Volleyball club- recap and thoughts

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


I think it all depends on the club. For lower and mid clubs like Vienna Elite second and third teams will not preselect. For first teams maybe a few.
Same with mojo pink teams, Loudoun elite, etc. The preselect comes in play with top teams like Metro Travel, Paramount, and VA Juniors.

I wouldn’t consider Vienna Elite a “lower or mid club.” Their 1s teams are quite competitive.

They’re precisely a Midtier club in my view

What else is considered “Midtier” vs “lower” club? I don’t agree with this categorization either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For anybody whose DD attended Metro or Paramount tryouts this season (or any of the other more competitive clubs that are a step down from those two), how did the tryout process go there? Just trying to prepare myself for next season when I know my kid is inevitably going to want to tryout for those two clubs.

Do as many summer camps and Fall pre-tryout clinics for both. Metro does invite-only clinics before tryouts. If your DD doesn’t get an invite, after going to clinics, don’t expect an offer. Paramount didn’t have invite-only clinics, but they did email me after some clinics to tell us that they were interested in my DD. I don’t know how many girls that didn’t go through this process got offers coming in to tryouts cold. Ofc, any athletically gifted, 6 foot tall girl who shows up at tryouts is going to get any club’s attention.

It’s been a few years since my kid was there so I’ll let others address specifics of this year—-but most don’t try out there unless they’ve been to summer camps/training sessions with those clubs. The ones that do attend are asked to do all the same things as other attendees and they rotate them onto various courts.
From what I recall, there was lots of movement and lots of mixing it up. Yes you can tell when you’re on a “top” court but they don’t park you on a court and ignore you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:preselect may be too strong of a word. But at some clubs going in cold will not get you a look unless you are an unusual talent/height. Even then some midtier clubs wouldn’t notice you based on how they’re running their tryouts. The term “open tryouts” combined with the broad range of how clubs do it leads to confusion and disappointment for many

Very confusing. You need a spreadsheet and a data dictionary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


I think it all depends on the club. For lower and mid clubs like Vienna Elite second and third teams will not preselect. For first teams maybe a few.
Same with mojo pink teams, Loudoun elite, etc. The preselect comes in play with top teams like Metro Travel, Paramount, and VA Juniors.

I wouldn’t consider Vienna Elite a “lower or mid club.” Their 1s teams are quite competitive.

They’re precisely a Midtier club in my view

What else is considered “Midtier” vs “lower” club? I don’t agree with this categorization either.

Simplest way to explain the hierarchy:

Metro Travel and Paramount

Competitive, but not Metro Travel/Paramount: VAE, VAJrs., MDJrs, Blue Ridge, MVSA (good at younger age groups)

Mid-Tier: EC Power (MOJO now, I guess), MOCO, Vienna Elite, and several others

Low-Tier: anybody not named above


Anybody else not named above would be considered low tier

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid has done a few years of club, at both low level clubs and mid level clubs. Dues around $4-5,000 and that did include uniform. Low level club did tournaments at DC Convention Center, the Gaylord, some place in Jessup, a place in Rockville, a place in Chantilly and then the end of season one in Virginia Beach (only one that required a hotel). For these you have gas, sometimes parking (and parking can be ridiculously expensive), spectator tickets, swag and food (but the food costs can vary because often you can go back to your car and do a tailgate)

Things really escalated in midlevel club because these often “required” pay to play hotels or would be just far away enough that you needed a hotel. We went to Spooky Nook, Roanoke, York, PA, Baltimore (we were threatened if we didn’t stay in team hotel our kid would be benched), Philadelphia and Virginia Beach, plus Gaylord and Convention Center. So no flights required, all driving, but the hotels and multiple days out of town cost $$$$$. Teams frequently plan to eat meals together and you’re expected to pay for the coach.

Just go into this with your eyes wide open. Just because your DD’s team didn’t cost a lot one year doesn’t make that universal and vice verse.

Club coach here. That is outrageously unethical to threaten benching a kid over where they're staying for a tournament that you shouldn't even have to do a hotel stay for (my team also played Charm City last year).

I heard someone high up in admin/coach say this during a zoom for ALL age groups, all levels on a club wide zoom last year for ECP so this definitely happens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For anybody whose DD attended Metro or Paramount tryouts this season (or any of the other more competitive clubs that are a step down from those two), how did the tryout process go there? Just trying to prepare myself for next season when I know my kid is inevitably going to want to tryout for those two clubs.

We tried out for Metro Central and East. We're a new family to this as well. We didn't know that Metro was a "top" club. We just picked the clubs that were closest to our house. Traffic and logistics in this area are a nightmare. IMO the Sunday Nov. 5th tryout was a disaster. There were 100 girls in a small gym all trying out for 4 different teams at the same time. How you can evaluate players under those conditions I have no idea. Based upon what I've learned from this thread, to prepare for next years club tryouts; make sure she's playing in HS, participate in the club's camps and clinics, and email the coaches ahead of time to see how many open roster spots they anticipate having and what positions. No need in wasting time and money if they already have an idea of who's going to make club. If they are honest with you they may be forthcoming with that information. I know some will argue that clubs aren't preselected but this was my experience. Perhaps not all 12 positions but certainly some offers will have already been extended and some will have been promoted up from the previous age tier.

Let's be honest. For Metro Travel... if your daughter is NOT on a competitive (public or private school) HS varsity team as a freshman or sophomore (not bench warmer) they don't have a chance at playing for Metro Travel.

Nobody cares about HS in club volleyball world. Some of the best metro players of the past 10 yrs are on dire HS teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For anybody whose DD attended Metro or Paramount tryouts this season (or any of the other more competitive clubs that are a step down from those two), how did the tryout process go there? Just trying to prepare myself for next season when I know my kid is inevitably going to want to tryout for those two clubs.

We tried out for Metro Central and East. We're a new family to this as well. We didn't know that Metro was a "top" club. We just picked the clubs that were closest to our house. Traffic and logistics in this area are a nightmare. IMO the Sunday Nov. 5th tryout was a disaster. There were 100 girls in a small gym all trying out for 4 different teams at the same time. How you can evaluate players under those conditions I have no idea. Based upon what I've learned from this thread, to prepare for next years club tryouts; make sure she's playing in HS, participate in the club's camps and clinics, and email the coaches ahead of time to see how many open roster spots they anticipate having and what positions. No need in wasting time and money if they already have an idea of who's going to make club. If they are honest with you they may be forthcoming with that information. I know some will argue that clubs aren't preselected but this was my experience. Perhaps not all 12 positions but certainly some offers will have already been extended and some will have been promoted up from the previous age tier.

Let's be honest. For Metro Travel... if your daughter is NOT on a competitive (public or private school) HS varsity team as a freshman or sophomore (not bench warmer) they don't have a chance at playing for Metro Travel.

Nobody cares about HS in club volleyball world. Some of the best metro players of the past 10 yrs are on dire HS teams.

Agreed - the reason some high school teams are so good (e.g., Flint Hill, Holy Cross, O'Connell) is because they have many players who play on highly competitive club teams, not they other way around. The fact that these players are on a good high school team has no impact on what club team they play on.

[FPYCparent]

There are some HS coaches that are also club coaches. I think DD's HS coach, who has only coached rec ... as far as I know, has been outcoached by counterparts who may implement a more club-like structure to their HS teams. Yes, you have to have the HS players to execute on the court. But, the coach has to be able to instruct and strategize to get the best out of the talent that's available. A HS coach with some club coaching experience may also be able to make adjustments mid-match that someone without that experience cannot make.

It's also clear when several players from one particular school show up at clinics and tryouts as a group (age-group permitting) ... possibly for the opportunity to play for their HS coach for the duration of an entire club season.

[Anonymous]

FPYCparent wrote:There are some HS coaches that are also club coaches. I think DD's HS coach, who has only coached rec ... as far as I know, has been outcoached by counterparts who may implement a more club-like structure to their HS teams. Yes, you have to have the HS players to execute on the court. But, the coach has to be able to instruct and strategize to get the best out of the talent that's available. A HS coach with some club coaching experience may also be able to make adjustments mid-match that someone without that experience cannot make.

It's also clear when several players from one particular school show up at clinics and tryouts as a group (age-group permitting) ... possibly for the opportunity to play for their HS coach for the duration of an entire club season.

True. Oconnell’s varsity coach is a VA Elite head coach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


I think it all depends on the club. For lower and mid clubs like Vienna Elite second and third teams will not preselect. For first teams maybe a few.
Same with mojo pink teams, Loudoun elite, etc. The preselect comes in play with top teams like Metro Travel, Paramount, and VA Juniors.

I wouldn’t consider Vienna Elite a “lower or mid club.” Their 1s teams are quite competitive.

They’re precisely a Midtier club in my view

What else is considered “Midtier” vs “lower” club? I don’t agree with this categorization either.

Simplest way to explain the hierarchy:

Metro Travel and Paramount

Competitive, but not Metro Travel/Paramount: VAE, VAJrs., MDJrs, Blue Ridge, MVSA (good at younger age groups)

Mid-Tier: EC Power (MOJO now, I guess), MOCO, Vienna Elite, and several others

Low-Tier: anybody not named above


Anybody else not named above would be considered low tier

Eh...I would take VAE out of that list that includes Jrs. They basically have one good team - last year's 16s (I guess this year's 17s). A few great players on each of their other teams but the teams themselves really aren't competitive in competition. And it's incredibly expensive compared to other clubs. Years ago VA Elite was a top dog and provided a differentiated experience in terms of recruiting and training. Other clubs have caught up and/or passed them by in the last 5+ years. I would rank them mid-tier at this point, other than a having a handful of really impressive players who are D1 commits.

[FPYCparent]

I think the HS-and-club coach connections run quite deep. And I don't mean "just" head coaches, but also assistants and JV/freshman coaches as well.

For example, just reading the bios of the Paramount coaches (https://www.paramountvbc.com/coaches), I see current/former ties to Potomac School, Flint Hill, Chantilly, and Trinity Christian.

DMV Elite (https://www.dmvelitevbc.org/page/show/8225070): Thomas Jefferson, Fairfax (former), Riverside, Stone Bridge, and Kellam (former)

VA Juniors (https://www.vajuniors.com/page/show/1453660-va-junior-coaches): Westfield (former), Langley, Lightridge, Flint Hill (former)

Loudoun Elite: Centreville, Riverside

I know the Arrington name used to run deep at Flint Hill ... and Metro, but I believe she's now at Jackson-Reed (with her daughter ... maybe?). The varsity coach at Flint Hill that replaced her has been a boys coach at The St. James. I know other TSJ coaches are or have been at schools like Edison, Justice, James Madison HS, Washington Adventist U., George Washington U. (former).

I'm sure there are many others, but this is just a snapshot of what I've seen when looking at clubs for my kid.

Lots of these folks are former college players too. Every bit of experience they have can give them an edge in the high school game.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For anybody whose DD attended Metro or Paramount tryouts this season (or any of the other more competitive clubs that are a step down from those two), how did the tryout process go there? Just trying to prepare myself for next season when I know my kid is inevitably going to want to tryout for those two clubs.

We tried out for Metro Central and East. We're a new family to this as well. We didn't know that Metro was a "top" club. We just picked the clubs that were closest to our house. Traffic and logistics in this area are a nightmare. IMO the Sunday Nov. 5th tryout was a disaster. There were 100 girls in a small gym all trying out for 4 different teams at the same time. How you can evaluate players under those conditions I have no idea. Based upon what I've learned from this thread, to prepare for next years club tryouts; make sure she's playing in HS, participate in the club's camps and clinics, and email the coaches ahead of time to see how many open roster spots they anticipate having and what positions. No need in wasting time and money if they already have an idea of who's going to make club. If they are honest with you they may be forthcoming with that information. I know some will argue that clubs aren't preselected but this was my experience. Perhaps not all 12 positions but certainly some offers will have already been extended and some will have been promoted up from the previous age tier.

Let's be honest. For Metro Travel... if your daughter is NOT on a competitive (public or private school) HS varsity team as a freshman or sophomore (not bench warmer) they don't have a chance at playing for Metro Travel.

Nobody cares about HS in club volleyball world. Some of the best metro players of the past 10 yrs are on dire HS teams.

Agreed - the reason some high school teams are so good (e.g., Flint Hill, Holy Cross, O'Connell) is because they have many players who play on highly competitive club teams, not they other way around. The fact that these players are on a good high school team has no impact on what club team they play on.

As more private high school recruit to maintain the high level of volleyball play, the less chance for girls new to the sport wanting to break into volleyball in high school. A new player would end up on the bench if she makes the team and won't get the game touches she needs to get better. Unless you play for Metro Travel, would not send my DD to Flint Hill. O'Connell's head coach recruit heavily but at least Catholic school is a bit cheaper than FH. Holy Cross's head coach is know for developing players....he coach 12U at MVSA and is very good for fundamentals......

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
As more private high school recruit to maintain the high level of volleyball play, the less chance for girls new to the sport wanting to break into volleyball in high school. A new player would end up on the bench if she makes the team and won't get the game touches she needs to get better. Unless you play for Metro Travel, would not send my DD to Flint Hill. O'Connell's head coach recruit heavily but at least Catholic school is a bit cheaper than FH. Holy Cross's head coach is know for developing players....he coach 12U at MVSA and is very good for fundamentals......

Many private schools have a freshman team so there are opportunities for new athletes to breakthrough. They just are forced to excel quickly within the HS season and in club to make the JV or V team the future years.

[Anonymous]

There's no question that HS and club volleyball are connected in some ways. Certainly many HS coaches also coach club, and will encourage their players to play club, perhaps even at the club or on the team that they coach. I think the reason that 15s and 16s tend to be the age groups with the highest number of teams is that when girls make the 9th grade or JV team for their high school, the coaches tell them that if they want to increase the likelihood that they will make varsity next year they need to play club.

That said, earlier in this thread it was stated that

Let's be honest. For Metro Travel... if your daughter is NOT on a competitive (public or private school) HS varsity team as a freshman or sophomore (not bench warmer) they don't have a chance at playing for Metro Travel.

I agree that if your DD is good enough to make Metro Travel or Paramount, then they are good enough to make (and probably play) at almost any local HS as a freshman or sophomore, and conversely if they didn't make varsity as a freshman/sophomore then they likely won't make these teams either. But I don't think the performance of their HS school team has much (if any) bearing on whether they make these club teams or not. As has been said there are plenty of Metro Travel and Paramount players on not great HS teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's no question that HS and club volleyball are connected in some ways. Certainly many HS coaches also coach club, and will encourage their players to play club, perhaps even at the club or on the team that they coach. I think the reason that 15s and 16s tend to be the age groups with the highest number of teams is that when girls make the 9th grade or JV team for their high school, the coaches tell them that if they want to increase the likelihood that they will make varsity next year they need to play club.

That said, earlier in this thread it was stated that

Let's be honest. For Metro Travel... if your daughter is NOT on a competitive (public or private school) HS varsity team as a freshman or sophomore (not bench warmer) they don't have a chance at playing for Metro Travel.

I agree that if your DD is good enough to make Metro Travel or Paramount, then they are good enough to make (and probably play) at almost any local HS as a freshman or sophomore, and conversely if they didn't make varsity as a freshman/sophomore then they likely won't make these teams either. But I don't think the performance of their HS school team has much (if any) bearing on whether they make these club teams or not. As has been said there are plenty of Metro Travel and Paramount players on not great HS teams.

As has been stated previously, HS vball is not relevant to club or college. There are plenty of top tier club players representing dreadful HS teams. Similarly, probably the most dominant local HS team of the past few years, only had 2 top tier players (one playing out of position) and a bunch of low tier players. There just isn’t the depth in the HS teams that you get in club. Not much point in having the best hitter in the DMV if the team can’t get the ball to them. If your kid’s not making a contribution to your HS team as a freshman (unless you’re at Flint Hill) your chances of making the top 5-6 clubs in the region are zero.