Low MAP reading score of a bookworm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So it seems like people are generally in agreement here that 42 percentile is concerning?

Yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bookworm DD8 started the year scoring 85 percentile on Fall MAP and over the year (3 more MAP tests) dropped steadily down until scoring 42 percentile on the last Spring MAP. Is this concerning or normal? She reports nothing unusual about the testing days, sleeps well, no other changes.

School uses a reading curriculum I despise, but I taught phonics at home and she reads chapter books that are above grade level. She reads a lot! They don’t teach spelling at school, but I assume this has nothing to do with the test score, right?

Sounds like she needs extra reading help/intervention.

We had her do an informal screening last year with a reading specialist. I did this because I learned in kindergarten about the three cueing taught at school and wanted to know if she needed professional help. The reading specialist (not affiliated with school) said there’s no reason to tutor at all and she is above grade level. There doesn’t seem to be an issue with actual reading. That was last year.

[Anonymous]

The teacher and curriculum sound terrible, OP. What sort of standardized testing score does this school have? What's their reputation like?

You might have to switch schools, and in the meantime, get your kid some reading comprehension workbooks over the summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am going to make a suggestion since your child is 8. My oldest kid was an early reader who tore through books! He still loves to read (he is now 18). In 1st grade, his lovely teacher mentioned that although he had a great vocabulary and was a greater reader, she thought that he was memorizing the words and not really taking the time to understand the context of the books he was reading. In order to combat this, we checked out a bunch of chapter books that our public library identified as being perfect for this grade level (he was reading books that were just too advanced for him too truly understand) and we started a book club. He would read a chapter or two (or three) on his own and then I would read the same chapters and we would discuss them. This really slowed him down and he started to pay a lot more attention to figuring out what was happening in the story. If, when we discussed the book, he did not connect to a point that I made, we would go back and reread that section together. We also spent some time reading the books aloud to each other. Honestly, it was a lovely time to spend together. It took some time (all summer), but his reading comprehension greatly improved and he was able to move forward reading more difficult books and understanding them. We also got him a dictionary (an actual book one...not access to an online one) and I told him to keep it next to him when he was reading. If he was unsure of a word, to look it up! He didn't really need to do this with the easier books, but for years later, I would catch him doing this with more complicated books. Also, I brought this up directly with him and got him onboard with the process. If you can spend the time this summer to work with your child (it can be in the evening), it can pay dividends in the long run! Also, we continued to do this off and on for years, even when he no longer needed my help. I think that he enjoyed the one on one time. Best wishes!

That’s such a lovely thing you did for your son. I bet the book club is a cherished memory for both of you

[Anonymous]

tbh map scores are horrendously designed. kids with college reading levels or lexile level 1600 are getting scores below the target becaus it gives you a mysterious final score that is spposedly applicable to all 3 categories which all have different targets. dcps ela curriculum is atrocious, just keep your kid reading and dont worry about mathematically flawed tests that target bland, niche skills and require students to be taught about "specifically how to do this question" as opposed to using nuance and inferences, something bookworms are better at. you do good on map if you follow instructions and think like a machine. you do bad if either: you have poor reading skills or grew up reading actual books rather than pathetic passeseges designed for a soceity full of developed adhd and low standards.
at least, as a 7th grader who has 1600 lexile but does poorly on map, thats my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you ask the teacher, they can share a detailed breakdown that shows what areas she's struggling in and what areas she's getting right.

What does this mean, what kind of specifics are given? The score sheet I was given does great down the lexile range and gives individual scores for categories like “informational text.”

The school year is over so I hesitate to contact the teacher if the info won’t be useful.

This is a stupid response. If you want to know why she's doing poorly on the test, ask for the score breakdown. Don't just ask random strangers on the Internet to guess.

The score breakdown will go through each subject area and flag her weakest skills as needing further development.

there is no score breakdown. its a mathematically flawed system idesigned by a team of idiots. you get one mysterious numeric score, and different target numbers for different categories. for instance if i get a 242, then i am above grade level for category a, which has a target score of 235, but below grade level for b and c, which have goals of,say, 243 and 247. the problem is the averages. lets say i got 235, 243, and 247 respectlvely, putting me right on grade level for every category. however, when averaged out_ i get a 242, putting me way above grade level for cat a, but below for b and c. this is a deeply flawed system that attempts to measure the performance of students using niche questions and seemingly arbitrary scores and score goals. i say this as a 7th grade kid who takes geometry and has a college level reading level or a lexile of 1650.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What do students do after the test is over? My kid's scores were always highest in the fall. Once he saw that his teacher allowed students to play games on the computer when they finished the test, he flew through it to get to the games. Computer based testing on little kids is BS IMO.

teachers do this so kids get lower scores in the fall, so it seems like they improved more. its not immoral, just part of the job. encourage them to rush and say they can play games upon completion in fall. tell them to take their time and that they can sit ghere quietly while the rest of the class finished in spring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do students do after the test is over? My kid's scores were always highest in the fall. Once he saw that his teacher allowed students to play games on the computer when they finished the test, he flew through it to get to the games. Computer based testing on little kids is BS IMO.

teachers do this so kids get lower scores in the fall, so it seems like they improved more. its not immoral, just part of the job. encourage them to rush and say they can play games upon completion in fall. tell them to take their time and that they can sit ghere quietly while the rest of the class finished in spring.

So a low spring score is even worse then… and drop from fall to spring is worse than just a flat low score all year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I’d switch schools. This is a teaching/curriculum problem. If she scored 85th percentile in the fall it is unlikely she has a disability or doesn’t know how to test- she has proved fully capable of learning and testing. She is now in the 45th percentile with steady decrease- she is not learning in school and is actively losing knowledge.

You don’t know stop projecting

[Anonymous]

Until 3rd grade the MAP is administered by some of the questions being read out loud to kids on the computer. That could be an issue as well. I found my bookworm kid was breezing through the tests in 2nd and 3rd and not actually paying attention to what was asked. I'd work on that as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, I’d switch schools. This is a teaching/curriculum problem. If she scored 85th percentile in the fall it is unlikely she has a disability or doesn’t know how to test- she has proved fully capable of learning and testing. She is now in the 45th percentile with steady decrease- she is not learning in school and is actively losing knowledge.

You don’t know stop projecting

How else can you explain a high fall score, with zero learning issues thus far and normal testing and teaching reports from k-1 with second grade teacher saying “she’s fine.” There is no other explanation that makes more sense than she is not learning new material at school and actively losing knowledge she did know, likely due to lack of using it/reinforcement

[Anonymous]

OP, I had this happen with my child in a mediocre public school. Fall test scores were always high, then they would steadily drop throughout yr, lowest being spring. They were high in the fall because I worked with her over the summer, daily. They would learn more over 10 weeks of summer than they would all year in school. It became apparent they were doing a whole lot of nothing in school. I got fed up and pulled her after second grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The teacher and curriculum sound terrible, OP. What sort of standardized testing score does this school have? What's their reputation like?

You might have to switch schools, and in the meantime, get your kid some reading comprehension workbooks over the summer.

By all accounts and measures, the school is supposed to be great. 10/10 GS, top 100 elementary in the state, wealthy district, math and reading test results are always 68-80% on grade level or higher. Very few economically disadvantaged kids, virtually 0% ELL.

Thinking about it more… I guess compared to a school with a similar passage rate but more ELL and more FARMS kids, you could say the other school is better, since you’d expect some of the failing scores would be in Reading ELL and kids in wealthy areas like ours usually have parents pushing kids enough to pass.

Or did DD just get a bad teacher? Can a mediocre teacher one year lead to this much of a drop with no other red flags?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I had this happen with my child in a mediocre public school. Fall test scores were always high, then they would steadily drop throughout yr, lowest being spring. They were high in the fall because I worked with her over the summer, daily. They would learn more over 10 weeks of summer than they would all year in school. It became apparent they were doing a whole lot of nothing in school. I got fed up and pulled her after second grade.

How do you know a school is mediocre? This is supposed to be a great elementary school. I wasn’t expecting to have to cobble together a full literacy curriculum at home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I had this happen with my child in a mediocre public school. Fall test scores were always high, then they would steadily drop throughout yr, lowest being spring. They were high in the fall because I worked with her over the summer, daily. They would learn more over 10 weeks of summer than they would all year in school. It became apparent they were doing a whole lot of nothing in school. I got fed up and pulled her after second grade.

How do you know a school is mediocre? This is supposed to be a great elementary school. I wasn’t expecting to have to cobble together a full literacy curriculum at home.

All public schools are mediocre. Their curriculum and standards are dictated by the state, not the teachers. They are teaching grade level material at most- or lower, and often don’t even get through an entire years curriculum. The only reason some public schools appear better is wealth: better class parties, newer materials, cool assemblies and field trips. The test scores are better because parents supplement at home either formally or through lived exposure and/or the child has a natural high aptitude and seeks out learning on their own. But the actual teaching or curriculum isn’t any better than any other public school