid got rejected from every reach (that are reaches for everyone - he really and truly had the lottery ticket for all of them). I’m mad at myself for not grooming him more and getting him (or getting him to do) all the fake crap that other kids seem to do to for the sole purpose of getting into college. I’m mad that AOs don’t see through the bullshit and keep falling for it. and my feelings aren’t just for my kid, really. I’m sad for all the sincere, genuine kids who are KIDS and do the stuff that needs to be done because it needs to be done (student council, school clubs, tutoring, working real jobs) and get hosed.

Your child will be fine. In the end, the goal of college is to get a well paying career that you semi enjoy. The focus now should be enjoying their freshman year, joining school clubs and activities, and getting decent grades. If the academics are less demanding your child will have more time to be well rounded. After that the focus should be on getting relevant work experience - this matters much more than where your child went to college.

Think of the 50 wealthiest and most successful people you know - at least 50% did not go to a T10 school.

[Anonymous]

I’m surprised that DC will attend the 1st school that accepted them. After multiple applications, deferral, waitlist, alternative path options, DC is committed to the school that wanted them first and is starting to get excited about it. Now, if offered a waitlist spot at the so-called “better” school, I think DC will reject it.

[Anonymous]

Surprised by how many people we personally know getting off T25 waitlists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Now that we’re done, I’m surprised by how personally I’m taking this (awful, terrible, no good) process. My really great kid got rejected from every reach (that are reaches for everyone - he really and truly had the lottery ticket for all of them). I’m mad at myself for not grooming him more and getting him (or getting him to do) all the fake crap that other kids seem to do to for the sole purpose of getting into college. I’m mad that AOs don’t see through the bullshit and keep falling for it. and my feelings aren’t just for my kid, really. I’m sad for all the sincere, genuine kids who are KIDS and do the stuff that needs to be done because it needs to be done (student council, school clubs, tutoring, working real jobs) and get hosed.

I have a lot of sympathy for you (and wonder if I'll feel this way next year: I have a junior). It's tough. At the same time, dh and I are trying hard to keep reiterating to our kid that it truly doesn't matter where you go. My evidence for this is that we both went to Ivies and our lives are normal. We make less than most people. Neither of us had an amazing college experience, and neither of us have worked in fields where it matters where we went. The most successful kids from my high school class went to less selective undergrad schools and did exceptionally well. In the end it is about what you do, not where you go.

I could have written the above post but substitute in “WASP” for Ivy and the only thing different is that I did have an amazing college experience. You’re absolutely right- if the college experience is amazing and transformative, that’s great and one can get that at hundreds of places.

That's a pretty big difference!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Surprised by how many people we personally know getting off T25 waitlists.

With kids applying to 20+ schools these days, not terribly surprising. And the top 10% of a given class generally gets into several T25s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What has surprised you - that you were clueless about?

I'm Gen X. My recollection from my own college applications was that the essays were fewer and longer and more open-ended. I was surprised that the "essays" for college applications are more like "short answer questions." I think this is a poor choice by the universities that really reduces a student's ability to use the essay portion of the application to demonstrate their writing ability and creativity. That was one surprise for me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What has surprised you - that you were clueless about?

NP. I didn’t realize just how cynical the kids shooting for top 30 have become through this process. Like, writing deeply passionate essays about some topic they mock in real life. Or volunteering at a non-profit when they hate the cause.

It doesn’t feel sustainable to me.

[Anonymous]

DS got into a "high target" and was deferred and waitlisted from his dream school.

I was surprised at how quickly he embraced the school that accepted him immediately and now believes, that even if he got off the waitlist for the dream school, he would say "no."

The deferral, waitlist process was also an unpleasant surprise. DS was rejected from UNC outright, and he said he preferred that- he was stung but was able to quickly move on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DS got into a "high target" and was deferred and waitlisted from his dream school.

I was surprised at how quickly he embraced the school that accepted him immediately and now believes, that even if he got off the waitlist for the dream school, he would say "no."

The deferral, waitlist process was also an unpleasant surprise. DS was rejected from UNC outright, and he said he preferred that- he was stung but was able to quickly move on.

I agree. I hate that these schools are stringing our kids along like it’s a game. Just reject them so they can move on. I’ve told my kid to love the school that loves them. Chasing “prestige” is stupid. How schools treat kids during the application process is a good indicator of how they will treat their students. If they make you jump through hoops and beg for acceptance, you don’t want that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS got into a "high target" and was deferred and waitlisted from his dream school.

I was surprised at how quickly he embraced the school that accepted him immediately and now believes, that even if he got off the waitlist for the dream school, he would say "no."

The deferral, waitlist process was also an unpleasant surprise. DS was rejected from UNC outright, and he said he preferred that- he was stung but was able to quickly move on.

I agree. I hate that these schools are stringing our kids along like it’s a game. Just reject them so they can move on. I’ve told my kid to love the school that loves them. Chasing “prestige” is stupid. How schools treat kids during the application process is a good indicator of how they will treat their students. If they make you jump through hoops and beg for acceptance, you don’t want that.

+1 Parent of ‘24. I hate the way they string kids along. That and the way the ED/EA deferrals/rejections come out during senior year finals in December. When my kid was deferred and waitlisted by a high target, they took it as a sign that maybe they weren’t a good match for that school and directed their efforts/love elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Yes, the deferral to a waitlist the the worst. Many top schools purposefully don't do this.

Those that do are just being a$$holes to kids. Not cool, adults. Do better.

[Anonymous]

For all of those DCUMers touting $4,000 college counselors, just apply ED. You can afford full pay if needed.