Is this a valid definition of safety, target, and reach?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just to spite this board, I may stay for 3 months after move-in.

Um, wrong thread, maybe?

Yes. I realize that now. lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Either a podcast or one of SH's blogs had a definition that I am using with my junior: likely is where she is above the stats on an admitted student profile, target is where she is at the admitted student profile, and reach is where she is at the profile but the acceptance rates are below 20%. Time will tell if it is accurate. I may be helping her aim too low, but she is looking at a competitive major (engineering) and from a school where every other student applies to an ivy or similar, so she may not stand out.

that's a fair definition but the best definition comes from the high school using the individual HS data. SH and others have to generalize. You can do better asking the HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I would agree that individual stats are an important consideration, but disagree that acceptance rate should not also be considered.

Schools with acceptance rates under 20% or so are reaches for all applicants. That means a good chunk of the top 50 are reaches for all applicants. There is too much uncertainty.

You cannot look at general acceptance rate. Have to look at the acceptance rate for your specific school.
If the acceptance rate for your specific school is 30%, it's a target regardless what the general acceptance rate it. The general acceptance rate could be as low as 10%, no matter, still a target.

This!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Either a podcast or one of SH's blogs had a definition that I am using with my junior: likely is where she is above the stats on an admitted student profile, target is where she is at the admitted student profile, and reach is where she is at the profile but the acceptance rates are below 20%. Time will tell if it is accurate. I may be helping her aim too low, but she is looking at a competitive major (engineering) and from a school where every other student applies to an ivy or similar, so she may not stand out.

that's a fair definition but the best definition comes from the high school using the individual HS data. SH and others have to generalize. You can do better asking the HS.

DP. Most high schools do not have enough applicants at top schools to provide useful data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Collegevine has something similar but it is kind of crazy. For example, Penn RD is a target for my rising senior, but we have categorized it as a reach (and a high reach at that!)

Yeah, college vine is over optimistic. It put Emory, USC, CMU, BC, BU in the target list. Says DC has 30% chances for Vandy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Collegevine has something similar but it is kind of crazy. For example, Penn RD is a target for my rising senior, but we have categorized it as a reach (and a high reach at that!)

Yeah, college vine is over optimistic. It put Emory, USC, CMU, BC, BU in the target list. Says DC has 30% chances for Vandy.

I found for my kid collegevine uses target really broadly. My kid has no safeties on their list according to collegevine. If I look at our school Naviance data every school she is applying to is called a safety. We are at a run of the mill good, but not TJ, public school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, MIT is a reach for everyone.

My super high stats kid thought their super high stats (like perfect SAT score and almost a 5.0 weighted) would help them get into MIT, CMU, GATech etc.. Nope.

Not really. If you won IMO gold, MIT is actually a target (not safety).

Yep. My kid was a 1600 SAT (one seating), maxed out GPA, valedictorian, private school in Texas. White, no hook, wealthy background, speaks 3 languages fluently. Was denied admission straight up to 5 of the 7 top 25 schools he applied to. 1 waitlist that never materialized.
So no, there are no targets in the Top25. He is going to the UK.

Another lesson: they don't want those vals plus high data to fill up their class. Sigh. -different poster

[Anonymous]

Everything is a reach, folks. Treat it like it is in this climate!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, MIT is a reach for everyone.

My super high stats kid thought their super high stats (like perfect SAT score and almost a 5.0 weighted) would help them get into MIT, CMU, GATech etc.. Nope.

Not really. If you won IMO gold, MIT is actually a target (not safety).

Please stop with this. And stop saying Emory or U Mich are safeties. Even if statements like this are true, which is highly debatable, they might apply to 100 kids across the country. The Top 25 national universities, and yes, even the top 15-20 LACs are crazy tough admits in RD. Kids get their feelings hurt all the time when a school they thought they were locks for gives them the Heisman in RD. All
these schools are building their classes at that point and your 1550/4.5 weighted is not nearly as charming as you think it is. Do yourself a favor and find 1 or 2 schools with a 30+% acceptance rate that your kid could live with for targets. Lehigh or William and Mary, for example. (Nova people don’t kill me.) Same for a true, almost open enrollment school for a real safety. Indiana, for example has a super high acceptance rate but people love it and it has many respected programs. Build your list properly and then do all the prestige hunting you desire. It needn’t cost a ton more in app fees.

Yet there are students who may not be IMO Gold and thus (i agree with PP) MIT is a target, but have all the other top stats plus awards/recognition that are not quite IMO Gold level but are impressive, with "top few in career" level recs who get into multiple T10s unhooked in RD. There are more than 100 kids like this. They do exist even if you have not met one. Emory and Umich are indeed >75% admission and "backup" schools in RD for these students.

OK, I guess I’m a peasant and not running in the proper circles where kids are being tiger mommed so hard that their credentials are such that MIT is a target for them. Good for them. Please share with us how their experience is relevant to a wider audience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, MIT is a reach for everyone.

My super high stats kid thought their super high stats (like perfect SAT score and almost a 5.0 weighted) would help them get into MIT, CMU, GATech etc.. Nope.

Not really. If you won IMO gold, MIT is actually a target (not safety).

Please stop with this. And stop saying Emory or U Mich are safeties. Even if statements like this are true, which is highly debatable, they might apply to 100 kids across the country. The Top 25 national universities, and yes, even the top 15-20 LACs are crazy tough admits in RD. Kids get their feelings hurt all the time when a school they thought they were locks for gives them the Heisman in RD. All
these schools are building their classes at that point and your 1550/4.5 weighted is not nearly as charming as you think it is. Do yourself a favor and find 1 or 2 schools with a 30+% acceptance rate that your kid could live with for targets. Lehigh or William and Mary, for example. (Nova people don’t kill me.) Same for a true, almost open enrollment school for a real safety. Indiana, for example has a super high acceptance rate but people love it and it has many respected programs. Build your list properly and then do all the prestige hunting you desire. It needn’t cost a ton more in app fees.

Yet there are students who may not be IMO Gold and thus (i agree with PP) MIT is a target, but have all the other top stats plus awards/recognition that are not quite IMO Gold level but are impressive, with "top few in career" level recs who get into multiple T10s unhooked in RD. There are more than 100 kids like this. They do exist even if you have not met one. Emory and Umich are indeed >75% admission and "backup" schools in RD for these students.

OK, I guess I’m a peasant and not running in the proper circles where kids are being tiger mommed so hard that their credentials are such that MIT is a target for them. Good for them. Please share with us how their experience is relevant to a wider audience.

talentless and mediocre are better words to describe your kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. I would agree that individual stats are an important consideration, but disagree that acceptance rate should not also be considered.

Schools with acceptance rates under 20% or so are reaches for all applicants. That means a good chunk of the top 50 are reaches for all applicants. There is too much uncertainty.

You cannot look at general acceptance rate. Have to look at the acceptance rate for your specific school.
If the acceptance rate for your specific school is 30%, it's a target regardless what the general acceptance rate it. The general acceptance rate could be as low as 10%, no matter, still a target.

This!

+2 We are relying on SCOIR scattergrams from my DC’s private school to categorize the schools on his list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We’re working with a college counseling service that doesn’t even list T25 schools among reaches. No matter what stats you have, they consider your chances of being admitted so low that they’re not going to recommend applying. They don’t discourage you from doing so; they just aren’t going to suggest those specific schools to anyone.

Safeties are schools where your stats are better than at least 75% of admitted students. Targets are schools where your stats are better than at least 50% of admitted students. Everything else is considered a reach.

100%

+1 I saw 3.7-3.8 UW, TO students say Emory was a target.... Emory?! I think deep down they know they're bullshitting themselves, but delusion keeps their confidence.

[Anonymous]

I read the following criteria and it seems to fit where my kids school counselor sorted the schools they are interested in:

High reach: all of the T30

Reach: <10% admit rate and stats (grades, sat/act) above median range

Target: 10%-40%admit rate and stats above median range

Likely: over 40% admit rate and stats above median

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I read the following criteria and it seems to fit where my kids school counselor sorted the schools they are interested in:

High reach: all of the T30

Reach: <10% admit rate and stats (grades, sat/act) above median range

Target: 10%-40%admit rate and stats above median range

Likely: over 40% admit rate and stats above median

We really need to use the word "unlikely" for the top schools. The odds are against you no matter how great your application is. Calling it a "high reach" is misleading.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, MIT is a reach for everyone.

My super high stats kid thought their super high stats (like perfect SAT score and almost a 5.0 weighted) would help them get into MIT, CMU, GATech etc.. Nope.

Not really. If you won IMO gold, MIT is actually a target (not safety).

Yep. My kid was a 1600 SAT (one seating), maxed out GPA, valedictorian, private school in Texas. White, no hook, wealthy background, speaks 3 languages fluently. Was denied admission straight up to 5 of the 7 top 25 schools he applied to. 1 waitlist that never materialized.
So no, there are no targets in the Top25. He is going to the UK.

UK?

Don't knock it. One of the smartest kids in my law school class went to UK.