Aristotle Circle for WISC-V Prep

[Anonymous]

Our school district's "gifted" program cut-off is a 133 IQ via WISC testing. My two older DSs made that cut-off on the WISC-IV by a comfortable margin with no prep. (I never even knew there was such a thing as IQ test prep until recently, so perhaps this is a new trend.)

Now my DD is going to be tested with the WISC-V this semester. She's quite a bit younger than her brothers and is different than they were at this age. She's much more left-brained, and would prefer to do things, build things, create things, etc. than read (as an example). I know she's smart, and she's highly inquisitive, but I have no idea if her IQ is 133-or-above.

I've recently learned that at least a few families at our school are using "Aristotle Circle" workbooks (or maybe DVDs?) to prep for the WISC-V. I had to Google it, and that brought me here - among other places. I guess WISC-prep is a "thing" at our school now, and possibly in our district, but I'm a bit out-of-the-loop being an older mom who works full-time. Now I'm concerned that DD should be using these workbooks to put her on a more level playing field. In my reading (albeit online articles & commentary), it appears she will be compared with her same-age peers across the country, not just at her school or in our district. Frankly, I never knew any of this, and I'm concerned about her being at a disadvantage if others are prepping. The parent who gave me a heads-up on these workbooks said I should be especially mindful of the "Flynn effect" on the WISC-V, which is why I should consider prepping because our district will absolutely not take a child below 133, and this parent has heard that a few very bright kids have "just missed" the cut-off this school year - possibly due to the "Flynn effect." (Yes, I know this is hearsay, but I was approached by this parent in the spirit of goodwill. She is a very nice person and has given me good insight over the years. Plus, I know one of the children in-question and I am shocked that this child did not make the cut-off.)

So, if you have used this "Aristotle Circle" brand of workbooks with your DC, what have you thought of it? The books are extremely expensive, which is another big consideration for me. But I'm willing to purchase them if necessary. My greatest concern about any testing for DD is her anxiety, so if I can ease that in a testing situation then I would do it. Her MAP scores are consistently at 98/99% for reading and math, so I have no doubt she would do fine in our district's "gifted" program.

Thanks for any thoughts or advice. I'm *really* feeling my age with this younger one, and this is just one example.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our school district's "gifted" program cut-off is a 133 IQ via WISC testing. My two older DSs made that cut-off on the WISC-IV by a comfortable margin with no prep. (I never even knew there was such a thing as IQ test prep until recently, so perhaps this is a new trend.)

Now my DD is going to be tested with the WISC-V this semester. She's quite a bit younger than her brothers and is different than they were at this age. She's much more left-brained, and would prefer to do things, build things, create things, etc. than read (as an example). I know she's smart, and she's highly inquisitive, but I have no idea if her IQ is 133-or-above.

I've recently learned that at least a few families at our school are using "Aristotle Circle" workbooks (or maybe DVDs?) to prep for the WISC-V. I had to Google it, and that brought me here - among other places. I guess WISC-prep is a "thing" at our school now, and possibly in our district, but I'm a bit out-of-the-loop being an older mom who works full-time. Now I'm concerned that DD should be using these workbooks to put her on a more level playing field. In my reading (albeit online articles & commentary), it appears she will be compared with her same-age peers across the country, not just at her school or in our district. Frankly, I never knew any of this, and I'm concerned about her being at a disadvantage if others are prepping. The parent who gave me a heads-up on these workbooks said I should be especially mindful of the "Flynn effect" on the WISC-V, which is why I should consider prepping because our district will absolutely not take a child below 133, and this parent has heard that a few very bright kids have "just missed" the cut-off this school year - possibly due to the "Flynn effect." (Yes, I know this is hearsay, but I was approached by this parent in the spirit of goodwill. She is a very nice person and has given me good insight over the years. Plus, I know one of the children in-question and I am shocked that this child did not make the cut-off.)

So, if you have used this "Aristotle Circle" brand of workbooks with your DC, what have you thought of it? The books are extremely expensive, which is another big consideration for me. But I'm willing to purchase them if necessary. My greatest concern about any testing for DD is her anxiety, so if I can ease that in a testing situation then I would do it. Her MAP scores are consistently at 98/99% for reading and math, so I have no doubt she would do fine in our district's "gifted" program.

Thanks for any thoughts or advice. I'm *really* feeling my age with this younger one, and this is just one example.

I find prepping for an IQ test offensive.

The results of the WISC V are expected to be lower, the gifted program should adjust their requirements accordingly.

[Anonymous]

I'm not confident that this is a real post (it reads like an ad) but here goes...

The problem with targeted test prep is that if you are found out it will, at best, invalidate the test and, at worst, be a stain on your DD's record.

The way to avoid being found out is to explicitly tell your DD not to let the examiner know that she did the prep (because the WISC is a one-on-one test, not done in a group, and your DD will chat with the examiner as she works).

If you tell your daughter to hide the prep, you have sent two messages: 1) we are having you do something which many think of as cheating and so you have to keep a secret and 2) we don't think you are smart enough to succeed on your own. These are not messages I would want to send to my child.

So I wouldn't do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not confident that this is a real post (it reads like an ad) but here goes...

The problem with targeted test prep is that if you are found out it will, at best, invalidate the test and, at worst, be a stain on your DD's record.

The way to avoid being found out is to explicitly tell your DD not to let the examiner know that she did the prep (because the WISC is a one-on-one test, not done in a group, and your DD will chat with the examiner as she works).

If you tell your daughter to hide the prep, you have sent two messages: 1) we are having you do something which many think of as cheating and so you have to keep a secret and 2) we don't think you are smart enough to succeed on your own. These are not messages I would want to send to my child.

So I wouldn't do it.

Agree with this poster. I believe that if the subject has taken the test within the last year, the test is not to be given again until they are out of that window. Familiarity with the test confounds the results. Prepping would have the same effect as actually taking the test in terms of making the child familiar with the test, so the results would not be reliable.

When my child took the WISC IV, I was specifically asked if he had taken the test within the last year because they could not give the test agin if he had.

[Anonymous]

OP here. I'm a real person, who's feeling very out-of-the-loop, and this is not an ad for any product. I didn't even know about this product until I learned that others in our school are using it w/their DCs. A Google search landed me in this forum.

So this product is obviously so close to the test as to be considered cheating? If it's cheating, then I will not order it. But it does seem unfair that this test prep is going on. I doubt it was happening when my older DSs were this age, because I would have heard about it.

Our district will not lower guidelines for "gifted program" admittance - this I know. The program is not incredibly challenging, which I have seen w/my older boys, but it is better than nothing and I'd hate for DD to miss out. I didn't mean to offend anyone with my question.

[Anonymous]

It's cheating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our school district's "gifted" program cut-off is a 133 IQ via WISC testing. My two older DSs made that cut-off on the WISC-IV by a comfortable margin with no prep. (I never even knew there was such a thing as IQ test prep until recently, so perhaps this is a new trend.)

Now my DD is going to be tested with the WISC-V this semester. She's quite a bit younger than her brothers and is different than they were at this age. She's much more left-brained, and would prefer to do things, build things, create things, etc. than read (as an example). I know she's smart, and she's highly inquisitive, but I have no idea if her IQ is 133-or-above.

I've recently learned that at least a few families at our school are using "Aristotle Circle" workbooks (or maybe DVDs?) to prep for the WISC-V. I had to Google it, and that brought me here - among other places. I guess WISC-prep is a "thing" at our school now, and possibly in our district, but I'm a bit out-of-the-loop being an older mom who works full-time. Now I'm concerned that DD should be using these workbooks to put her on a more level playing field. In my reading (albeit online articles & commentary), it appears she will be compared with her same-age peers across the country, not just at her school or in our district. Frankly, I never knew any of this, and I'm concerned about her being at a disadvantage if others are prepping. The parent who gave me a heads-up on these workbooks said I should be especially mindful of the "Flynn effect" on the WISC-V, which is why I should consider prepping because our district will absolutely not take a child below 133, and this parent has heard that a few very bright kids have "just missed" the cut-off this school year - possibly due to the "Flynn effect." (Yes, I know this is hearsay, but I was approached by this parent in the spirit of goodwill. She is a very nice person and has given me good insight over the years. Plus, I know one of the children in-question and I am shocked that this child did not make the cut-off.)

So, if you have used this "Aristotle Circle" brand of workbooks with your DC, what have you thought of it? The books are extremely expensive, which is another big consideration for me. But I'm willing to purchase them if necessary. My greatest concern about any testing for DD is her anxiety, so if I can ease that in a testing situation then I would do it. Her MAP scores are consistently at 98/99% for reading and math, so I have no doubt she would do fine in our district's "gifted" program.

Thanks for any thoughts or advice. I'm *really* feeling my age with this younger one, and this is just one example.

I am assuming that this is a troll post, but just for balance:

No one should try to study or prep for an IQ test, doubly so if you think your child needs help making the grade. If they don't qualify free and clear on their own and you are trying to game the system, you are consigning your child to years of feeling like they can't hack it, don't belong and can't meausure up . Not just to others in their " gifted class", but to your expectations of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's cheating.

I'm not sure the legions of test preppers in DC Metro area would agree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our school district's "gifted" program cut-off is a 133 IQ via WISC testing. My two older DSs made that cut-off on the WISC-IV by a comfortable margin with no prep. (I never even knew there was such a thing as IQ test prep until recently, so perhaps this is a new trend.)

Now my DD is going to be tested with the WISC-V this semester. She's quite a bit younger than her brothers and is different than they were at this age. She's much more left-brained, and would prefer to do things, build things, create things, etc. than read (as an example). I know she's smart, and she's highly inquisitive, but I have no idea if her IQ is 133-or-above.

I've recently learned that at least a few families at our school are using "Aristotle Circle" workbooks (or maybe DVDs?) to prep for the WISC-V. I had to Google it, and that brought
No one should try to study or prep for an IQ test, doubly so if you think your child needs help making the grade. If they don't qualify free and clear on their own and you are trying to game the system, you are consigning your child to years of feeling like they can't hack it, don't belong and can't meausure up . Not just to others in their " gifted class", but to your expectations of them.

+1

[Anonymous]

OP, I would post this on the VA AAP board, not the private school board - the privates around here (yes, including the "big 3") do not have an IQ score of 133 as their cut off (nor any cut off), so even if there are people who prep their kids for private school admissions testing, there is not the same pressure. But VA's AAP program probably has a similar cut off, and I think a lot of people prep their kids for AAP admissions.

[Anonymous]

^ OP here, and thank you PP. I posted here because Google lead me to this particular forum, but I may re-post per your suggestion. In considering feedback thus far, I will probably not order the workbooks because I do not want to "cheat." But I also do not want my DD to lack appropriate preparation - if there is such a thing - considering that her classmates and others may be doing this prep now.

I'm very familiar w/our district's "gifted" program and have zero concerns about my DD being able to do the work, so I'm probably stressing about nothing here. She will probably pass the test without any "prep." But it has been a while since I've had kids in early elementary and things seem to have changed a bit, including things like this. I appreciate your kind response and suggestion to re-post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's cheating.

I'm not sure the legions of test preppers in DC Metro area would agree.

There have always been people who will do anything to earn a buck, and there have always been people who justify cheating to get ahead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our school district's "gifted" program cut-off is a 133 IQ via WISC testing. My two older DSs made that cut-off on the WISC-IV by a comfortable margin with no prep. (I never even knew there was such a thing as IQ test prep until recently, so perhaps this is a new trend.)

Now my DD is going to be tested with the WISC-V this semester. She's quite a bit younger than her brothers and is different than they were at this age. She's much more left-brained, and would prefer to do things, build things, create things, etc. than read (as an example). I know she's smart, and she's highly inquisitive, but I have no idea if her IQ is 133-or-above.

I've recently learned that at least a few families at our school are using "Aristotle Circle" workbooks (or maybe DVDs?) to prep for the WISC-V. I had to Google it, and that brought me here - among other places. I guess WISC-prep is a "thing" at our school now, and possibly in our district, but I'm a bit out-of-the-loop being an older mom who works full-time. Now I'm concerned that DD should be using these workbooks to put her on a more level playing field. In my reading (albeit online articles & commentary), it appears she will be compared with her same-age peers across the country, not just at her school or in our district. Frankly, I never knew any of this, and I'm concerned about her being at a disadvantage if others are prepping. The parent who gave me a heads-up on these workbooks said I should be especially mindful of the "Flynn effect" on the WISC-V, which is why I should consider prepping because our district will absolutely not take a child below 133, and this parent has heard that a few very bright kids have "just missed" the cut-off this school year - possibly due to the "Flynn effect." (Yes, I know this is hearsay, but I was approached by this parent in the spirit of goodwill. She is a very nice person and has given me good insight over the years. Plus, I know one of the children in-question and I am shocked that this child did not make the cut-off.)

So, if you have used this "Aristotle Circle" brand of workbooks with your DC, what have you thought of it? The books are extremely expensive, which is another big consideration for me. But I'm willing to purchase them if necessary. My greatest concern about any testing for DD is her anxiety, so if I can ease that in a testing situation then I would do it. Her MAP scores are consistently at 98/99% for reading and math, so I have no doubt she would do fine in our district's "gifted" program.

Thanks for any thoughts or advice. I'm *really* feeling my age with this younger one, and this is just one example.

I am assuming that this is a troll post, but just for balance:

No one should try to study or prep for an IQ test, doubly so if you think your child needs help making the grade. If they don't qualify free and clear on their own and you are trying to game the system, you are consigning your child to years of feeling like they can't hack it, don't belong and can't meausure up . Not just to others in their " gifted class", but to your expectations of them.

+1 Excellent comment and advice!

[Anonymous]

I respectfully disagree. IQ tests can't be "gamed." You can't take a child with average intelligence and prep them to the gifted level on the test (that is what 133 would put them at). You could, however, take a kid and familiarize them with the kids of questions, just like we do for kids for the SAT, and maybe they will get a couple of points higher, at most. This idea that your kid will be struggling to keep up if you prep them and they do well is just silliness, IMO.

It's not cheating. Cheating is knowing the answers and having the kids memorize it. Prepping is knowing that the test has block design and giving them those blocks to play with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I respectfully disagree. IQ tests can't be "gamed." You can't take a child with average intelligence and prep them to the gifted level on the test (that is what 133 would put them at). You could, however, take a kid and familiarize them with the kids of questions, just like we do for kids for the SAT, and maybe they will get a couple of points higher, at most. This idea that your kid will be struggling to keep up if you prep them and they do well is just silliness, IMO.

It's not cheating. Cheating is knowing the answers and having the kids memorize it. Prepping is knowing that the test has block design and giving them those blocks to play with.

Spoken like a cheater.