So, what is wrong with Hardy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Ha. This is ridiculous. The notion that DCPS - which cannot do anything effectively - can somehow put "strong forces" into play that would override the simple act of powerful Ward 3 families filling Hardy up with IB families is absurd.

DCPS didn't put the strong forces into play. History did. Hardy is emblematic of 50 years of history in DC and DCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if ALL OOB applicants are accepted at Hardy, then the ENTIRE city already has it as another option.

For all those saying, "I'm zoned for Deal but would go to Hardy." There you are! It is open and ready for you.

And if you look at the map of where Hardy kids come from:
http://edu.codefordc.org/#!/school/246

You'll see that very close to zero of them come from within the Deal boundaries. Maybe a handful from Shepherd Park, the map is imprecise. But it's fewer than ten.

Now, there may be some kids who are OOB for Deal but have the right to attend -- Deal is over a third OOB after all -- who opt for Hardy, they wouldn't show on the map. And it may be that last year was a fluke, that people didn't apply for Hardy because they thought it was hard to get into.

This map is kind of amazing. Everyone should see it at least once. Really illustrates the crazy situation we have in DC public education.

We have a neighborhood-school based system that's a fiction for all but a few neighborhoods. For three quarters of the kids the reality is we have a city-wide lottery. Middle school is where those realities collide. Two thirds of the kids who go to neighborhood elementary schools get to go to a neighborhood-ish middle school, Deal. The other third find themselves deported to lottery land, and they don't like it there at all.

And then there are the neighborhood elementary schools that drew the short straw and are stuck with Hardy, and the neighborhood kids basically don't go there at all.

These people didn't draw the short straw - the cut the straw themselves. All they have to do is send their kids to Hardy and it will be the school they want it to be.

There aren't enough kids IB for Hardy to fill it. That's part of the problem.

And blaming the parents in the feeder schools for the way Hardy is is laughable.

[Anonymous]

There certainly ARE enough kids IB for Hardy to feed it full. More than enough. But most of these kids aren't staying in the feeder schools past 3rd or maybe 4th grade. Add up the number of kids in 3d grade, in the feeder schools, and will see the number of eventual 6th graders you get.

Many if not most of the parents who yank their kids after 3rd have the means to assure their kids a top quality middle school education. They want their kids' peer group to be in America's future elite, and they are not going to risk a "what if" or "maybe" chance that Hardy develops in that direction. Hardy's population is going to have to tip even further in the direction of "elite peer group" before these parents commit to 4th and 5th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There certainly ARE enough kids IB for Hardy to feed it full. More than enough. But most of these kids aren't staying in the feeder schools past 3rd or maybe 4th grade. Add up the number of kids in 3d grade, in the feeder schools, and will see the number of eventual 6th graders you get.

Many if not most of the parents who yank their kids after 3rd have the means to assure their kids a top quality middle school education. They want their kids' peer group to be in America's future elite, and they are not going to risk a "what if" or "maybe" chance that Hardy develops in that direction. Hardy's population is going to have to tip even further in the direction of "elite peer group" before these parents commit to 4th and 5th grade.

OK, here's your homework:

Add up the third graders in the Hardy feeders. Then add up the third graders in the Deal feeders. Compare to the size of the respective sixth grades. Report back when you see that Deal has roughly twice as many kids in its feeders relative to its size as Hardy. Not every kid in the Deal feeders goes to Deal, and Deal is 35% OOB. If Hardy had the same retention rate as Deal it would still be majority OOB.

[Anonymous]

Hardy potential feeder population (based on the current 3rd grade feeder enrollment) is about 260 kids (320 if you include Eaton).

To me it looks like the feeder schools could quickly fill in the 130 6th grade slots.

In this year 6th grade, 45 students are from feeder schools.

[Anonymous]

PP: You drive me nuts. You made up those numbers. There is no reason to do that, except to have fun at the expense of the ignorant masses. Your sentiment is correct: there is more than enough IB students to fill Hardy to the gills.

By the way, has everyone seen this map? http://www.21csf.org/csf-home/DocUploads/DataShop/DS_16.pdf

It shows Hardy enrollment in 2005-2006. There were 405 students. 94 came from ward 3 (so in-bounds) and another 26 from ward 2 (mostly all in-bounds). So, we're talking about 33% in-bounds during a time in which Deal was openly accepting all Mann students (and I presume other schools). This should shut up the folks saying the IB folks never supported the school.

It should also -- thank god -- shut up the fool driveling on and on about this being a bait-and-switch. The claim is that Hardy will just increase OOB enrollment as IB enrollment goes up. This begs two questions: why hasn't enrollment been raised already? Surely there are more kids starving for the 2nd best middle school in DC. And, why wasn't enrollment higher in the past so that more OOB students could be accommodated (since the higher IB numbers surely pushed them out)? As the enrollment is pretty much the same ten years later, it sure seems like the size of the school is roughly fixed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP: You drive me nuts. You made up those numbers. There is no reason to do that, except to have fun at the expense of the ignorant masses. Your sentiment is correct: there is more than enough IB students to fill Hardy to the gills.

By the way, has everyone seen this map? http://www.21csf.org/csf-home/DocUploads/DataShop/DS_16.pdf

It shows Hardy enrollment in 2005-2006. There were 405 students. 94 came from ward 3 (so in-bounds) and another 26 from ward 2 (mostly all in-bounds). So, we're talking about 33% in-bounds during a time in which Deal was openly accepting all Mann students (and I presume other schools). This should shut up the folks saying the IB folks never supported the school.

It should also -- thank god -- shut up the fool driveling on and on about this being a bait-and-switch. The claim is that Hardy will just increase OOB enrollment as IB enrollment goes up. This begs two questions: why hasn't enrollment been raised already? Surely there are more kids starving for the 2nd best middle school in DC. And, why wasn't enrollment higher in the past so that more OOB students could be accommodated (since the higher IB numbers surely pushed them out)? As the enrollment is pretty much the same ten years later, it sure seems like the size of the school is roughly fixed.

Why made up? PP's numbers seem reasonable also to me:

Key: enrollment 380 - 3rd grade approx 75 kids
Mann: enrollment 287 - 3rd grade approx 50 kids
Stoddert: enrollment 381 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids
Hyde: enrollment 334 - 3rd grade approx 55 kids
Eaton: enrollment 470 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids

[Anonymous]

Oh, you're right. I misread the last line and thought PP was saying that there were 260 kids in 3rd and 45 in 5th (since that was what was being discussed immediately prior). My bad.

Read the link I posted. Good data on Hardy from 10 years ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP: You drive me nuts. You made up those numbers. There is no reason to do that, except to have fun at the expense of the ignorant masses. Your sentiment is correct: there is more than enough IB students to fill Hardy to the gills.

By the way, has everyone seen this map? http://www.21csf.org/csf-home/DocUploads/DataShop/DS_16.pdf

It shows Hardy enrollment in 2005-2006. There were 405 students. 94 came from ward 3 (so in-bounds) and another 26 from ward 2 (mostly all in-bounds). So, we're talking about 33% in-bounds during a time in which Deal was openly accepting all Mann students (and I presume other schools). This should shut up the folks saying the IB folks never supported the school.

It should also -- thank god -- shut up the fool driveling on and on about this being a bait-and-switch. The claim is that Hardy will just increase OOB enrollment as IB enrollment goes up. This begs two questions: why hasn't enrollment been raised already? Surely there are more kids starving for the 2nd best middle school in DC. And, why wasn't enrollment higher in the past so that more OOB students could be accommodated (since the higher IB numbers surely pushed them out)? As the enrollment is pretty much the same ten years later, it sure seems like the size of the school is roughly fixed.

Why made up? PP's numbers seem reasonable also to me:

Key: enrollment 380 - 3rd grade approx 75 kids
Mann: enrollment 287 - 3rd grade approx 50 kids
Stoddert: enrollment 381 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids
Hyde: enrollment 334 - 3rd grade approx 55 kids
Eaton: enrollment 470 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids

But aren't many 3rd graders at Hyde and Eaton OOB?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP: You drive me nuts. You made up those numbers. There is no reason to do that, except to have fun at the expense of the ignorant masses. Your sentiment is correct: there is more than enough IB students to fill Hardy to the gills.

By the way, has everyone seen this map? http://www.21csf.org/csf-home/DocUploads/DataShop/DS_16.pdf

It shows Hardy enrollment in 2005-2006. There were 405 students. 94 came from ward 3 (so in-bounds) and another 26 from ward 2 (mostly all in-bounds). So, we're talking about 33% in-bounds during a time in which Deal was openly accepting all Mann students (and I presume other schools). This should shut up the folks saying the IB folks never supported the school.

It should also -- thank god -- shut up the fool driveling on and on about this being a bait-and-switch. The claim is that Hardy will just increase OOB enrollment as IB enrollment goes up. This begs two questions: why hasn't enrollment been raised already? Surely there are more kids starving for the 2nd best middle school in DC. And, why wasn't enrollment higher in the past so that more OOB students could be accommodated (since the higher IB numbers surely pushed them out)? As the enrollment is pretty much the same ten years later, it sure seems like the size of the school is roughly fixed.

Why made up? PP's numbers seem reasonable also to me:

Key: enrollment 380 - 3rd grade approx 75 kids
Mann: enrollment 287 - 3rd grade approx 50 kids
Stoddert: enrollment 381 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids
Hyde: enrollment 334 - 3rd grade approx 55 kids
Eaton: enrollment 470 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids

But aren't many 3rd graders at Hyde and Eaton OOB?

Just counting Key, Mann, and Stoddert, you're at 205. Heck, even if only half of the current 3rd graders from those three schools go on to Hardy, you've almost filled up the entire 6th grade class. Once again: it wont' take much inertia to fill up the entire 6th grade class with kids from feeder schools, most of them "true IB."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There certainly ARE enough kids IB for Hardy to feed it full. More than enough. But most of these kids aren't staying in the feeder schools past 3rd or maybe 4th grade. Add up the number of kids in 3d grade, in the feeder schools, and will see the number of eventual 6th graders you get.

Many if not most of the parents who yank their kids after 3rd have the means to assure their kids a top quality middle school education. They want their kids' peer group to be in America's future elite, and they are not going to risk a "what if" or "maybe" chance that Hardy develops in that direction. Hardy's population is going to have to tip even further in the direction of "elite peer group" before these parents commit to 4th and 5th grade.

The problem is that IB families don't want to go to Hardy because they think its quality is low, not that there aren't enough kids to fill a high quality public middle school in the area. Indeed, look at the demand for Deal. DCPS is having to push long-established IB feeder neighborhoods out of Deal, even as it has expanded the building several times, because demand exceeds supply of seats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP: You drive me nuts. You made up those numbers. There is no reason to do that, except to have fun at the expense of the ignorant masses. Your sentiment is correct: there is more than enough IB students to fill Hardy to the gills.

By the way, has everyone seen this map? http://www.21csf.org/csf-home/DocUploads/DataShop/DS_16.pdf

It shows Hardy enrollment in 2005-2006. There were 405 students. 94 came from ward 3 (so in-bounds) and another 26 from ward 2 (mostly all in-bounds). So, we're talking about 33% in-bounds during a time in which Deal was openly accepting all Mann students (and I presume other schools). This should shut up the folks saying the IB folks never supported the school.

It should also -- thank god -- shut up the fool driveling on and on about this being a bait-and-switch. The claim is that Hardy will just increase OOB enrollment as IB enrollment goes up. This begs two questions: why hasn't enrollment been raised already? Surely there are more kids starving for the 2nd best middle school in DC. And, why wasn't enrollment higher in the past so that more OOB students could be accommodated (since the higher IB numbers surely pushed them out)? As the enrollment is pretty much the same ten years later, it sure seems like the size of the school is roughly fixed.

Why made up? PP's numbers seem reasonable also to me:

Key: enrollment 380 - 3rd grade approx 75 kids
Mann: enrollment 287 - 3rd grade approx 50 kids
Stoddert: enrollment 381 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids
Hyde: enrollment 334 - 3rd grade approx 55 kids
Eaton: enrollment 470 - 3rd grade approx 80 kids

But aren't many 3rd graders at Hyde and Eaton OOB?

Roughly 60% + of John Eaton is OOB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
There aren't enough kids IB for Hardy to fill it. That's part of the problem.

We can fix that

DC Office of Planning

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There aren't enough kids IB for Hardy to fill it. That's part of the problem.

We can fix that

DC Office of Planning

Ha! All OP is interested in building is more condos for single professionals and childless-couples, not families. Their agenda is the "Clarendonization" of DC -- ten storeis of hipster flats on top of a Five Guys and a wine bar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There aren't enough kids IB for Hardy to fill it. That's part of the problem.

We can fix that

DC Office of Planning

Ha! All OP is interested in building is more condos for single professionals and childless-couples, not families. Their agenda is the "Clarendonization" of DC -- ten storeis of hipster flats on top of a Five Guys and a wine bar.

Right, see what they have done of 14th ave NW.. Used to be a nice street to walk, now it could be Clarendon, Ballston, or anywhere else in the US. Ugly. Senseless.